Today our guests are historian Philip Deslippe and writer Stacie Sutkin, who together have done investigative reporting on 3HO (“happy, healthy, holy organization”), Kundalini yoga, and Yogi Bhajan. They’re going to tell us how they got started writing about 3HO, both interacting with Kundalini yoga in different ways, who Yogi Bhajan was and whether he had any credibility in the Sikh religion (spoiler: he did not), and how he began to get white Americans to believe he was the ultimate spiritual authority, rapidly expanding and profiting off of the money and property of his followers.

They’ll tell us about some of the many ways Yogi Bhajan exerted control over his followers lives, the practice of separating children from their parents in a practice called “distance therapy,” and the boarding schools kids were sent to for years that turned out to be neglectful and abusive, all within full knowledge and approval of Yogi Bhajan. Plus, the wave of survivors that came forward to tell their stories of his and the organization’s abuse, and how they were failed by 3HO’s reparations program.

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Episode 23: Lola Blanc & Meagan Elizabeth continue to interview Frank Lyford, former member of Heaven's Gate. In part 2, they discuss the growing number of red flags he began to notice after one of the leaders died, including talk of castration, and what led to his decision to finally, after 18 years, break away. He also tells the girls what it was like when he heard about the mass suicide on the news, how heartbreaking that was, the lessons he's learned as a result, and what his life is like now. Original Airdate: 03/17/2021

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Episode 22: Lola & Meagan interview Frank Lyford, survivor of Heaven's Gate who left after 18 years--just a few years before discovering his friends and loved ones in the group had died by suicide. In part 1, he tells the girls how he began following the leaders Ti and Do, what it was like living a nomadic lifestyle with his "check partner," and what happened when they all settled in one place for "Class." They discuss being separated from the love of his life, how the rules became more strict and controlling, and how much darker things got after Ti got cancer. Stay tuned next week for part 2! Original Airdate: 03/10/2021

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Cult interventionist and founder of People Leave Cults, Ashlen Hilliard, talks about her path to working in cult intervention and recovery, her personal religious experience that led her to this work, how interactions with Mormons in Utah affected her worldview, how she defines what a cult is, why accusing a group of being a cult isn't always helpful, how cult intervention today is different from how it was in the 70s, how it used to involved kidnapping and unethical practices, how her model takes a harm reduction approach, and when cult intervention practices can become culty themselves!

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You're a child living on a remote compound in West Texas. One day authorities show up at your front door and an exchange of gunfire breaks out. Just as you expected would happen. Survivor of the Branch Davidians and the Waco massacre, Joann Vaega, discusses her earliest memories of living on the compound, what cult leader David Koresh was like in person, why she did not feel fear when the siege began, how her mom bravely acted to save her, learning about the fire that killed 76 people, including her own parents, and how she's currently defying how people said she would turn out. Original Airdate: 08/03/2022

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FOR OUR 200th EPISODE, we are joined by eating disorder therapist, author, and expert Carolyn Costin to discuss her own experiences that led to her starting her practice, why so many cults control the eating habits of their members, why having an eating disorder is like having a little cult leader in your brain, and how Carolyn helped Meagan with her own eating disorder.

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Today is part 2 of our interview with Yoni Shrira, former student at the Family Foundation School, also known as Allynwood, the remote troubled teen program known for a series of lawsuits brought against it as well as over a hundred deaths from overdose or suicide by its former attendees. Last week, we talked about how and why Yoni ended up in the abusive school and the culture of required snitching, and this week he’s going to tell us about the punishments the kids endured, including hard labor and isolation.

He’ll tell us about trying to run away, the origins of the group and the man who created it, how the kids were kept isolated from their families, the way it impacted him after he left, and why he thinks so many of its former students have died.

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Check out the work Lola's mom has been up to!

https://www.sltrib.com/news/polygamy/2024/12/06/polygamous-prophet-how-flds/ 

12 Step / Substance Abuse Resources

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• https://www.therecoveryvillage.com/treatment-program/aftercare/types-12-step-programs/ 
• https://www.addictioncenter.com/treatment/12-step-programs/ 
• 988 -- Suicide & Crisis Lifeline

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Today our guest is Yoni Shrira, friend of the show and survivor of the Family Foundation School, a troubled teen sobriety school that became notorious for how many of its former students died after going through the program. In part one today, he’s going to talk about what he was like as a teenager, how he was genuinely out of control when it came to drugs and alcohol, and why his parents believed the school was the best option to help him.

He’ll tell us about the religious undertones of the group, how the students were separated into groups they called “families,” the culture of constant fear and snitching, and why he thinks so many kids died. Plus next week, we’ll talk about some of the harrowing punishments the kids experienced and what it felt like to finally leave.

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Today our guest is Tory Hess, former member of a small rural group in upstate New York she calls Crazyland. She tells us about how she always loved reading and fantasy growing up, never went to public school, and didn’t connect easily with folks in real life when she was young, and how she found connection in the online gaming community Second Life, where she acted out her dream of having a family of her own... until it began to consume her life. She’ll tell us how some of the friends she made on there convinced her that she was spending too much time on the game, and that she should come live with them in upstate New York... in Crazyland. We’ll talk about how 13 people were living in one trailer, extremely uncomfortable living conditions, but how it fulfilled her desire for a family to take care of (at first). We’ll get into who the leader Ron was, the financial and sexual abuse he was committing, how he isolated her from her parents, and how she finally got out.

Email Tory to learn more about her story! [email protected]

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Groups!... I did it again. Jay Van Bavel, NYU Associate Professor of Psychology and Neural Science, Director of the Social Identity and Morality Lab, and co-author of The Power Of Us, discusses how our social identities change depending on our environment and context, how the groups we identify with affect our decisions and perception, and the importance of instilling healthy hierarchy in a group to prevent unhealthy leadership. They also discuss how emotionally charged situations can forge shared identities, how cults replace individual identities with group identities, what to do when someone has fallen prey to groupthink, and whether groups are even... good? Learn more about Jay's work here! https://www.powerofus.online Original Airdate: 01/04/2023 

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Today our guest is actor, musician, and now author Bethany Joy Lenz, whom we will just call Joy. Joy was the star of hit TV show One Tree Hill, and today she’s going to talk to us about how she was in a Christian cult the whole time she was filming the show. She’ll tell us about her upbringing and her career as a young actor, living in LA on her own and joining a small Bible study group that seemed like the perfect place to share a community with like-minded young Christian actors, and how a charismatic preacher named Les began showing up, leading the meetings, and changing everything.

She’ll tell us about going to a house in Idaho they called the “God spa,” how she was drugged at the house (but did not realize until later), and how Les began to exert more and more control over her life - including isolating her from her family and taking over her finances, which were being drained without her knowledge the entire time she was working on a hit television show - and how the group’s hold over her led her to turning down her dream role in her dream Broadway play.

Plus, how she discovered her money was gone and finally decided to leave.

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