Today Ali is talking to Modern Mom Probs founder Tara Clark about her unexplained infertility journey. Tara talks about growing up in Catholic school and the "fear-based" sex education she got; her three devastating miscarriages; being diagnosed with fibroids and having a procedure to remove them, and why she and her husband needed to take a mental health break after their losses. She also talks about trying again, doing three IUIs; getting pregnant on her third IUI; and the anxiety after loss she experienced when she was pregnant with her now-11 year old son, Jack. 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE: Unexplained infertility; sex education; miscarriage; mental health; infertility; IUI; failed IUIs; IUI success; pregnancy after loss; the anxiety of pregnancy after infertility 

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

SAVE $40 on an annual membership with code RALLY2024

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In this week’s special crossover episode, Ali is joined by her friends Abbe Feder (host of The Fertility Chick) and Elizabeth King (host of Creation Innovation podcast) to discuss infertility in pop culture. As infertility becomes more talked about in TV, movies, music and the news, what shows get it right? Where do we still need more support and stories shared? How can we ensure the narrative feels authentic? And when it doesn’t, is it just plain fun to laugh at? Ali, Abbe and Elizabeth get into all of this today, covering everything from Bluey to American Horror Story to the Taylor Swift song, "Bigger Than The Whole Sky." 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE: IVF; miscarriage; Taylor Swift; Kim Kardashian; Emma Roberts; Bluey; UP!; TTC; pregnancy after loss; childlessness not by choice 

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

S'MOO

S’moo’s best-selling hormone balance powder is formulated with 7 essential vitamins, minerals, and herbs that are all highly recommended for Hormone Balance, Fertility, and PCOS. S’moo was created by fellow PCOS Cyster, and has helped thousands of women manage their PCOS naturally.

Go to thesmooco.com 

Enjoy a generous 20% off sitewide using code 'InfertileAF20' at checkout.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

"Growing up, I always imagined I'd one day be married with kids" says today's guest, single dad by choice John Yurcisin. "I've dated many smart, interesting, beautiful women. I was engaged once and called it off. I just never found my life partner." And so, John decided to become a dad on his own. On this episode, John shares the entire journey to having his two sons as a solo parent, including being the only heterosexual man in a room of 250 people at the Men Having Babies conference; finding a single parents group online; choosing and connecting with his surrogate; choosing an egg donor; and meeting his egg donor for dinner. He also talks about having his two boys, including his advice for anyone contemplating a single dad by choice journey. 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

Single dad by choice; solo dad by choice; egg donor; surrogate; surrogacy journey; IVF; Men Having Babies conference; doctors; lawyers; single parents' groups online 

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

"Truthfully, my journey is about 10 years long at this point," says today's guest, Cara DiFalco. Cara grew up in a big, boisterous Italian family in NJ, and she always knew she wanted many children. After getting divorced with no children at 38, she decided she would pursue being a single mom by choice, and today, she tells us her whole story. She talks about how her family embraced that decision; finding a sperm donor, including her pro tips on choosing a donor and navigating the donor sperm process; navigating three unsuccessful IUIs; her endometriosis; her egg retrievals and how "fertility treatments are stupid expensive, whether you have insurance or not." She also talks about feeling jealous of family and friends who've easily had babies, and where she is today. 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

Single parent by choice; solo parent by choice; donor sperm; donor sperm selection; IUI; finances; egg retrieval; IVF; jealousy

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

S'MOO

S’moo’s best-selling hormone balance powder is formulated with 7 essential vitamins, minerals, and herbs that are all highly recommended for Hormone Balance, Fertility, and PCOS. S’moo was created by fellow PCOS Cyster, and has helped thousands of women manage their PCOS naturally.

Go to thesmooco.com Enjoy a generous 20% off sitewide using code 'InfertileAF' at checkout.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's part two with our friend Bailey, who first shared her story on the pod in 2021. At the time, Bailey talked about having hair loss, night sweats -- finding out her AMH was just 0.1 and she had diminished ovarian reserve. She was told, 'You should be freezing your eggs, like, yesterday.'" Catch up on Bailey's first episode, and then listen to this one to find out where she is today, three years later: No longer going through treatments herself, working in a clinic, and making life much easier and better for any infertility warriors following in her wake. She also talks about the mental effects of infertility treatments, and how that helped her make the decisions which lead her to where she is today. "Infertility never leaves you," she says. "Your journey that you've been through -- it's never ending." 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

DOR; IVF; egg retrieval; egg freezing; fertility preservation; mental health; community support; patient care

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

LFG!!!!!! Today's guest is a dear friend of Ali's, Ashely Hingston, aka @rage_against_infertilty. Ashley tells Ali all about having PCOS symptoms as a young woman and going on birth control, how certain doctors don't want to work with someone over a certain BMI; and going through letrozole rage. She talks about meeting her husband, Rob, doing medicated cycles and discovering male factor infertility, and recovering from an eating disorder. She talks about joining Fertility Rally; finally finding a clinic and medical team that would work with her, enduring many cycles that ended in failed implantation, and -- SPOILER ALERT -- what happened when they met their surrogate, and finally had their son, Jackson Walter, in early 2024. 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

PCOS; IVF; egg retrieval; ART; BMI; Letrozole; medicated cycles; male factor infertility; surrogacy; surrogacy agencies; surrogacy pregnancy; grieving your pregnancy; IVF success 

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini.

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's our Fifth Anniversary Episode! Ali's very special guest today is Elizabeth Carr, the first person born in the U.S. — in 1981 — via in vitro fertilization. "My birth was so widely publicized that my first press conference was at three days old," Elizabeth says. "I didn't get here like everybody else." Elizabeth shares what it's been like to live under media scrutiny since the moment she was born (check out the NOVA documentary about her life). She also explains why her parents did IVF in the first place, what the IVF landscape was like back then, how the actual procedure worked (so much has changed!) and the incredible work she's doing today to advocate for IVF and reproductive rights. She also shares how the pope, when she was born, called her "a child of the devil." 

For more, check out https://ejordancarr.com/

and her IG: @ejordan12

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

IVF; first baby born via IVF; egg retrieval; IVF in the 80s; ART; advocacy

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini. 

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

S'MOO

S’moo’s best-selling hormone balance powder is formulated with 7 essential vitamins, minerals, and herbs that are all highly recommended for Hormone Balance, Fertility, and PCOS. S’moo was created by fellow PCOS Cyster, and has helped thousands of women manage their PCOS naturally.

Go to thesmooco.com Enjoy a generous 20% off sitewide using code 'InfertileAF' at checkout.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

My guest today, Leah McKendrick, is the writer, director and star of the new movie about egg freezing and fertility in your 30s, called "Scrambled." The movie is amazing -- it even got a 94 percent on Rotten Tomatoes, so go check it out on demand and show the Hollywood system that we want even more movies and content around egg freezing, fertility, infertility and more. Today, Leah tells us about her own egg freezing journey, which was the impetus behind the movie. She also talks about the fertility landscape in Hollywood, sex education or lack thereof, periods, family building through ART, IVF, where she is now in her own family building story, and so much more.  

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

Fertility; egg freezing; Hollywood and fertility/infertility; periods; sex education; IVF; ART; advocacy

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

My guest today, Julie Cohen, is an infertility warrior and advocate, and today, she tells Ali all about her roller coaster of a family building journey, including having her three boys, who are earthside with us today, and also her devastating experience with termination for medical reasons (TFMR), due to an extremely rare condition called Limb Body Wall Complex. Julie is amazing, and she's also the city manager of the Jewish Fertility in Birmingham. One caveat: We recorded this before the ruling in Alabama, so we don’t get into that specifically, but we do touch on women’s rights and healthcare. If you want to hear from Julie on what's going on in Alabama, follow her IG at @juliecohen18

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

IUIs, laparoscopic surgery for endometriosis; endometriosis; IVF transfer; pregnancy after loss; PCOS; twin pregnancy; NICU life; limb body wall complex; pregnancy not compatible with life; baby loss; miscarriage; advocacy 

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini

Personalized and non-personalized versions are available. Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

RECEPTIVA DX

ReceptivaDx is the singular test capable of identifying endometriosis,

progesterone resistance, and endometritis in one comprehensive analysis. These conditions are often the hidden culprits behind unexplained infertility, directly impacting

the success rates of IVF treatments. Ask for the Receptvia DX test today, and use code INFERTILEAF24 for $75 off.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

On today's special bonus episode, Ali is joined by Dr. Sahar Wertheimer, a reproductive endocrinologist and infertility specialist practicing in Los Angeles, and InCircle Fertility founder, fertility coach and infertility warrior Abbe Feder to discuss the implications of the overturning of Roe V. Wade. Among the things they discuss: If life begins at fertilization, what does that mean for embryos, creating embryos, discarding embryos and things of that nature? Are women supposed to stock up on the abortion pill? How do we deal with losing bodily autonomy? What it's like to be "waiting to be unpregnant" after a loss, and how young women today will come of age with fewer rights than her mothers and grandmothers. Dr. Werthemier also tells Ali and Abbe what doctors are saying behind the scenes, and what the next few years might look like. Then Abbe talks about how she had to take the abortion pill at one point for a very wanted pregnancy, and also how she had to to take methotrexte for an ectopic pregnancy, and how she went through TFMR when she was pregnant with IVF triplets (and how if the law were different at that time, she would have had a very different outcome).

RESOURCES:

https://resolve.org/resolve-statement-supreme-court-dobbs-decision/

https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/roe-v-wade-overturned-how-to-help-action/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw5ZSWBhCVARIsALERCvz0frUWttW5kc_pTnHQoHUTJl3IdqwWZ2EIgFpmyerb3GBkdwNhYyAaAm0EEALw_wcB

https://www.asrm.org/news-and-publications/asrms-response-to-the-dobbs-v-jackson-ruling/

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Caryn Johnson is the Co-Founder and CEO of BOND, an innovative line of supplements reimagining hormone and reproductive health, inspired by her experience with infertility. In 2017, when trying to start a family, Caryn learned she was autoimmune infertile. Today, Ali and Caryn unpack all of it, including exactly what "autoimmune infertile" means, how she was "pregnant for a few hours;" navigating pregnancy loss; cancelled IVF cycles; taking infusions; and the treatment she got for her immune system. She also talks about choosing joy; transferring two embryos and miscarrying one of them: visiting a psychic; pivoting to a surrogacy journey and finding a match, and life today with her two children, a boy and a girl. Caryn also talks about founding BOND, and how her goal is to give back to women and help them navigate infertility with less trauma than she went through. 

TOPICS COVERED IN THIS EPISODE:

Autoimmune infertility; autoimmune infertile; egg retrieval; OHSS; cancelled IVF cycles; not viable pregnancy; antinuclear antibodies; IVF transfer; pregnancy after loss; embryo transfer with two embryos; vanishing twin; meditation

EPISODE SPONSORS:

WORK OF ART Children's Book about IVF

https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

Ali wrote her first children’s book, and it’s available for pre-order now!

“Work of ART” is the story of an IVF kiddo the day he learns he is a “work of ART” (born via IVF and Assisted Reproductive Technology). For young readers 4-8. Hardcover. Written by Ali Prato; Illustrated by Federico Bonifacini

The first 200 copies will be numbered, personalized and shipped free in the U.S. There is also a non-personalized version available!

Order yours now at https://www.infertileafgroup.com/books

For bulk orders of 10 or more books, go to https://www.infertileafgroup.com/bulk-order-request

FERTILITY RALLY @fertilityrally www.fertilityrally.com

No one should go through infertility alone. Join the Worst Club with the Best Members at fertilityrally.com. We offer 5 to 6 support groups per week, three private Facebook groups, tons of curated IRL and virtual events, and an entire community of more than 500 women available to support you, no matter where you are in your journey.

Join today at link in bio on IG @fertilityrally or at www.fertilityrally.com/membership

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices