Hey everyone, welcome back to The Howl, our monthly segment where my cohost Adam Cruz and I break down the latest horror news, share what we've been watching, and just generally geek out over everything horror.

The Howl is all about giving you a comprehensive yet entertaining look at what's happening in the world of horror, providing top-notch movie recommendations, and delivering a dash of humor along the way. If you want more of The Howl in your life, be sure to sign up for my newsletter at nicktaylor.com/thehowl, where you'll get a quick-read version sent right to your inbox every month.

As always, we'd love to hear from you on what you enjoy, what you'd like to see more of, or any other feedback you have to help us refine this segment. Plus, if you prefer a visual experience, check out The Nick Taylor Horror Show YouTube channel for the video version of these episodes.

So without further ado, here is me, Nick Taylor in conversation with Adam Cruz on this month's episode of The Howl.

SHOW NOTES:

Follow Adam Cruz at:

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/murdermemes_/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@murdermemes_

Store: www.murdermemes.shop

Follow Nick Taylor at:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nicktaylorhorrorshow/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nicktaylorhorrorshow

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Nicktaylorhorrorshow

Website: www.nicktaylor.com

Movies Mentioned:

• Hereditary
• Martyrs
• Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer
• Last House on the Left
• Poor Things
• Late Night with the Devil
• Ready or Not
• Monkeyman
• Universal Monster Movies
• Renfield
• The Last Voyage of the Demeter
• Dracula (Nosferatu)
• In the Mouth of Madness
• Guillermo del Toro
• Killing of a Sacred Deer
• Omen Prequel (Immaculate)
• Satanic Hispanics
• Baghead
• Servant (Apple TV Show)

Andrew Lobel is the screenwriter behind one of this year's breakout horror hits, Immaculate. His journey to bring Immaculate from script to screen is a serious story of endurance and passion—it took 10 years from Andrew’s first draft for it to emerge into theatres. In this episode, Andrew dives into his origin story, writing process, and the saga of transforming Immaculate from a script into a fully realized film. Please give it up for Andrew Lobel. 

Here are some takeaways from this conversation with Andrew Lobel:

Be patient and play the long game. Immaculate took 10 years from script to screen and emerged as one of the standout horror successes of the year. Andrew kept the project alive by constantly entertaining offers and conversations about the work, never fully giving up even in the face of repeated setbacks. Throughout this decade-long process, Andrew encountered numerous challenges, including a changing cast and fluctuating interest from producers. However, he never lost sight of his vision for the film. When Sydney Sweeney, who had auditioned for the movie early in her career, reached new levels of fame, her renewed interest and subsequent attachment to the project provided the momentum needed to finally bring Immaculate to life. This persistence underscores the importance of resilience and long-term commitment in the unpredictable world of filmmaking.

Be an adaptable collaborator. Andrew's commitment to adaptability played a crucial role in this ultimate success. Again and again, he reshaped his script to align with the vision of attached collaborators, demonstrating an unwavering dedication to the project and his team. It's easy for writers and creatives to fall into the trap of clinging too tightly to their original work, resisting feedback or necessary changes. This can be a major misstep. Filmmaking thrives on collaboration, and films also change shape a lot before they’re finished so being adaptable is the name of the game.

Always make a favorable impression. Andrew’s initial interactions with Sydney Sweeney during the initial casting of Immaculate left a significant and positive impression on her early in her career. Even after the project was initially shelved, the favorable experience and professional respect she held for Andrew and the project persisted. This enduring connection enabled the revival of the film years later when Sydney's career had reached new heights. Andrew’s ability to create a memorable and positive experience during their initial collaboration highlights the importance of professionalism and rapport in filmmaking, which can lead to fruitful opportunities long after the first meeting.

SHOW NOTES

Movies:

• Immaculate
• Euphoria
• White Lotus
• Anyone But You
• Everything Sucks
• Voyeurs

TV Shows:

• Handmaid's Tale

Books:

• Save the Cat by Blake Snyder

Thanks for listening, don't forget to subscribe today!

Hey everyone, back with another monthly episode of The Howl, a new concept where me and my cohost Adam Cruz summarize and discuss the past month's horror news, share what we've watched recently, and just generally nerd out over all things horror.

Our goal with The Howl is to catch listeners up with all of the horror news they may have missed from the past month in a fun, conversational format. If you want a quick-read version of The Howl sent directly to your inbox every month, then sign up for my monthly newsletter at nicktaylor.com/thehowl.

So to recap, The Howl is all about catching you up on what's happening in horror, delivering some solid movie recommendations, and hopefully entertaining you at the same time. These episodes also have a video component, so feel free to check us out at The Nick Taylor Horror Show YouTube channel as well.

So without further ado, here is me, Nick Taylor in conversation with Adam Cruz on a new monthly segment we're calling The Howl.

SHOW NOTES:

Follow Adam Cruz at:

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/murdermemes_/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@murdermemes_

Store: www.murdermemes.shop

Follow Nick Taylor at:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nicktaylorhorrorshow/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nicktaylorhorrorshow

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Nicktaylorhorrorshow

Website: www.nicktaylor.com

Movies Mentioned:

• Invisible Man (Blumhouse)
• Videodrome
• Chopping Mall
• The Fly
• Scanners
• The Brood
• Infinity Pool
• Possessor
• Mute Witness
• Wolf
• One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest
• Evil Dead (2013)
• Night of the Living Dead (remake)
• House
• Halloween
• Starship Troopers
• Five Easy Pieces
• Cool Hand Luke
• The Burbs
• Frighteners
• Tourist Trap
• The Island of Dr. Moreau (1996 version)
• The Texas Chainsaw Massacre: The Beginning
• The Nightmare on Elm Street (remake)
• Friday the 13th (remake)
• The Hills Have Eyes (remake)
• The Last House on the Left (remake)
• Leatherface
• The Wolfman
• Little Shop of Horrors (original and remake)
• American Beauty
• Blowout
• Dressed to Kill
• Ghost
• Child's Play
• Scream series
• Immaculate
• St. Maud
• St. Agatha
• Late Night with the Devil
• Love Lies Bleeding
• Monkey Man
• Dream Scenario

Thanks for listening! Don’t forget to subscribe. To get a monthly newsletter of all of your horror news streamlined into a quick-read email visit www.nicktaylor.com/thehowl

Today, we welcome Josh Forbes to the podcast, director of Destroy All Neighbors. This is a gleefully fun movie that feels as inventive as it is unhinged. It’s the kind of movie that I’m feeling really good about seeing more of because it’s completely original. 

This is Josh’s second feature after his debut Contracted Phase 2 and I think he’s really made a serious statement; the energy, attitude, fun and bonkers practical effects make this a very fun movie. The movie starred Jonah Ray with a very hilarious performance by Alex Winter and special effects by Bill Corso and Gabe Bartalos of Basket Case Fame. 

In this interview Josh gets into the making of Destroy All Neighbors from the conception of the idea, to his attachment as director, raising funds and more as well as the current state of cinema that enabled something this original to get made. Don’t forget to check out Destroy all Neighbors, now streaming on Shudder, and in the meantime, please enjoy this conversation with Director, Josh Forbes. 

Take inventory of awesome things you have access to.

This is a common one, take inventory of everything you have access to and fashion your movie out of that. Production value is so critical, and often so expensive. Maximize your movie by taking an inventory of what you have access to and writing your script around it. If you have a friend with a boat, that boat should be in your movie. A friend who owns a pig, in the case of Josh, a pig should be in the movie. This is exactly what Robert Rodriguez did with El Mariachi and Kevin Smith with Clerks.

Use practical effects.

Practical effects, never went away, but still somehow feel like they’re having a second heyday which is awesome. The thing about practical effects is that the community is very very passionate and despite having a low budget, Josh was able to get some very heavy hitters like Bill Corso and Gabe Bartolos on board simply because the project looked fun. Similarly when he did Mortuary Collection, Ryan Spindell was able to get Tom Woodruff Jr. and Alec Gillis from ADI on board despite a relatively low budget because these guys wanted to be involved for the fun of it. The level of passion present in the practical effects community is something very awesome to tap into and it adds a level of production value to your movie that goes a long way in the horror community. Always pay as much as you can though.

Push for your original singular vision.

Destroy all Neighbors could not have been made by anybody else because it’s so specific and singular to Josh, his sensibility, and the things he likes. Directors are supposed to direct movies that only they would be able to do. As a director, you need to understand own and articulate your own sensibility - yes, be open to feedback and collaboration, but your movies should feel specifically uniquely yours. These are the types of projects that inspire others and are worth getting excited about.

SHOW NOTES

Movies and TV Shows

• Onyx the Fortuitous
• Fried Barry
• Idle Hands
• What We Do in the Shadows (both movie and TV show)
• Sin City (referenced for character design)
• Buffalo 66" (referenced for trailer music)

Music

• King Crimson ("In the Court of the Crimson King")
• Gentle Giant ("Octopus" album)
• Straubs (band)
• Yes (band)

Follow Josh Forbes at:

Instagram:  https://www.instagram.com/bestjoshforbes/

IMDB:  https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1141362/?ref_=tt_ov_dr

Thanks as always for listening, don't forget to subscribe today wherever you get your podcasts!

Dave Clark is a filmmaker and creative force who's directed commercials for major brands along with multiple narrative films, including his 2019 feature, 'After She Wakes.'

Dave recently released a must-watch short film called ‘Another’ which is not only terrifying and beautifully made, but a great example of blending AI with live action filmmaking.

This film exemplifies Dave's significant contribution to the AI filmmaking landscape, showcasing how AI should not replace humans or any facets of the filmmaking process. Instead, it can serve as an incredible creative tool, adding unique and exciting dimensions to the work. Dave has been a pioneer in the AI filmmaking conversation, demonstrating what accessible AI tools like Midjourney, Magnific, and Runway are capable of when combined with a skilled and discerning eye for cinema. His understanding of cinema and filmmaking has seriously enabled him to get really incredible results.

Obviously, in the context of filmmaking, AI is a hotly debated topic of controversy, but regardless of whatever side of the fence you’re on, I’d encourage you to listen to this episode. Dave is a very legit, honest to goodness filmmaker first who loves the entire process from being on set, to working with actors, to picking lenses, all of it, and he champions a future where AI is just another tool in the toolbelt and not a replacement for anyone. Dave was also recently brought in by SAG to deliver a presentation on AI and filmmaking to over 1,000 Screen Actors Guild Members.

In this episode Dave get into the practical applications of AI in previsualization and post-production, and its ability to bring high-quality VFX within the reach of indie filmmakers. He stresses the importance of balancing AI tools with traditional filmmaking techniques, ensuring the human touch remains central in storytelling and cinematic aesthetics.

Dave also shares his process for creating ‘Another’ his short film that integrates AI with live action and together we explore how AI can act as a creative partner, offering fresh insights and accelerating the writing and development phase without overriding the unique voice of the writer.

Overall Dave provides valuable insights into how filmmakers can navigate this new landscape, using AI as a tool to enhance, not replace, their creative processes.

Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Dave Clark:

• Use AI for previs and pitching. AI tools can greatly assist in previsualizing film shots, helping directors pitch their movies and helping DPs plan out scenes efficiently by trying out an infinite number of different shots, concepts, lighting, camera, and lens combinations. This is one of many use cases where AI does not replace the work humans do, but enhances it.
• Be subtle about using AI. In Another, Dave's short that integrated AI with live action, the AI element is apparent, but very subtle. He was super selective in what he used AI for and for everything else, he stuck to traditional filmmaking with real actors, a DP, crew, etc. It's tempting to push the boundaries of AI but that can look silly. I recommend checking out Another to see how nuanced and therefore effective Dave's approach was.
• Don't be a hater. There is a ton of hate around AI and it's use in filmmaking which is entirely understandible. I'm not going to go into the ethical discussions around whether or not it's theft because regardless of it being a valid argument, it's a rabbit hole and the truth is AI is coming and it's coming fast. The best approach is to seek to understand these tools because they're going to be part of the process just like CGI. Yes, of course, always advocate for using the tools ethically, but to ignore them, protest them, or shame others for using them isn't helping anybody.

AI Projects:

• Another (Dave's short that integrates AI into live action) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyeZn4Xks8E
• T2 AI Remake from Nem Perez - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rIWHl07Iak

AI Tools Discussed:

• ChatGPT
• Midjourney
• Stable Diffusion
• Stable Video
• Runway
• Pika
• Leonardo
• Comfy UI
• Topaz
• Magnific
• Curious Refuge AI Filmmaking Course

Today, I'm very psyched to speak with Ryan Turek, the VP of Development at Blumhouse and Producer across many titles including Imaginary, Night Swim, The Exorcist: Believer, M3GAN, The Black Phone, Halloween, Halloween Ends, Halloween Kills, Freaky, Happy Death Day and the list goes on.

In this episode, Ryan gets into his very compelling origin story from horror journalism to becoming a very pivotal figure who's shaping contemporary horror cinema.

Ryan also dives deep into the lesser known sides of producing as well as Blumhouse’s process for developing projects and nurturing directors. And we touch on Blumhouse's very exciting Halfway to Halloween Film Festival, a 5-day screening series beginning this Friday, learn more here: www.amctheatres.com/events/halfway-to-halloween

Ryan is someone I've wanted to get on the show for a while and I really enjoyed this conversation. His story is a real testament to the power of persistence and passion, as well as the importance of remaining true to yourself which are hallmarks of Ryan's career that have led him to one of the most important and coolest jobs in horror today.

Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Ryan Turek.

Passion and persistence. Ryan emphasized the importance of his persistence and staying true to his passion for horror and even though he didn’t always know exactly which path to pursue at all times, he kept a foot in horror throughout his career which ultimately paid off in a huge way. His transition from horror journalism to film development showcases how diverse experiences can converge into a unique and powerful career path.

Empathy is an underrated producer skill. When it comes to producing, Ryan stresses the need for empathy and listening. Film sets can be a high-stress environment, rife with a lot of people, egos and endless potential for chaos. With so many volatile variables on set, being able to listen and have empathy ensures people feel heard which makes everything go smoother. It sounds simplistic because it is, but the tenets of psychology apply to producing more than most other professions.

Be a confidante. Ryan mentions that people often cite him as a calm and cool confidante who can help navigate them through day to day on-set difficulties with comfort. This is a very important skill to develop as a producer though not everyone is capable of it so if you’re not, it’s advantageous to have someone like this around because amid the chaos, someone capable of emotionally stabilizing people can stabilize the entire set. This all underscores how critical interpersonal skills are in managing production teams and bringing out the best in people and projects.

Don’t forget to check out Blumhouse’s Halfway to Halloween Film Festival beginning this Friday March 29th at AMC theaters across America. Check out the link in the show notes or visit www.amctheatres.com/events/halfway-to-halloween

SHOW NOTES

Blumhouse’s Halfway to Halloween Film Festival beginning this Friday March 29th at AMC theaters across America: www.amctheatres.com/events/halfway-to-halloween

Follow Ryan:

• X: @_RyanTurek - https://twitter.com/_ryanturek?lang=en
• Instagram: @Ryturek - https://www.instagram.com/ryturek/?hl=en

Movies:

• Sinister
• The Purge
• Ouija: Origin of Evil
• Insidious
• The Invisible Man
• Aliens
• Halloween
• Get Out
• Five Nights at Freddy's
• Wolfman

TV Shows:

• Fall of the House of Usher
• The Haunting of Hill House

Hey everyone, trying something a little different out here. After 100 episodes where I've mostly focused on the guests, I'm introducing The Howl, a new recurring segment named after my newsletter of the same name. Once a month, I'll be joining forces with my friend Adam Cruz and we're going to summarize and discuss the past month's horror news, share what we've watched recently, and just generally nerd out over all things horror.

You might know Adam best from his Instagram account @MurderMemes_ which I will link in the show notes. Adam is also the creator of Blood and Banter, a horror-centric conversational card game which is a ton of fun, which we've talked about on the show.

So, The Howl is all about catching you up on what's happening in horror, delivering some solid movie recommendations, and hopefully entertaining you all the while. Note that this is a new segment and we're likely going to change things and refine the format as we go along and would love to hear from you on what you liked, didn't like, want more of etc. 

So without further ado, here is me, Nick Taylor in conversation with Adam Cruz on a new monthly segment we're calling The Howl. 

SHOW NOTES

Follow Adam Cruz at: 

Instagram https://www.instagram.com/murdermemes_/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@murdermemes_

Store: www.murdermemes.shop

MOVIES:

• Evil Dead 2​​
• The Beyond​​
• The Exorcist​​
• Candyman​​
• Hellraiser
• Texas Chainsaw Massacre​​
• Nightmare on Elm Street​​
• Scream​​
• Hereditary​​
• Martyrs​​
• Beetlejuice​​
• The Conjuring (series)​​
• The Killing of a Sacred Deer​​
• Howling 3: The Marsupials​​

Today we're talking to Andrew Corkin. Andrew is a producer who's body of work includes Martha Marcy May Marlene, the American remake of We Are What We Are, The Beach House (now streaming on Shudder) Alone With You, the feature debut of Emily Bennett and Justin Brooks, the Netfliux docuseries, Pepsi Where’s my Jet, and many more titles. 

In addition to producing, Andrew is also a teacher who has taught at Emerson and The American Film Institute and goes out of his way to teach career lessons that are not typically taught in film school as evidenced by this conversation.

Andrew delivers some of the most honest and thorough insights into what it means to be a producer that I think I've ever heard on this show. This is years worth of film school in a single hours so get ready to take notes. 

In this conversation Andrew and I discuss the keys to sustaining a long and successful career in film, the importance of mentorship and his experience within the horror genre. 

Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Andrew Corkin.

Heed the 80/20 Principle: Andrew pays a lot of mind to which directors he decides to work with, noting that it's a 3-5 year partnership and therefore a serious commitment. The balance he seeks in a director he’s working with is someone with a strong vision but open to feedback. The ideal director has 80% of their vision realized and thought out, but remains open to 20% influence from collaborators. A director with too strong a vision is as difficult to work with as one whose vision isn't fleshed out enough. It's crucial to demonstrate a thorough vision while maintaining some fluidity to enable powerful collaborations.

Show Don't Tell: When pitching Martha Marcy May Marlene with Director Sean Durkin, raising money was a challenge since at the time, Sean was a first time feature director. Andrew and Sean responded by creating a short proof of concept, showcasing the vision, tone, and nuance of the film they wanted to make. This approach was successful, helping them raise the funds not just by communicating the vision, but by demonstrating Sean’s ability to deliver it as a director. A verbally articulated vision can only take you so far; producers need to see what you're capable of actually making if they’re going to invest in you.

Lean into mentorship. A common theme throughout Andrew’s career has been mentorship and education. He not only seeks to learn from collaborators but will even choose specific collaborators to learn from. This learner's mindset can be rare in the film business which is rife with egos, but Andrew credits this mentality of continuous learning to his success and career sustainability and even after over a decade in the industry, he still constantly strives to learn more.

SHOW NOTES

Movies Mentioned: 

• The Kid Stays in the Picture (Documentary about Robert Evans)
• Afterschool - Antonio Campos
• Simon Killer - Antonio Campos
• Martha Marcy May Marlene - Sean Durkin
• We Are What We Are (Mexican Original) - Jorge Michel Grau
• We Are What We Are (American Remake) - Jim Mickle
• Let the Right One In (Swedish Original) - Tomas Alfredson
• The Babadook - Jennifer Kent
• Vigilante - Sarah Dagger-Nixon
• Clean Shaven - Lodge Kerrigan
• Le Samourai - Jean-Pierre Melville

Follow Andrew Corkin at:

• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andrewdcorkin/
• X:  https://twitter.com/andrewdcorkin?lang=en
• IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2371958/

Today we have the Director of Onyx the Fortuitous, Andrew Bowser. Onyx the Fortuitous is a blast of a movie, now streaming on Screambox and one of the things I liked most about it is 1, it had really awesome practical creature effects from Adam KreatureKid Doughterty, but two, it was such a unique vision of a movie that was cast straight from Andrew's skull. The vision behind this movie was super unique, super fun, hilarious, and the movie ultimately made it all the way to the Sundance Film Festival.

In this interview with Andrew, we get into the highly personal origins of the character of Onyx, how he was able to bring the character from being a YouTube sensation to a full feature, and plenty of geeking out on 90's nostalgia and practical effects.

Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Andrew.

Expect to adapt. During filming, Andrew faced significant production constraints, including the loss of a crucial filming location – a cemetery. Every production needs a plan B, C, and sometimes even D. Andrew's experience is a textbook example. Losing a cemetery location could've been a disaster, but instead, it turned into a creative opportunity. Andrew's producer figured the art department could create a graveyard in the backyard of the house they were shooting at and voila, you cannot tell the difference. Things will inevitably go wrong when making movies so not only do you have to be adaptable, you need to surround yourself with other adaptable folks, especially producers.

Hire local. When filming in unfamiliar locations you'll need someone on your crew with local knowledge. Andrew shot in Lenox Massachusetts and had local producers and a local AD. Their in-depth knowledge of the area, connections, and ability to navigate local challenges streamlined the production process. They had a ton of solves because they knew the town and the people in it and were able to call in favors. Every production needs a fixer, if you're filming outside a major production town, make sure you have a local expert on your crew.

Channel yourself into your work. Andrew stated that Onyx is a manifestation of a lot of things that went undealt with in his fifth-grade self. First of all, this is a beautiful sentiment and I really appreciated him allowing himself to be so vulnerable to share this. Second of all, this is a fundamental key to great art which is to channel yourself into it. On the surface, Onyx might seem like a goofy, quirky caricature but there's something very compelling and lovable about him and it's entirely because he comes from a genuine and authentic place. For Andrew, Onyx wasn't just an alter ego but a vehicle through which he was able to recognize and process personal issues. It's pretty profound and a strong reminder of how cathartic art can be. For any creative, remember: your unique perspective is what gives your work its heart and soul so embrace it.

SHOW NOTES

Movies/Shows

• House 2
• British Baking Show 

Misc

• Adam Dougherty - Creature Designer @Kreaturekid on Instagram or check out: kreaturekid.com

Follow Andrew Bowser at:

Facebook:  https://web.facebook.com/AndrewBowserDirector/?_rdc=1&_rdr

Instagram:  https://www.instagram.com/andrewbowserdirector/?hl=en

X: https://twitter.com/andrewbowser?lang=enLinkedIn: 

IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0101453/

Today’s guest needs no introduction, Eli Roth is one of the heads on the Mount Rushmore of horror and for good reason.

This is actually my second interview with Eli and if you haven’t already, I recommend listening to my first conversation with him prior to this one.

This time around, Eli and I dug deep into the making of Thanksgiving, the status of Thanksgiving 2, how he comes up with new gore gags, and they keys to running a fun and productive set. Thanksgiving, by the way, is now streaming on demand and available on blu ray.

Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Eli Roth.

Be prepared and pick people up. Eli mentions that the secret to achieving the balance of a fun and professional set is to channel excitement into the work itself, rather than simply goofing off. Though there is a time and place for things like pranks and horsing around, the focus should be on cultivating a set culture that collectively revels in the filmmaking process whether it’s over an amazing shot, a performance, or practical effect. The key to creating this as a director is to be prepared and to do everything you can to ensure everyone else is prepared. Eli also points out that on any project people are going to have bad days and it's important for the set to rally around people and pick them up when it happens. This approach ensures a smooth and cohesive set experience and an environment of trust where everyone feels supported which is the foundation for getting great work done.

Face & study your fears. Eli is vocal about channeling his own fears and anxieties into his movies. For instance, 'Green Inferno' mirrors his concerns about slacktivism—the millennial trend of supporting causes superficially on social media without any genuine action. 'Hostel' is about xenophobia and the consequences of perceiving foreigners as “the other," while 'Cabin Fever' came from his personal encounter with a parasitic skin disease. Eli underscores the significance of confronting and understanding one's fears as a method to unearth the thematic core of a story, often hidden within these fears. In 'Thanksgiving,' he draws upon his existential unease with the over-commercialization of Christmas, observing how the frenzied consumerism of Black Friday directly contradicts the Thanksgiving holiday's ethos of gratitude and compassion, which became the movie’s theme.

Misdirect is the key to a good scare. Modern horror audiences are tough to shock; they're well-versed in the genre's tricks and can detect a jumpscare from a mile away. Eli points out that effective scares are all about the misdirect. Emphasizing that the scare works best when it’s off-rhythm after you lead viewers down one path you abruptly divert them elsewhere. He notes that the most successful scares are those that break the predictable rhythm that you set as a director. Eli also stresses the importance of variety in scares and how it's crucial to compare each scare to every other scare to avoid repetition. Audiences are quick to pick up on patterns, so each scare should be unique to prevent them from anticipating them.

SHOW NOTES

Movies

• Mute Witness

• The House that Screamed

• The Vanishing (Dutch Version)

• The Prowler

Filmmaking Tools 

• FrameForge software for previsualization of scenes

Today we have a very, very special guest. Somebody who I've wanted to have on the show since I first started the show a few years ago. That is the legendary Eli Roth. We basically focused the conversation on Thanksgiving, his latest movie, which I highly recommend you go see. In any case, I figured I would give everybody a brief overview of the life and career of Eli Roth before getting to the interview.

Eli Roth was born in Newton, Massachusetts. His father was a psychologist, and his mother was an artist. He grew up on '80s horror and even had a horror-thriller theme to his Bar Mitzvah, where he got sawed in half. He went on to attend the NYU Tisch Film School, and he made what he called a Tarantino rip-off, a short called "Restaurant Dogs," which he spent about $10,000 on and used as a calling card to get his first feature made.

His first feature, of course, was Cabin Fever in 2003. So Cabin Fever was based on a real-life skin rash that he got while riding ponies on a farm in Iceland. Turns out it was ringworm, and he claims that when he was scratching his leg, entire pieces of skin were peeling off. He then went to shave his face, and it had affected his face too.

And as he tried to shave, entire swaths of skin came off of his face. Eli claimed that he essentially shaved off half of his face before realizing this is a perfect concept for a horror movie. He then went on to write the script, but it took six years for him to raise the $1.5 million budget, which he raised through private investments.

The movie went on the festival circuit, and Tarantino saw it and claimed it was the best new American movie. It was eventually bought by Lionsgate at the Toronto Film Festival in what was the festival's biggest sale and then went on to earn $35 million globally. Perhaps Eli Roth is best known for his breakout horror hit, Hostel.

This is my favorite Eli Roth movie. There's something about it that I find to be just timeless and ruthless but still a lot, a lot of fun. It mixes brutality with fun in equal measure and it gets really dark and really brutal and really scary, and you almost don't think you can handle it, but somehow you can.

Hostel was made for a budget of $4 million and opened number one at the box office opening weekend, eventually taking in $20 million in its first weekend and grossing $80 million worldwide at the box office. Eli turned down multiple studio directing jobs and took a directing salary of only $10,000 on Hostel to keep the budget as low as possible so there would be no limits set on the violence. In 2006, film critic David Edelstein in New York Magazine credited Eli Roth with creating the horror subgenre, "torture porn."

So when you think about it, the early 2000s was a pretty watershed time for horror. The '90s were relatively tame compared to the '80s. Of course, in the '90s you had Scream and I Know What You Did Last Summer, but they paled in comparison to the buckets of gore that we saw with franchises like Nightmare on Elm Street, Friday the 13th, and even the Texas Chainsaw sequels that came out in the '80s.

However, the early 2000s led to the Splat Pack. This is a number of directors who were considered to contribute to a gleeful revival of gore being put back into movies, and Eli Roth was a big part of it. They include Eli Roth, Alexander Aja, Adam Green, Rob Zombie, and James Wan.

There were a few others, but these were the main guys credited as being part of the Splat Pack.

So to put this into chronological order, first came High Tension in 2003, which also kick-started French extremism. That was director Alexander Aja. And that movie is fantastic. I highly, highly recommend it.

Next came Rob Zombie's amazing House of a Thousand Corpses. I recently bought the Blu-ray, and I think I've bought this movie about five times now because I just cannot stop. In any case... Saw is what really kicked off torture porn in 2004 and essentially paved the way for Hostel, which came out in 2005.

Hostel was then followed up by Hatchet from Adam Green in 2006. The Hatchet movies are a lot, a lot of fun. If you're a Friday the 13th fan, you definitely need to check these out.

SO I also figured I would give you Eli Roth essentials. These are what I consider to be Eli Roth's core horror movies. First is Cabin Fever. As I mentioned before, it's fun. It's fantastic. It is really, really repulsive. It's great to see what he was able to do on a limited budget, and you get glimpses of his overall sensibility. Next, Hostel. Unmatched brutality and humor. Eli Roth's best movie, in my opinion. Next was Hostel 2, which I think was a very worthwhile follow-up.

He claims that he lost audiences on this one because it was too brutal and it lacked the humor of the first one, but I kind of disagree.

It might not be as funny, but it is a great movie, and the whole thing is worth the final kill at the end, which I still don't know how they got away with an R rating for that. I'm not going to ruin the ending for you, but I do recommend you see it.

Fourth would be Green Inferno from 2013. This movie is highly underrated, and I don't know why I don't hear more people talking about this.

Socially, it's very much ahead of its time and it explores what Eli Roth referred to as slacktivism, basically people who claim to get behind causes just for the vanity of it and actually don't understand the causes nor do they actually do anything about it, they just tweet about it. Somehow this feels more relevant today than ever before. Green Inferno is fantastic. It's basically Eli Roth's version of Cannibal Holocaust, which I highly recommend if you haven't seen it. Apparently you can get an animal cruelty-free version, and I highly recommend watching that version. If you're not sure what you're watching, if you see a turtle, a monkey, or a weird aardvark-looking thing.

Start to fast forward. It is just not worth it. But the movie itself is fantastic. So Green Inferno, I actually almost vomited watching this movie, which has never ever happened before. I saw a screening of it, and I had to eye the exits. I had to figure out an escape plan. I didn't end up throwing up, but I had to plan for it. And like I said, never ever happened before in a movie. So yeah, so that is my Eli Roth essential core four. Again, that's Cabin Fever, Hostel, Hostel 2, and Green Inferno.

All of this brings us to Thanksgiving, Eli Roth's latest movie which just came out. So I'm hoping most of you listeners have seen Grindhouse from 2007. If you haven't... Run, don't walk.

Grindhouse is a fantastic, fantastic experience, and one of the most insane moviegoing experiences I've probably ever had. When you watch it now, it just feels like an impossible movie that could never ever get made ever again. Nothing like it. It's about a $70 million epic where Robert Rodriguez and Quentin Tarantino each made a grindhouse-style horror movie and in between the movies are these fake trailers for movies that don't exist.

So the first fake trailer was Machete, which actually spawned two movies, and then Rob Zombie did a trailer, Edgar Wright did a trailer, and Eli Roth did a trailer, called Thanksgiving, and the trailer is so awesome and so brutal and just so completely and totally insane.

And now Thanksgiving is a feature-length movie has finally come to theaters and it is a lot of fun. It's very different from the trailer. It is not an '80s style slasher. It's very much a modern reinterpretation of it, but it is a really fun theatrical experience.

So when approaching the feature-length Thanksgiving, Eli had to come up with a way to contextualize the new movie against the old movie. And what he basically did was he thought of the old movie in his imagination as a movie that came out in the '80s but it was so brutal, so appalling, that it was pulled from theaters and all of the reels were destroyed and the only thing that survived was that trailer.

Thanksgiving movie is a remake of that Thanksgiving movie. Pretty interesting way to frame it. And, uh, yeah, it explains why they are not all that alike, but regardless, the new Thanksgiving does not disappoint. So don't wait for streaming, just get out to the theaters and see it.

So I am very pleased, very humbled, very grateful to introduce today's guest, the legendary Eli Roth. Oh