In today’s episode, I’m joined by the remarkable Ryan George. Ryan is the author of the book, Hurt and Healed by the Church: Redemption and Reconstruction After Spiritual Abuse. 

He spent the first 20 years of his life in a cult, attending a series of independent fundamental Baptist (IFB) churches, including one where his dad was a pastor with ultimate authority. Later in life, Ryan was confronted with the devastating truth of his father's serial sexual abuse.

Despite the trauma he experienced, Ryan didn't abandon his faith. After leaving the spiritually abusive IFB movement, he embarked on a 25-year journey of reevaluation and reconstruction. Today, through his blog, books, interviews, and spiritual adventure company, Dude Group, Ryan offers hope for those navigating their own paths of healing. 

I do want to warn our listeners that this episode focuses on sensitive subjects like church hurt and sexual abuse. However, Ryan’s story is so powerful, and filled with hope, compassion, and healing. 

2:48 – Ryan 101

Oldest of six homeschooled children + a pastor’s son Husband and adoptive father Adventurer and blogger Author of 3 books

6:51 – The Path To Healing 

Discovering his father’s abuse Navigating the aftermath Sharing his story to help others

18:16 – Jesus’ Model Of Justice

Jesus as a model for handling anger and betrayal Pursuing justice with compassion Seeking Heaven on Earth

33:31 – Finding The Real Jesus 

What identifies a cult from a healthy church environment  Ryan’s experience with IFB churches Seeking out the authentic Jesus  Recognizing that churches have both moments of beauty and moments of failure

54:54 – Takeaways

Being the person that confesses first Podcast recording stories Connecting with Ryan

FEATURED QUOTES

"Wounds from relationships are only healed in relationships... And I think that wounds from the church can only be healed not necessarily in a church building, but by people who also love Jesus."   “Give people the gift of going second... You have to start with yourself, or it can spin in some very horrible places. You become a bomb thrower…. I want to be the person that confesses first, so that people go, ‘Oh, that’s the real thing.’”

Learn more about Ryan:

Instagram:

https://www.booksbyryan.com/

Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/ryan.george

Ryan’s Website

https://www.booksbyryan.com/

Check out Ryan’s books:

https://www.booksbyryan.com/books/

Explorience:

https://explorience.org/about/

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com  http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly http://instagram.com/canilaughpod http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly http://facebook.com/canilaughpod http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

GET YOUR COPY of ‘IF I DON’T LAUGH, I’LL CRY” TODAY: Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn  Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG  ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb  Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2 Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib Audible: https://amzn.to/3ITcdm8  Kindle: https://amzn.to/3ITaSvv 

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

Melissa Kruger serves as the Vice President of Discipleship Programming at The Gospel Coalition. As an author and Bible teacher, she regularly teaches women in her community and speaks at conferences around the country.

I’m so excited to have her on the show today to talk about her latest book, Parenting with Hope: Raising Teens For Christ in a Secular Age, and dive into the ins and outs of raising teenagers. We talk about transitioning with your children as they grow, modeling a life of faith, creating a prayerful home, and so much more.

In a culture that often implies that the teenage years are miserable and difficult, Melissa encourages parents to not overlook the beauty and joy in this chapter. Whether you're a parent, teacher, or simply someone who influences young lives, this conversation is SO important, and I can’t wait for you to hear it!

2:00 – Melissa 101

• Vice President of the Gospel Coalition
• Mother of 3 and wife
• Former math teacher
• An unexpected path to writing 16 books

6:42 – Changing The Parenting Narrative

• The negative narrative surrounding parenting teenagers and tweens
• Understanding the development stages of this time period
• Being gracious and patient with teenagers + adapting your parenting style

14:21 – The Gracious Home Vs. The Permissive Home

• Setting boundaries and allowing for mistakes
• A lack of structure leading to negative outcomes
• Setting boundaries as a parent
• Allowing children to face consequences in a safe and supportive environment

21:25 – Parenting Through Different Stages

• Transitioning parenting styles from one stage to the next
• Recognizing children as independent human beings
• Walking alongside your children as they make their own decisions
• Avoiding placing your identity in your children’s actions or behaviors

33:03 – Modeling Faith

• Being gracious with failure as a parent
• Setting the example by walking with God
• Incorporating prayer into everyday life as a family
• Connecting with Melissa

FEATURED QUOTES

“I think growing up with our teen in some ways, is remaining curious about who they are and not making assumptions about why they're pushing back on something.”

“I think it's really tempting as a parent sometimes to place a lot of our identity and in our teen…we start trying to control who they become, rather than walk alongside them as they're becoming who God made them to be.”

“Learning how to make a mistake is actually a life lesson.”

“I always say aim for patterns, not perfection.”

Learn more about Melissa:

https://melissabkruger.com/

Get your copy of Parenting with Hope

https://www.amazon.com/Parenting-Hope-Raising-Christ-Secular-ebook/dp/B0CFTGDKJ1

The Gospel Coalition

https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

GET YOUR COPY of ‘IF I DON’T LAUGH, I’LL CRY” TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

Audible: https://amzn.to/3ITcdm8

Kindle: https://amzn.to/3ITaSvv

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

My guest this week is the lovely Myquillyn Smith, also known as The Nester. She is a New York Times and Wall Street Journal best-selling author of Welcome Home and Cozy Minimalist Home. For over a decade, she has been encouraging women to embrace imperfections and live boldly in their spaces through her blog.

Myquillyn’s home in North Carolina has been featured in publications such as Better Homes and Gardens, Ladies Home Journal, Cottages and Bungalows, and more. As a practicing imperfectionist, she believes in the power of small changes, putting nail holes in the wall, and taking the time to make a place feel like home – even if you’re renting.

I thoroughly enjoyed getting to know her, hearing her perspective on creating a space you’ll love, and learning more about her latest book, House Rules, which is set to release on April 23rd. I just know you’re going to love her too!

3:07 – Myquillyn 101

• Starting “The Nester” in 2007
• Learning to build a home by moving frequently
• Teaching universal decorating truths

9:55 – Making a Home

• The perfectly staged homes seen on social media
• Embracing imperfection in home decor
• Making your space feel like you

17:45 – Establishing Roots Where You Are

• Taking ownership of your space, even in rentals or temporary spaces
• The perfect circumstance will never come
• The power of simple changes in home design

29:06 – Design Insights

• The genesis of Myquillyn’s passion for decorating
• Understanding design principles like scale, contrast, and lighting
• The Inspiration behind Myquillyn’s book, House Rules

38:39 – Embracing Imperfection

• Being a practicing imperfectionist
• Learning to take risks in home decor and life
• You can’t ruin something you already hate
• Connecting with Myquillyn + pre-ordering House Rules

FEATURED QUOTES

“I’ve never met a home I haven’t loved. I believe every home has a silver lining.”

“I 100% believe it doesn’t have to be perfect to be beautiful.”

“Where else can we take a risk if not at home?”

Learn more about Myquillyn:

Pre-order House Rules:

https://www.amazon.com/House-Rules-Decorate-Every-Budget/dp/0800744748

The Nester

https://thenester.com/

The Nester podcast

https://thenester.com/podcast/

Myquillyn on Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/thenester/?hl=en

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

GET YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

Audible: https://amzn.to/3ITcdm8

Kindle: https://amzn.to/3ITaSvv

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

My guest this week is the incredible Mattie Jackson Smith. Mattie is an author, podcaster, and speaker whose life took an unexpected turn when she tragically lost her 28-year-old husband to a traumatic brain injury just weeks before their first anniversary.

Her first book, Lemons on Friday, offers a raw and honest account of her journey through grief, providing solace and guidance to others navigating the lonely and difficult path of widowhood. Outside of her writing career, Mattie is the host of the podcast In Joy Life, where she encourages her listeners to choose joy in any season or circumstance.

We dive deep into Mattie’s story today as she transparently shares what it looked like to wrestle with God in life’s darkest moments, ask hard questions, and bring her hurt and doubts to Jesus. She has so many powerful things to say about finding God in the questions and navigating life after loss. I absolutely loved getting to spend time with her in this episode and know you will too!

2:21 – Mattie 101

• Born and raised in Nashville in a country music family
• A passion for creative writing
• Owning a wine bar in Nashville
• Losing her husband after a brain injury
• Mattie’s memoir, Lemons on Friday

14:04 – Honesty in Grief

• Sitting in anger with God
• Biblical examples of emotions and suffering
• Embracing your emotions instead of suppressing them

24:45 – Finding God in the Questions

• Lamentations 3
• How writing helped Mattie begin to heal
• God's invitation to bring our questions, doubts, and struggles to Him

36:09 – Navigating New Beginnings

• The secondary losses that come with grief
• Redemption is not a replacement
• Navigating dating after experiencing loss
• Honoring the past while embracing the future
• Connecting with Mattie

FEATURED QUOTES

“I lived my life and the worst thing I could have imagined happened. And through that God not only has worked miracles in me through the grief and healing process, but he fulfilled this desire that he planted in my heart at 19.”

“God not only can handle it but invites me to bring it to Him.”

“What I hope people see from my life is you do have agency to choose joy, even in the worst of the worst of it.”

Learn more about Mattie:

Get your copy of Lemons on Friday

https://www.amazon.com/Lemons-Friday-Trusting-Greatest-Heartbreak/dp/0785241272

In Joy Life podcast

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/in-joy-life-with-mattie-jackson/id1667357187

Mattie on Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/mattiejackson/?hl=en

Mattie on Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/mattiejacksonofficial/

Join me in this week's episode as I sit down with my dear friend and extraordinary human being, Kim Butler. Kim is the lead coach and founder of The Whiteboard Room, where she empowers creatives, leaders, and companies to unlock their true potential through one-on-one coaching, workshops, and speaking engagements.

With a heart fueled by faith, family, and a passion for adventure (and a Diet Dr. Pepper), Kim's coaching journey has touched countless lives, including my own. I’m thrilled to have her on the show to share more about her story, her mentoring process and what it looks like to set personal and professional goals and walk them out in faith. 

3:53 – Kim 101

• Kim’s job at The Whiteboard Room
• Kim’s passion for helping people overcome obstacles and set goals
• Merging coaching and consulting
• The power of goal setting

8:25 – Following God’s Call

• Life lessons from a desk job
• Inspiring people to see the best in themselves
• Kim’s journey to the world race
• Sitting with God’s silence

16:32 – In The Waiting

• Sitting in the waiting
• Remaining faithful in God’s timing
• The careers that led Kim to where she is today

23:27 – The Creation of The Whiteboard Method

• How Kim created The Whiteboard Method
• What Kim’s mentor process looks like
• Working in alignment with your life

32:04 – A Work in Progress

• Real client stories
• Kim’s experience being Molly’s mentor
• The power of accountability
• Getting in touch with Kim

FEATURED QUOTES

“Goal setting became this like linchpin that I started to see, wow, there's so much power in this very simple thing. And nobody does it.”

“Your platform is not your purpose. It is just the place that you get to live out your purpose.”

“To know where you’re going and who you want to be, you have to know where you’ve been and who you are.”

Learn more about Kim and The Whiteboard Room:

https://www.thewhiteboardroom.com/

https://www.instagram.com/thewhiteboardroom/

https://www.facebook.com/THEWBROOM/

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com 

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

GET YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn 

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG 

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb 

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

Audible: https://amzn.to/3ITcdm8 

Kindle: https://amzn.to/3ITaSvv 

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

The day is FINALLY here! Yesterday marked the official launch of my book, which means you can now purchase If I Don’t Laugh I’ll Cry everywhere books are sold!

To make this moment even more special, I'm joined by the one and only John Stillman in today’s episode. Although he didn’t prepare his interview questions (but don’t you worry- he never fails to prepare a joke or two) we had a blast reminiscing about the journey of bringing this book to life.

From the initial days of the writing process to receiving my first-ever feedback from early readers, every step of this adventure has been nothing short of incredible.

I want to extend a heartfelt thank you to each and every one of you who has supported me on this journey. Whether you've preordered the book, left a review, or simply shared in the excitement, your support means the world to me.

If you’re planning to get your hands on a copy soon, I can’t wait for you to read it!

Until next time, happy listening + happy reading!

0:11 – Presidents, Past Boyfriends & The Making of a Memoir

• Selecting Millard Fillmore
• The boyfriend chapter
• The evolution of If I Don’t Laugh I’ll Cry

8:09 – … Now What?

• A second book?
• Anticipation of reader feedback
• The publishing process
• Molly’s favorite chapter

14:32 – Chapter By Chapter

• What it’s like to work with an editor
• Crafting an engaging narrative and chapter titles
• Where chapters of the book were written

21:07 – Completing the Book

• The book’s content and structure
• The hardest chapters in the book to write
• John’s dialogue in the book
• The Dark Knight + Googling “racketeering”

29:16 – Final Thoughts

• Positive feedback from male readers
• Designing the book cover
• Buying the book in person

FEATURED QUOTES

“The initial idea was really just to tell a debt story... I think as I began to work on the outline I realized that more of that backstory needed to be included than I think I originally thought.”

“I think the thing I'm most looking forward to is hearing the stories of people who are reading it.”

“I can say, I'm not I'm not sick of myself. That sounds really weird to say, but I mean… I'm not sick of this book. Like, I'm not over it. I am more excited about it than ever. And I'm just genuinely excited for people to read it.”

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

GET YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

Audible: https://amzn.to/3ITcdm8

Kindle: https://amzn.to/3ITaSvv

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

This week, I'm thrilled to welcome the most special guest ever on my show- my dad. With the release of my book just around the corner (coming out next week- can you believe it?!) I couldn’t think of a better time to have him on the podcast. Together, we dig into some of the stories that are (and aren’t) talked about in my book.

Join us as we laugh, reminisce, and share stories of the joys, the challenges, and everything in between. My dad has such powerful things to say about gratitude, slowing down, choosing love, and finding joy in the darkest of moments. This conversation is so special to me, and I am so excited to share it with you today. 

Without further ado, let’s jump into this conversation with Tom Buckley. 

3:34 – Tom 101

• Tom’s upbringing + challenging relationship with religion
• Going to college, joining a fraternity, and career as a teacher
• Difficulties in marriage, battles with alcoholism and homelessness
• Tom’s journey to sobriety + spiritual growth

26:49 – Parenting Perspectives

• Reading the memoir
• Watching children make mistakes and learn from them

36:28 – Choosing Love

• Tom and Lynda’s marriage that defied the odds
• Prioritizing sobriety, God, and the good of the family
• The importance of love, respect, and kindness

48:28 – Rule 62

• Looking for the good throughout Lynda’s sickness
• Not taking yourself too seriously
• Appreciating what life has taught you
• Tom’s favorite chapter in the book

48:28 – Life lessons at 80

• Tom’s life today with Cindy
• Slowing down and appreciating the present
• Trusting that things will work out when you get out of your own way

FEATURED QUOTES

“That's what life is about. It isn't about failure, it's about getting back up.” 

“If you take yourself too seriously, you just lose sight of all the things that really are important.”

“In the ‘getting through it’ stage, you gain experience and knowledge that you can use to get out of it. You can find places for help and guidance that will work.”

“You want to see who the winners are? Follow the laughter.”

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com 

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

Preorder my book: 

PREORDER YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn 

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG 

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb 

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

PREORDER MY BOOK - IF I DON'T LAUGH, I'LL CRY TODAY: Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn  Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG  ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb  Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2 Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

My guest this week is the hilarious Dustin Nickerson, a comedian from Seattle now suffering in Southern California. In 2020 he released his debut comedy special Overwhelmed, which is currently one of the highest-rated specials on Amazon Prime. 

His humor has graced the screens of Comedy Central, Netflix with Kevin Hart, The Late Late Show with James Corden, Fox, and Hulu, and his stand-up clips have garnered tens of millions of views. Dustin is also the author of How To Be Married To Melissa and co-host of the podcast Don’t Make Me Come Back There. 

If you want to laugh today, this is the episode for you! I have been a long-time fan of Dustin’s work and I’m so excited to have him on the show today to share his perspective on life, marriage, comedy, and more. You’re going to love this one!

12:07 – Dustin 101, Toby Keith, and Bojangles

Dustin’s Twitter bio Molly’s first date at a Toby Keith concert Bojangles Biscuits Dustin’s fan base

21:46 – Set Bedtimes and Mouthguards

Adult parties need bedtimes  Middle-aged friendships The beauty of marriage

27:40 – If I Don’t Laugh, I’ll Cry

Dustin and Melissa’s viral video Dustin’s relatable humor Evolving as a comedian

33:44 – Finding Your Funny

Authenticity in creativity Bombing in stand-up Understanding your audience

41:41 – The Solider Dog, The Late Late Show and Dustin’s Book

Dustin’s memorable career moments  The dedication behind success Connecting with Dustin

FEATURED QUOTES

"The only way to get good at stand-up comedy is to do stand-up comedy."

“No comedian is beloved by everybody. You're not trying to get everyone to love you. You're trying to get the people that do love you, or will love your stuff, to find you.”

Learn more about Dustin:

Dustin on Tour:

https://www.dustinnickerson.com/

Dustin’s Comedy Specials:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs2QQYow6VX9nDpDwCspiqQ

Dustin on social media:

https://www.facebook.com/dustinnickersoncomedy

https://www.instagram.com/dustinnickerson/?hl=en

https://twitter.com/DustinNickerson

How To Be Married To Melissa:

https://www.thomasnelson.com/p/how-to-be-married-to-melissa/

Don’t Make Me Come Back There Podcast:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dont-make-me-come-back-there-with-dustin-melissa-nickerson/id1434215707?mt=2

Melissa’s Target Outfit Video:

https://www.tiktok.com/@dustinnickersoncomedy/video/7327676165953457451

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com  http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly http://instagram.com/canilaughpod http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly http://facebook.com/canilaughpod http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

PREORDER MY BOOK - IF I DON'T LAUGH, I'LL CRY TODAY: Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn  Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG  ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb  Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2 Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

We have such an incredible guest joining us for today’s show! Bola Sokunbi is a certified financial instructor (CFEI), money expert, speaker, and founder of Clever Girl Finance, one of the largest personal finance media platforms for women in the U.S.

Bola received the 2021 Financial Education Instructor of the Year Award from the National Council of Financial Educators and is a 4x best-selling author of the Clever Finance Series and her book, Choosing To Prosper. She is passionate about helping women take control of their money stories and live life on their terms.

Bola has such amazing things to say about breaking free from a limiting money mindset, being intentional, and giving yourself grace along your financial journey. I could not be more excited to have her back on the show with us today to share her story and wisdom with all of you!

4:49 – Bola 201

• Bola’s life as a business owner, mom, and wife
• Releasing 4 books
• Bola’s career journey and mission
• Pursuing her business on her own terms

22:35 – Embracing Imperfections in Money Management

• “Low dough March”
• Tips for curbing impulsive spending
• Embracing imperfections and finding solutions that work for you

40:57 – The Wealth Paradox

• The cultural attitude towards money 
• Wealthy individuals being idolized and demonized
• Common misconceptions about wealth
• Money as a tool

51:24 – Final Takeaways

• Breaking free from a limiting money mindset
• Learning from others, being intentional, and open-minded to opportunities
• Changing dynamics in the financial planning industry
• Connecting with Bola

FEATURED QUOTES

“I had an idea that I wanted to build a business that would help women- that would empower women to not feel any shame or any judgment about their finances.”

“Automation is a tool that can help you save and help you get out of debt faster, that can help you invest more. Leverage the tools and resources that can help you help yourself.”

“Give yourself that grace. We’re all making money mistakes.”

“Money is not anything. It's a tool. It doesn't make you good, it doesn't make you evil, it doesn't make you kind, it doesn't make you hideous… it… amplifies who you are. If you're a good person, you're a great person with money. If you're an evil person, you're a worse person with money. It’s a tool.”

Learn more about Bola:

https://www.clevergirlfinance.com/

Clever Girl Finance Book Series

https://www.amazon.com/stores/Bola-Sokunbi/author/B076GP7FS3

Bola’s book, Choosing To Prosper

https://www.amazon.com/Choosing-Prosper-Triumphing-Adversity-Achieving-ebook/dp/B0B4V644NT

The Clever Girls Know Podcast

https://www.clevergirlfinance.com/podcast/

Clever Girl Finance on social media

https://www.instagram.com/clevergirlfinance/

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About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

I am so incredibly excited to sit down with Joy Clarkson in this week’s episode. Joy wears many hats - from being a research associate in theology and literature at King’s College London to serving as the Books and Culture Editor for Plough Quarterly.

Completing her Ph.D. in theology at the University of Saint Andrews, she's also the face behind the popular podcast Speaking with Joy and the author of several books, including her latest release, You Are a Tree, which we chat about today.

This conversation was so rich, and it was such a delight to unpack some of the powerful metaphors found in scripture together. I hope you join us as we learn more about the inspiration behind Joy’s new book and talk about how God uses imagery and nature to help us better understand ourselves, our relationships, and the mysteries of life.

7:06 – Joy 101

• Living in Scottland and teaching theology in London
• Joy’s books and podcast
• Joy’s love for tea, music, and baking

13:03 – The Origin Story for Joy’s book

• Frequently relocating as a child
• Joy’s lifelong connection with trees
• Living in one place for 27 months
• Exploring trees in Scripture 

18:50 – Nature’s Lessons

• The profound metaphors found in nature
• God’s intentional creation
• The 7 metaphors explored in Joy’s book

26:44 – Metaphors of Mystery

• God’s intentional design woven into creation
• Embracing childlike wonder to see God’s presence and intentionality
• Using metaphors as tools to describe the mysterious aspects of creation

40:59 – Final Takeaways

• Unpacking “love is a disease”
• The metaphors of trees and travel
• Connecting with Joy

FEATURED QUOTES

“Scripture itself… it's not just a rulebook…doesn't give us a bunch of abstract, philosophical truths about God- it draws on our experiences of the natural world, and our experiences of light and height and depth, to help us understand ourselves and our relationship with God.”

“I think metaphors kind of keep us open to the many facets of things and the mystery of being alive.”

“We are created to belong in this world, and to have a relationship [with] it and to find meaning in it.”

“To be in the world and to flourish we do need to have roots, we do need to be like a tree and stay in one place. But even the best tree human life is still a temporary life and we still have this sense of belonging for a home that isn't here."

Learn more about Joy:

https://joyclarkson.substack.com/about

Check out You Are a Tree:

https://www.amazon.com/You-Are-Tree-Metaphors-Nourish/dp/0764238256

Check out Aggressively Happy:

https://www.amazon.com/Aggressively-Happy-Realists-Believing-Goodness/dp/0764238248/?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_w=LfzV1&content-id=amzn1.sym.cf86ec3a-68a6-43e9-8115-04171136930a&pf_rd_p=cf86ec3a-68a6-43e9-8115-04171136930a&pf_rd_r=144-9553475-8087324&pd_rd_wg=LvZyp&pd_rd_r=6d7bd05c-79fe-4760-962e-083df08e9a43&ref_=aufs_ap_sc_dsk

Speaking with Joy podcast:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/speaking-with-joy/id1310614879

Joy on social media:

https://www.instagram.com/joynessthebrave/?hl=en

https://www.facebook.com/p/Joy-Clarkson-100063508753020/

https://twitter.com/joynessthebrave?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

PREORDER YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib

About Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder?

Can I Laugh On Your Shoulder? Podcast is a weekly podcast where we have honest conversations about faith, business, life, and everything in between. Hosted by speaker and author, Molly Stillman, her mission is to make you laugh, cry, and laugh till you cry. She wants to create a community of people who are unafraid to be themselves and have honest conversations about the things that matter most. Her vision is to create a safe space for people to explore their faith and share their stories and gifts with the world.

My guest this week is the amazing Donna Jones. Donna is a national speaker, church planter, pastor’s wife, and self-described bible explainer with a remarkable speaking portfolio spanning 26 states and 4 continents.

Donna is also the host of the weekly That's Just What I Needed podcast and the talented author behind Seek: A Woman's Guide to Meeting God, Taming Your Family Zoo, the Get Healthy Bible Study Series, and more. 

In honor of her newest book, Healthy Conflict, Peaceful Life, she joins us today to share powerful strategies for handling conflicts with grace and truth. We talk about everything from navigating disagreements to the biblical foundations of forgiveness. I know there is something valuable in this conversation for everyone- get ready for a good one!

2:29 – Donna 101

• Pastor’s wife and church planter
• National speaker, writer, and mom
• Passionate about conflict resolution
• Gym, coffee, and shoe lover

7:04 – Healthily Handling Conflict

• Communicating thoughts, feelings, and opinions with grace and truth
• Donna’s unique perspective on conflict through ministry
• Don’t make the small things big and the big things small

18:31 – The Art of Listening & Disagreeing Gracefully

• The conflict continuum
• Listening to understand
• Learning to disagree without being disagreeable

34:20 – Forgiveness

• Forgiveness is a command, choice, and promise
• Starting with the “want to”
• Inviting Jesus into the pain
• It’s never too late

49:28 – Takeaways

• Ordering Donna’s book
• Connecting with Donna
• Free online resources

FEATURED QUOTES

“I would like to hope that this book serves the purpose to help people avoid things that will make them regret how they handled some conflict in their life.”

“If you have conflict with someone, it does not mean you are a bad person, they are a bad person, or your relationship is somehow defective or bad.”

“When we invite Jesus into those spaces, He doesn't shame us. He sympathizes because He leans towards us and He whispers, ‘I know. I felt it too. I get it. I understand. And I can help.’”

Learn more about Donna:

https://donnajones.org/

Get your copy of Healthy Conflict/Peaceful Life:

https://www.amazon.com/Healthy-Conflict-Peaceful-Life-Communicating-ebook/dp/B0CDKY8YNJ

Donna on Instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/donnaajones/

Donna on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/donnajonesspeak/

Connect with me: 

http://www.stillbeingmolly.com

http://instagram.com/stillbeingmolly

http://instagram.com/canilaughpod

http://twitter.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/stillbeingmolly

http://facebook.com/canilaughpod

http://tiktok.com/@stillbeingmolly

Preorder my book:

PREORDER YOUR COPY TODAY:

Barnes & Noble: https://bit.ly/IIDLICbn

Amazon: https://amzn.to/48VYFkG

ChristianBook: https://bit.ly/IIDLICcb

Target: https://bit.ly/3Shh3Q2

Walmart: https://bit.ly/3MmGVpJ

Indie Bound: https://bit.ly/IIDLICib