The Business of Fashion Podcast

The Business of Fashion

A weekly podcast presenting thoughtful editorial stories and fashion-oriented perspectives in a fresh way.

  • 24 minutes 3 seconds
    The Evolving Art of Brand Collaborations

    Brand collaborations were once rare, highly anticipated events that generated significant buzz. But as they have become more frequent, the challenge lies in creating partnerships that genuinely resonate with consumers and cut through the noise.


    This week, executive editor Brian Baskin and senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young sit down with BoF correspondent Lei Takanashi and editorial fellow Julia Lebossé to explore the state of brand collaborations, what makes them succeed or fail, and where they’re headed next.


    To work, collaborations need to feel authentic. For brands, “letting their collaborators take the wheel and just do what they want to do is really key,” says Takanashi. “When brands collaborate successfully, it’s often because they give creative freedom to the collaborator, allowing them to use the materials they want and tell a story that feels true to their audience,” adds Lebossé.


    Key Insights: 


    • Poorly thought-out collaborations often fail to connect with audiences and just won’t cut it anymore. “When it's done lazily, consumers can tell”, explains Lebossé. “We're becoming much smarter, really looking into brands and what they're doing and what makes sense. … That's why brands really have to step up in terms of what they're doing.”


    • It’s not just big brands that can make waves with collaborations. Lebossé pointed to a sneaker collaboration between Bimma Williams and Saucony as an example where a smaller brand excelled. “They’re showing that, hey, we can do innovation,” explains Lebossé.


    • Brands are finding even greater value in creating physical experiences around collaborations. Takanashi points to the Corteiz x Nike collaboration, where prospective buyers participated in scavenger hunts to buy the shoes. “If someone told me that kids would be lining up to buy Huaraches in 2025, I would not believe them at all,” he says. “But that’s the thing. This brand got kids waiting for hours in the freezing cold to buy their sneakers. It’s really that IRL experience that consumers are looking for when it comes to releases these days.”


    Additional Resources:



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    21 January 2025, 6:05 pm
  • 22 minutes 43 seconds
    Nara Smith and Lucky Blue Smith on Living Authentically in Viral Moments

    In today’s fashion landscape, many of us find ourselves caught in an infinite scroll of influencers. But in 2024, one couple captured the internet’s attention like no other: Lucky Blue Smith and Nara Smith.


    From making cereal from scratch to becoming one of fashion’s most sought-after duos, their rise has sparked both praise and criticism. For millions of people following online, their content offers a glimpse of domestic bliss and authenticity; for others, it raises eyebrows, stoking wild conspiracy theories. As a result, the young couple has found themselves in the glare of the social media spotlight.


    And as the Smiths revealed at BoF VOICES 2024, they’ve come to learn that not everyone will understand who they really are. 

    “It’s the internet. You can’t believe everything you hear and see,” Lucky says. “People really see through all the fakeness. And if you're really authentic, then that's really compelling to a lot of people,” adds Nara. 


    Key Insights: 


    • Lucky Blue Smith rose to fame at an extraordinarily young age. At 16, he became the male model of the moment with covers of major magazines and appearances on runways around the world. Reflecting on the challenges of early fame, he shares, “When you go through a big viral moment and you’re all over social media, you can kind of become, in a way, self-conscious … But meeting [Nara], it was like I felt like I could be my true self for the first time in a while in front of someone.” For Lucky, learning to navigate online scrutiny has been crucial. “It’s the internet. You can’t believe everything you hear and see … You just have to try to focus on the positive and move forward.”


    • Nara Smith underscores the importance of authenticity in connecting with her audience. “As long as you’re authentic to yourself and you’re living your best life and not being fake, that’s kind of how you can get to a point where you might be a really successful influencer,” she says. “People really see through all the fakeness.” As an influencer, she said she credits honesty and transparency as key to her success in the creator economy.



    • Despite the perfect-looking presentation in her videos, Nara Smith shares the often unseen effort and dedication required to succeed in the creator economy, challenging assumptions that content creation is easy or low-effort. “What you’re seeing on the screen is a minute and 30 seconds. But I’m in my kitchen seven hours a day cooking and then putting my kids to bed and then editing for another two hours. And that’s every single day. I don’t take days off,” she reveals. 


    • Reflecting on the evolving nature of personal growth and success, Lucky Blue Smith believes that living your best life is an ever-evolving journey. "I don’t think you’re ever going to land somewhere and say, ‘Yes, this is my best life.’ You always want to level up and move forward and challenge yourself,” he shares. His perspective highlights the importance of continuous growth and self-improvement, even amidst the pressures of fame and notoriety.


    Additional Resources:


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    17 January 2025, 3:50 pm
  • 23 minutes 21 seconds
    How to Choose a PR Agency

    Public relations in fashion has transformed drastically from securing magazine features to managing 360-degree brand storytelling. PR agencies now navigate everything from influencer partnerships to event management, social media strategies, and beyond. However, choosing the right PR agency is no small feat, especially for smaller brands or those at critical growth stages.


    “Having a PR agency that really feels like a genuine organic extension of your team … is what's going to enable you to plan together and collaboratively work on goals that you're super aligned on,” shared marketing correspondent Haley Crawford. 


    Executive editor Brian Baskin and senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young sit down with Crawford to discuss how brands can evaluate potential PR partners, the challenges and opportunities in the modern PR space, and how to ensure a successful collaboration.


    Key Insights: 


    • The PR industry has evolved significantly. In the past, PR agencies focused on securing mentions in traditional editorial formats, with the ultimate goal being a feature in Vogue or Harper’s Bazaar. Today, their capabilities have expanded. As Crawford explains, “this allows them to represent brands across the full spectrum of physical and digital spaces where shoppers are really interfacing with them and discovering them. … The agency's role is to facilitate telling a cohesive story across all these facets.”


    • Building relationships remains central to PR success. “The ability to build and maintain relationships has always been such a central skill in PR, but it looks totally different today than it did a couple of years ago,” says Crawford. “Today, publicists really have to go above and beyond to use those relationship building skills to build communities around the brand. And I think what really helps is being passionate about the brands that you choose to work with as well.”


    • As artificial intelligence increasingly influences brand strategies, PR agencies must adopt innovative, human-centric approaches to distinguish themselves. This involves “facilitating an unexpected partnership … bringing events to life that really bring consumers that much closer to the brands they love” and helping brands “ to get in front of new audiences that might be unexpected.”


    • When you're meeting with a potential PR partner, Crawford advises to think of it as a job interview. “Could you see them being part of your in-house team? Are they clearly passionate about developing your brand story and taking it to the next level?” 



    Additional Resources:


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    14 January 2025, 9:08 pm
  • 20 minutes 58 seconds
    Bethann Hardison: Model, Mother, Agent and Advocate

    Bethann is a former model, agent, and advocate who has been agitating for a more inclusive fashion industry for more than half a century.


    Bethann launched her own modelling agency in 1984, pushing for representation and equal pay for Black and ethnic minority models. Meanwhile In her personal life, she was a working mom, and a woman that in her own words, “has no sense of retirement in her DNA.”


    "When I say racial diversity, I mean I want to still see a redhead. I don’t want an all-Black anything,” Hardison says. “I want to make sure our world remains completely integrated. That’s the most important thing.”


    This week on the BoF Podcast, we revisit conversation from BoF VOICES 2024 where Bethann spoke with London-based British-Jamaican designer Bianca Saunders about her inspiring career journey and the state of the fashion industry today. 



    Key Insights: 


    • Hardison’s approach to diversity in the fashion industry was intentional from the start By strategically building an agency that mirrored the diversity of the world around her, Hardison disrupted the norms of a predominantly white industry. “I didn’t want to have a Black model agency,” she says. “I think it's very important when you have to compete, you have to compete against the people who are running it.” Her decision to compete directly with white agencies allowed her to challenge systemic biases from within, making representation a matter of strategy, not tokenism.


    • For much of her career, Hardison worked tirelessly without stopping to reflect on her impact: “When people come up to me and say, ‘Thank you so much. I love you. You’re such an icon,’ … When you’re doing the work, you don’t think of it as significant. You just want to get things done.” This humility is paired with a newfound appreciation for her legacy, which she gained while working on the documentary Invisible Beauty. “When I decided to make the film about me and let the story be told, I finally realised the significance of what I’ve done.” 


    • Hardison’s vision of diversity extends beyond racial representation. She tells BoF she advocates for a truly inclusive world and challenges the concept of homogeneity in all forms to ensure that diversity remains expansive and reflective of the world’s richness. “The most important thing to me is to make sure our world remains completely integrated,” she says. “I don’t want an all-Black anything; I want to see redheads, I want to see diversity everywhere.”  


    Additional Resources:



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    10 January 2025, 6:30 pm
  • 24 minutes 10 seconds
    Luxury’s Italian Sweatshops Problem

    Over the past year, the pristine image luxury brands have built on their links to artisanal craft, ethical manufacturing and quality has begun to crumble, buffeted by a scandal that has linked labels including Dior and Armani to sweatshops in Italy. 


    According to investigators in Milan, factories producing for the brands were operating illegally and exploiting workers. Dior and Armani have said the allegations don’t reflect their commitment to ethical practices, but prosecutors say the issues uncovered by the probe are systemic and entrenched. Around a dozen more brands could still be implicated, with further cases expected in the coming months.  


    This week, BoF senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young and chief sustainability correspondent Sarah Kent discuss the findings of BoF’s own investigation into how exploitative practices persist in luxury’s supply chains and what the scandal means for the industry. 


    Key Insights: 

    • Luxury brands use their high prices and Italian manufacturing to sidestep concerns over labour practices frequently levelled against lower-priced labels. But the problems pervade even Italy’s most exclusive supply chains. “This may seem shocking and surprising to those outside this part of the industry, but in Italian manufacturing, everyone knows,” said Kent. “It's an open secret.”
    • BoF’s investigation found brands routinely turn a blind eye to labour exploitation, ignoring red flags raised by audits and sustainability teams in the interest of convenience and cost. 
    • New regulations mean the risks associated with such scandals will soon be much more severe. Under incoming European due-diligence rules, brands could be subject to penalties of up to five percent of global revenue if they fail to adequately monitor and prevent labour abuses in their supply chains. “There are still a lot of questions around how that's going to be enforced and what that might actually mean,” said Kent. “But that is a chunky piece of change for any big company.”


    Additional Resources:



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    3 January 2025, 6:00 am
  • 20 minutes 6 seconds
    What Happens When It’s Too Hot to Make Fashion?

    In recent years, extreme weather events have become commonplace catastrophes. And in an increasingly globalised fashion system, developing nations often bear the brunt of climate crises. For fashion and its complex global supply chains — which disproportionately depend on resources and labour from these countries near the equator — one of the most urgent issues is extreme heat. 


    In April, the Philippines, Thailand, Bangladesh and India all experienced merciless and sometimes deadly temperatures, which shuttered workplaces and schools. According to the US National Centers for Environmental Information, Africa, Asia, and Europe all logged their warmest Julys since global records began in 1850. 



    To discuss what this means for fashion, BoF’s chief sustainability correspondent Sarah Kent convened a panel of global experts:


    Laurie Parsons of Royal Holloway at the University of London, who focuses on the garment industry and climate vulnerability, explains: “What's at stake is the productivity of the industry, the health of the workers and as more and more of these stories come out, the reputation of an industry.” 


    From Brazil, Beto Bina, the founder and CEO of supply chain consultancy FarFarm says: “Thinking as an ecosystem, you can be philanthropic, you can bring in public policies. It’s a job for innovation, for marketing, for sustainability. If you bring these teams together and develop an innovative project to start this new supply chain that could be amazing for everyone.”


    From Sri Lanka, Abiramy Sivalogananthan, country coordinator at Asia Floor Wage Alliance, who adds: “The freedom of association should be ensured. Workers should be able to talk to be part of the union, to fight for their rights with the factory’s management.” 


    Key Insights: 


    • Workers in garment factories face a range of challenges that often go unaddressed, particularly in the Global South. Sivalogananthan highlights the critical need for collective bargaining to give workers a voice in addressing these issues. “They should be able to talk to whom they need to talk. They need to talk with the unions who should be part of it. And then as a collective, they should be able to talk to the supplier and of course able to talk to the fashion brands.”  


    • While many fashion brands are proud of their sustainability initiatives, these efforts overwhelmingly focus on reducing emissions, neglecting the immediate impacts of climate change on workers. Parsons points out this glaring gap, stating, “almost every brand focuses on decarbonisation, but there is an infinitesimally small amount of sustainability policies that actually focus on the populations affected by climate change.”


    • Bina further emphasises the interconnectedness of fashion brands and the broader environmental and social systems they rely on. “If you buy cotton, you are part of the agriculture industry,” she says. “We need to start to recognise this is part of the business and the brand.” Instead of viewing climate impacts as externalities, brands must integrate systemic accountability into their operations to ensure long-term viability and ethical production, she added. 


    Additional Resources:


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    26 December 2024, 6:00 pm
  • 33 minutes 7 seconds
    Alessandro Michele and Jacopo Venturini on the New Valentino

    Over the summer, BoF editor-in-chief Imran Amed and editor-at-large Tim Blanks both spent time with Valentino’s new creative director Alessandro Michele to learn about his vision for the fabled Roman couture house.


    One thing became clear in those conversations. Alessandro was drawn to Valentino in part because it would reunite him with Valentino’s CEO, Jacopo Venturini. 


    Alessandro and Jacopo first made magic at Gucci, alongside CEO Marco Bizzari, when the luxury megabrand quadrupled its profits after a period of slow growth in the post-Tom Ford era. There is a special symbiosis in their pursuit of creativity and business, based on a strong emotional connection and a shared passion for creating beautiful things together.


    In their first-ever joint talk, Alessandro and Jacopo joined Tim Blanks at BoF VOICES 2024 to share their plans for Valentino and go inside their unique creative process.


    Key Insights: 


    • Michele describes his approach to Valentino as a blend of honouring its heritage while infusing it with his own perspective. "I try to be gentle … It’s not my place, it’s me working in that place,” he explains. “There is always a conversation [with Valentino].” 


    • Michele acknowledges that his work divides opinions, especially online. “Some people feel aggressive in front of the freedom of someone else … I’m happy with myself because I am free.” 


    • Finishing the thought, Venturini says Michele’s work embodies “genius creativity that starts with real freedom … He has eyes that open the eyes of someone else.” Venturini further highlights how creativity fuels not just design but the entire business ecosystem. “Our company is really human-centric and creativity-centric,” he says. “The goal is to translate this energy into the real world without losing any of it."


    • Michele embraces the inherent unpredictability of the fashion industry, stating, "I’m understanding that you cannot really plan in fashion." He likens his role at Valentino to cultivating a "beautiful garden" where experimentation and creative freedom allow for growth and innovation. 


    Additional Resources:


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    20 December 2024, 3:12 pm
  • 27 minutes 22 seconds
    BoF’s Top Stories of 2024

    As the year comes to a close, BoF’s executive editor Brian Baskin and senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young look back on some of their favourite articles from 2024. The stories include topics that dominated industry conversations throughout the year, as well as some that have had key updates since publication.


    The four articles they discuss are “How Nike Ran Off Course” by sports correspondent Daniel-Yaw Miller, Butler-Young’s three-part Black beauty series, “The Fight for Influencer Marketing Dollars Heats Up” by senior news and features editor Diana Pearl and “Inside Luxury’s Italian Sweatshops Problem” by sustainability correspondent Sarah Kent. The conversation wraps up with a set of predictions for what’s to come in 2025.


    Key Insights:


    • Miller’s “How Nike Ran Off Course” topped the list of key stories from 2024. It was a trying year for the brand, marred by declining sales quarter after quarter. Many pointed to former CEO John Donahoe as the source, with marketing and product feeling stale since he joined in 2020. “This was the year where it really crystallized that there were viable alternatives to Nike in the market,” said Baskin, with competitors encroaching from all sides. Looking ahead, Butler-Young said “Nike is not resting on its laurels” and is doing a lot to try to “turn around a very large ship,” starting with selecting a new CEO, longtime Nike executive Elliott Hill.


    • Sarah Kent’s story, “Inside Luxury’s Italian Sweatshops Problem,” digs into this year’s viral scandal surrounding luxury brands’ labour practices. “It found that luxury brands that manufacture in Italy…routinely turn a blind eye to labour exploitation in their supply chain,” said Butler-Young. “They ignore red flags raised by audits and sustainability teams for the sake of convenience and cost.” Dior in particular faced social media backlash for “the disparity between what people pay for products and then some of the things that happen in the supply chain,” said Butler-Young. Next year, brands will face penalties for failing to comply with new European due diligence regulations.


    • Baskin and Butler-Young shared predictions for the industry in 2025. For Butler-Young, ESG and DEI will be key to watch as they “attempt to continue to take shape in a very hostile political environment,” said Butler-Young. Early adopters of DEI who stick with it despite ebbs and flows might benefit by being the most innovative in the space down the line. For Baskin, “My prediction is one of these big struggling brands … is going to successfully pull out of its slump,” he said, pointing to Nike as a potential winner. 



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    18 December 2024, 8:17 am
  • 20 minutes 51 seconds
    How Independent Brands Can Thrive in a Fashion World Ruled by Giants

    Background:

    In a slowing luxury and fashion market, it’s not just the big brands and e-commerce companies that are being impacted. Independent fashion designers around the world — from China to the US to Europe — are facing a barrage of challenges too. As more multi-brand retailers shut down, this not only puts tremendous cash flow pressure on small fashion businesses, but they are also losing their main channels to reach customers. Alongside other factors like inflation, Brexit and growing geo-political turmoil, it becomes almost impossible to build a sustainable, independent fashion business.


    But there is hope. According to London-based designer Roksanda Ilincic, “the beauty of an independent brand is that you can quickly adapt, quickly change. You can try to find a solution, maybe even quicker than a big giant.”


    To examine this topic at BoF VOICES 2024, 1 Granary founder Olya Kuryshchuk hosted a panel on independent fashion, with Ilincic, publicist and consultant Bohan Qiu, and the designer and Antwerp Royal Academy director Brandon Wen. 


    Key Insights:

    • The traditional reliance on multi-brand stores and fashion shows is shifting, with young designers exploring direct-to-consumer models and leveraging emerging technologies. Qui notes that new opportunities are coming from grassroots movements and emerging markets. “I feel like there is going to be this next movement where it’s coming from the streets, it’s coming from the underground, it’s coming from the youth culture that are so sick and tired of the current system. They want to overthrow and build something so strong that our current system can no longer neglect it.”
    • For Wen, fashion education must evolve to prepare students for the realities of a saturated market. While fostering creativity, institutions should also teach practical skills like budgeting and business management to ensure graduates can navigate the industry successfully. “They need a lot more business advice and opportunities … they also should know how to use Excel, make a budget sheet, and … learn how the big machines work so that they’re not struggling with their own machine.”
    • Independent brands must focus on the unique value they bring to the industry, such as craftsmanship, small-scale production, and authentic creativity. Ilincic highlights the importance of educating consumers about these distinctions, explaining, “the quantities that we produce are much smaller than the quantities of the big brands. So just understanding that you’re buying a very unique and specific product. That should be championed.”

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    13 December 2024, 6:50 pm
  • 23 minutes 49 seconds
    The Future of DEI and ESG in a Hostile Political Environment

    In the late 2010s, and particularly after George Floyd’s murder in 2020, the fashion industry appeared to embrace a progressive awakening on issues like racial justice and climate change. Diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) departments were established, and companies announced ambitious sustainability targets. Yet, from the outset, critics - often from the same communities these initiatives aimed to support - questioned the authenticity of this activism, suggesting it was more about marketing than meaningful change.


    Now, those sceptics may have been proven right. Following the 2023 Supreme Court ruling against affirmative action, companies have begun scaling back hiring initiatives, grants for Black founders, and other DEI efforts. Sustainability commitments are also under scrutiny, with the industry far behind its climate goals and facing a hostile political environment in the US. 


    Executive editor Brian Baskin is joined by sustainability correspondent Sarah Kent and senior correspondent Sheena Butler-Young to untangle the future of DEI and ESG (environmental, social, and governance).


    Key Insights: 


    • Diversity and inclusion in fashion was built on already fragile foundations. “Most companies didn’t have a DEI department before George Floyd,” Butler-Young points out. She explains that these departments were often created hastily and emotionally, which left them vulnerable to becoming performative. “We never moved beyond that conversation into ‘how is this good for business? Why does this matter for a company beyond social good?’”


    • "The acronym DEI has become so politicised,’” continues Butler-Young. "Something that started off as having some good intentions and some really value-driven tenets, and suddenly it's co-opted and becomes something almost derogatory." Companies are now moving away from the language, but that often means moving away from the work as well. 


    • The story in the world of sustainability contains some parallels. “What we’ve begun to see in a handful of cases is a quiet reframing of sustainability commitments, making them less ambitious and, in some ways, more realistic,” says Kent. This includes “the restructuring of sustainability teams, significant layoffs, and a shifting focus.” 


    • Although sustainability efforts are losing traction in the US, Kent points out that European regulations will keep the pressure on global brands. “From an investor standpoint, this is a compliance issue - companies need to meet laws or face significant penalties, which is obviously not good for business.”


    Additional Resources:


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    10 December 2024, 5:55 pm
  • 25 minutes 30 seconds
    How Skims and On Create Cultural Relevance

    Many fashion brands are realising that operating across multiple cultural sectors is a business necessity. In our social feeds, fashion competes with music, film, and sports for our attention.


    Learning how to tap into other cultural sectors is something that many fashion brands are trying to do, but few have done it better than this week’s guests.


    At BoF VOICES 2024, BoF founder and CEO Imran AmedI spoke with Jens Grede, co-founder and CEO of Kim Kardashian’s Skims, the shapewear brand and David Allemann, co-founder and executive co-chairman of the Swiss sportswear company On, to learn how they’ve tapped into the cultural zeitgeist, especially at the growing intersection of sports and fashion.  



    Key Insights: 


    • For both Grede and Allemann, the foundation of a successful brand lies in creating exceptional products. Grede emphasises the critical importance of innovation, crediting Skims’ success to years of fabric development before launching the brand. “Before a brand, there are products, and you can’t build a great brand without a great product,” he explains. Similarly, Allemann shared On’s origins, which began with a makeshift prototype crafted from a garden hose to test their signature “cloud tech” soles. 


    • Sports and fashion have become deeply interconnected, reflecting how cultural and personal identity have evolved. Allemann notes that, over the past 15 years, sportswear has transitioned from functional equipment to an extension of one’s personality, becoming a new uniform. “Because it becomes part of our personality, it’s elevated to a whole different level, and so in a sense, [sport] becomes fashion.” Athletes now use fashion as a platform to build their personal brands, with Grede describing it as “a superpower” that amplifies their influence beyond their sport. 


    • Tapping into culture is essential for brands looking to stay relevant and expand their influence. Grede describes building a brand as finding “a little part in this moment in popular culture,” which requires an understanding of the zeitgeist. For Skims, partnerships like their recent collaboration with Dolce & Gabbana push the brand into uncharted aesthetic territory while providing customers with something entirely new. On takes a similarly thoughtful approach, having turned Roger Federer from an ambassador into an investor. 


    • As brands grow, the decision to go public can be a significant milestone, but timing is critical. Grede acknowledges that Skims will eventually become a public company but stressed the importance of focusing on expansion and building away from the scrutiny of the public eye. Allemann shared advice from On’s IPO journey, describing the need to stay close to the customer: “On really tries to be very close to the consumer and be the brand that helps the explorers and the dreamers and probably even the rebels to ignite their spirit. I think that's what's really important right now.”


    Additional Resources:


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    6 December 2024, 5:22 pm
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