My friend Oakley Roberts (from Payson Utah, RM from Liberia Africa) joins us to share his story. Oakley talks about knowing he was different since age 12, his high school life (including his mantra “if they wanted to be in my life, they were welcome”) and coming out a bisexual over the phone to his sister while on his mission (later coming out as gay to his mother). Oakley talks about the curse/punishment he felt from God for being gay—and the pain/shame of that initial conclusion. Oakley talks about reaching out to people for help and how coming out and being authentic improved his feelings about himself. Oakley talks about the powerful spiritual experience in the canyon east of Cedar City while in college with the personal revelation that Oakley’s sexual orientation (like all of Oakley’s attributes) are divine in nature and Oakley is created as intended—a 180 degree shift from this earlier feelings about being cursed. Oakley talks about his visit with his Bishop (super helpful) and his supportive mother (“I trust you Oakley” and “whoever you bring home, I will accept them”). I am so impressed with Oakley—his spiritual maturity, his emotionally resilience, and his deep acceptance of who he is—all at age 21. You have a great life ahead of you Oakley and you will continue to give hope to others and help them feel God’s love. Honored to have you on the podcast. You are a good man. Links: Gather/Lift and Love: www.liftandlove.org/ FB group to support LGBTQ Latter-day Saints: www.facebook.com/groups/1433556613672143 Oakley’s Instagram: @_oakleyroberts

*** This episode talks about suicide. If you are suicidal, please call/text/chat *988 *** My friend Kyle Dunshee (age 30, married father with new baby, suicide survivor) joins us to share his journey with mental health. Kyle starts with his journey with severe OCD/anxiety which led to a suicide attempt at age 10. Kyle talks about his great parents getting him help—including being institutionalized (helpful experience). Kyle also talks about self-harm and gives insights on why people engage in this behavior and how it is able to put this behind him. Kyle talks a Book of Mormon scripture story that gave him hope and his decision to serve a mission—but the painful/angry experience when he was denied this opportunity. Kyle talks about his pain, anger at the institutional Church, and the deeply spiritual experience in an empty movie theatre watching an R rated movie—a powerful experience where he felt the love of God and a desire to become more active in the Church. Kyle talks about why he decided to resubmit his mission papers and his call to serve in Portland Oregon. Kyle talks about how his mental health is on ongoing part of his life—and why it is (at times) a beautiful struggle. Kyle’s story is in his new book called “At the Bottom of Bountiful” (see show notes). I was so impressed with Kyle’s courage and vulnerability to share his story. It is a powerful story that helps others walking a similar road with mental health issues and those with difficult church experiences who want to stay in the church. I encourage everyone to listen to Kyle’s podcast and read his book so we have more insights to help ourselves and our friends/family working with mental health issues. You are a good man, Kyle. Honored to have you on the podcast. Links: Kyle’s book on Amazon: www.amazon.com/dp/B0DQ8Z9RHH Grandpa Thomas Rogers Obituary: www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/deseretnews/name/thomas-rogers-obituary?id=55427103 Kyra Dunshee Podcast: soundcloud.com/user-818501778/episode-293-krista-mortensen-and-kyra-dunshee-sisters-when-your-child-leaves-the-church

My friend long-time friend Dusty Bee (late 30s, RM, father of two sons/divorced, was in a same-sex marriage/excommunicated/now divorced, DJ/business owner, lives in Idaho) joins us to share his unique and powerful story. Dusty talks about knowing he was gay/different around 10, serving a mission (asking God to make him straight), marrying a women (while closeted), marrying to a man (married about 6 years—a marriage Dusty doesn’t regret and into a family he loves), being excommunicated (very painful experience), and then his decision (with a powerful spiritual experience on the Rome temple grounds) to get rebaptized (working with the same Stake President and their reconciliation after the difficult excommunication). Yes, Dusty is still gay—and talks about how he accepts/love himself, why he believes in the Church, how we can better support LGBTQ members, and the character of our Heavenly Parents—including Their deep love for ALL Their children. Dusty is not asking couples in same-sex marriages to follow his path—but rather the importance of helping LGBTQ members to write their own story (without agenda) and walking with them—leaving all judgement to our Savior. Dusty is one of the finest people I know. He has done a great job walking a nearly impossible road and his story helps other queer Latter-day Saints to find hope/perspective in their future—and parents/allies/local church leaders looking for insights on how to better love, understand, and support. I’m honored to have Dusty on the podcast. I encourage everyone to listen to and share his story and we work to expand the borders of Zion so more feel welcome and a deep feeling of belonging—as I believe we are a better people with our LGBTQ members with us. Links: Facebook Group to Support LGBTQ Latter-day Saints: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1433556613672143

Episode 797: Dr. Daniel Parkinson, Mentor to LDS Parents with LGBTQ Kids, New Book by Richard Ostler

My friend Nathan Kitchen (father of five, RM, dentist, mid-50s, in a same-sex marriage, author, powerful/thoughtful/mature voice in the queer LDS space) joins us to share some of this story and talk about his new book called “The Boughs of Love: Navigating the Queer Latter-day Saint Experience During an Ongoing Restoration.” Nathan talks about some of his personal story (including following church leader counsel as a gay Latter-day Saint young man to marry a woman) and how that marriage eventually ended. Nathan—who holds a deep belief in our Heavenly Parents—talks about scripture stories and gospel principles he used to navigate his life and how those apply to helping younger queer Latter-day Saints write their own story from a queer centric/Christ centered perspective. Nathan talks about why he wrote the book (“to cast hope”) to help queer Latter-day Saints and allies. Nathan also talks about the role of Affirmation and its worldwide efforts to help queer Latter-day Saints find their joy in the places that feel safe and healthy for them. Nathan also addresses other topics like the 2019 reversal of the November 2015 policy statements, cautions about gaslighting, how to heal/move on from pain/anger towards the Church, and offers advice for new allies. Thank you, Nathan, for being on the podcast and for your mature/thoughtful voice. I continue to learn from you. Thanks for all you are doing to bring us together as a part of the same human family. Nathan’s book at Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1961471159 Nathan’s book a BCC Press in their catalogue section: https://www.bccpress.org Affirmation: affirmation.org

My friend Tyler Bastian joins us to talk about Roots High School (located on a 5-acre farm)—a charter school for students who need a different experience—and may have fallen through the cracks. Tyler talks about why he started the school in 2015, its focus, their mission statement around “we love you”, and what they are doing in a unique and powerful way to help each student feel purpose and belonging. Tyler also talks about the role of farm animals in the education process, how it helps individual students, and how the farm environment brings down potential barriers between groups. Tyler also talks about we love others “not by words—but how we treat them”. Tyler also shares career advice for those who may not feel comfortable in a more traditional career path—by sharing his own story find his way to start a chapter school. Thank you, Tyler, for being on the podcast and all you are doing to give student more hope, purpose, and a feeling of belonging. I’m grateful for your work—and everyone at Roots High School—and honored to have you on the podcast. Root High School: https://www.rootshigh.org/ "Everything is Incredible" https://youtu.be/oqZ56-RMbNc?si=lkoMVhvGYvMbN29L "When I Need a Friend" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgkE23j_8Ss

My friend Emma Westwood (married mother of 5, nurse at Primary Children's Hospital, Latter-day Saint) joins us to talk about her gay little brother Collin Russell who died of an accidental overdose at the age of 23 in 2018. Emma talks about Collin coming out to her while a junior in high school and the difficult road he faced full of shame—which led to addictions to cope with the pain/shame—which led to his death by an accidental overdose on December 26th, 2018. Emma talks about her immensely gifted brother—full of light and hope—but how the shame/self-loathing of his sexual orientation dimmed his feelings about himself/his future. Emma talks about the decision that she and her husband Isaac made to name the Encircle Home in Heber City after Collin—now called The Collin Russell Home—and the positive role of Encircle to provide hope, connection, and a safe place for LGBTQ+ youth. And a wish that Collin has something like Encircle in his life. Emma (and her mother Laurie in an Instagram message) talk about the importance of helping our LGBTQ friends to have no shame for their sexual orientation and/or gender identity and how we should view every child of Heavenly Parents created as intended, with great worth, and needed members of society. Thank you, Emma, for being on the podcast and continuing to honor the good name and memory of your brother Collin. I am so sorry he is gone. I hope your story helps LGBTQ+ youth have more hope in their future and helps the rest of us to a better job of loving and supporting. Links: Emma’s Encircle Tribute to Collin: encircletogether.org/heber/collin-russell Collin Russell Encircle Tribute Video: www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMi1VwVHLdo Encircle: encircletogether.org/ Collin's Obituary: www.serenityfhs.com/obituaries/Collin-Russell-2/#!/Obituary Emma Westwood on Instagram: @emmathejoy

**This episode talks about suicide. If you are suicidal, please call/text/chat 988** My friend Chloe Siegfried (she/her, gay, age 27, Salt Lake City native, deep belief in God/prayer) joins us to share her story of growing up LDS, coming out as gay, and then turning to alcohol and being in unhealthy relationships—partly to deal with her pain. Chloe talks about multiple suicide attempts, inpatient stays, and dark days. Chloe talks about prayer—one of the constants in her life and how she was finally able to stay sober on January 1st, 2023. It is a beautiful story of courage, prayer, family support and learning self-love. Chloe also talks about finding Ashlon and the beauty and health of that relationship and decided to get marriage in October of 2024. Chloe talks about her family support-including her younger brother Cole (the first person she came out to) officiating at the wedding. Chloe talks about her current work in a recover center helping others. Chloe is doing the podcast to talk to her younger self—and anyone else who is considering suicide who is full of pain, unable to love themselves and/or seeing no light at the end of the tunnel. Chloe is able to authentically say “it does get better”. In join with Chloe and plead with you to stay. If you are in a tough place or looking for a story to help others, please listen to Chloe’s story and share with others. Thank you for being on the podcast Chloe. You are a remarkable and brave woman. Honored to have you on the podcast. Links: Chloe’s Instagram: @chlo.siegfried Picture mentioned in the podcast of man considering jumping: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ts7u8ilxoh2f6kyhiw6h9/Man-Considering-Jumping.jpg?rlkey=uijx4mlrqz8oe0m9re5w39z66&dl=0

Our son Jake Ostler (Undergraduate Degree in Psychology, Master’s Degree in Social Work, Certificate in anti-human trafficking, LCSW, working with sexual violence survivors in over 10 different countries since 2016) joins us to talk about his new non-profit called International Protection Alliance (protectall.org/). Jacob also serves on the Board of the Utah Social Work Association. Jake, who is looking for donations and supporters for his new non-profit, talks about why he co-founded it, its mission (to stop online sexual exploitation and support survivors), and how you can help. Jake also talks about the myths and facts of sex trafficking and what parents can do to better help their kids to be safe. While you can’t donate to our podcast, I am inviting you to listen to this podcast and consider donating to Jake’s non-profit International Protection Alliance. I deeply believe in the work Jake is doing and his skills (clinical, organizational, financial) to run an effective non-profit with a mission to combat online sexual exploitation and help survivors heal—something that is so needed in our world. Thank you, Jake, for being on the podcast. Your parents deeply believe in you and the work you are doing. Honored that more can hear of your efforts. Jake welcomes any ideas for how you'd like to support the mission. Please reach out if you have ideas or want to be updated as they continue working and growing Links: Jake’s e-mail: [email protected] International Protection Alliance web stie: protectall.org International Protection Alliance Instagram: @intl.protect.all Facebook: www.facebook.com/ipa.protectall Jake’s Utah Clinical Practice: healingandhopeutah.com Jake’s LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/jacob-ostler-492716116

My friend Oliver Black (RM, UVU student, grew up in Utah County) joins us to share his story with gender dysphoria and how we can help trans/non-binary Latter-day Saints feel more welcome. Oliver delayed his transition so he could serve a mission (Montana—great experience—wanted to serve to help others), but has now been fully transitioned for over three years. He talks about the positive experiences in his mission and the role of spiritual promptings when coming out while in the field. Oliver then talks about the love/support he's received from his parents and local wards—and the spiritual peace he feels. He also discusses the difficult road transgender Latter-day Saints walk and what we can do to better support them. In this regard, Oliver has written “7 Ways Local Church Leaders Can Make Church Safe for Transgender Members” (link in show notes). This labor of love suggests ways (given the new handbook changes in Aug 2024) to help transgender members feel more safe, accepted, loved, and needed. He answers tender questions I felt impressed to ask him, giving answers that were deeply insightful and moving. Thank you, Oliver, for being on the podcast and helping us better understand that our Heavenly Parents' love all Their children. You are a good man with immense emotional/spiritual/intellectual maturity—gifts that you are using to help us create Zion and bless others. Honored to have you on the podcast. Links: Oliver’s “7 Ways Local Church Leaders Can Make Church Safe for Transgender Members” document: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j2r794h1v7zoodghc9h8x/Supporting-Trans-Members-Oliver-Black-Nov-2024.pdf?rlkey=exlksuqeqbux4hxwk9xi1bgwx&dl=0 Oliver’s editing website/writing portfolio: https://oliveraeblack.wixsite.com/about

My friend and mentor Pastor Stan Mitchell (familiar with and friend to Latter-day Saints) joins us to share his story of his changed heart/perspective about LGBTQ people that occurred during his ministry at Grace Point Church in Nashville. Stan (who attended Latter-day Saint services as a youth causing him to reframe his view of Jesus from vengeful to loving) talks about teachings of Jesus to love/support/accept LGBTQ folks—accept/validate their pain—and be open to what we can do better to support these good folks. Stan talks about his work with Christian parents who deeply love their queer kids, their Christian beliefs, and want what is best for their kids. He offers suggestions on how to navigate this road. Stan also talks directly to our queer friends to help them feel more love, acceptance, and hope for their future—and a plea for those considering suicide to stay. Stan brings his strong theological insights, soft heart, and 1000’s of visits with people walking this road to help others. Thank you, Stan, for your work in many faith traditions to help us better love and support our queer friends. You work has helped me. Thank you for being on the podcast. Links: Stan Mitchell’s Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/stan.mitchell.58