Description:

Lisa Congdon may be an internationally known fine artist, illustrator and writer but she didn’t achieve momentum in her career until she was nearly 40 years old. Prior to that time, she felt that her life hadn’t mattered much, that she didn’t have anything interesting to say. But, a total career pivot in her mid-thirties awakened a passion in her that had been lying dormant for decades and helped her find her powerful, beautiful voice. Despite taking an untraditional path, Lisa has achieved recognition, not just as an artist, but as a leader in the industry for her work in social justice, mentoring and teaching. Lisa says making art is what changed her relationship to her story.

Today, Jen and Amy talk to Lisa Congdon about:

• What it looks and feels like to awaken to new possibilities in life
• The power of finding and harnessing your voice, something Lisa covers more in her book, Find Your Artistic Voice: The Essential Guide to Working Your Creative Magic
• How two really big things (joy and activism) can coexist in artistic expression
• Lisa’s game-changing practice of “loud quitting” the things that no longer bring joy or something positive into her life

***

Segments:

Bless & Release: Loud Quitting

Thought-provoking Quotes:

I decided to develop a new narrative for my life and what it could become. I needed to start believing that I was worthy of love. – Lisa Congdon

I think I’ve always been an artist and a maker and super-creative but I was operating in self-doubt. I learned to give myself permission to play and explore and change my own life. I was lit on fire because, for so many years, I had no sense of agency. But suddenly, I could do whatever I wanted, C

I think my work is the marriage of a passion for social justice with the authentic joy I have for life. – Lisa Congdon 

I found myself in a place where I was exhausted, miserable and doing things out of obligation. I worked hard at letting go. I got in a systematic process of taking inventory of my life, how I was spending my time. Every time I felt a rush of anxiety about doing something, I would stop and examine it. – Lisa Congdon

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Find Your Artistic Voice: The Essential Guide to Working Your Creative Magic by Lisa Congdon - https://amzn.to/4kkYAO1

Art, Inc.: The Essential Guide for Building Your Career as an Artist by Lisa Congdon - https://amzn.to/4ij5Ms2

The Live Your Values Deck - https://lisacongdon.com/products/values-deck

Lisa Congdon’s St. Mary’s College Exhibit - https://www.stmarys-ca.edu/museum-art/lisa-congdon-hold-it-lightly

Corita Kent - https://www.corita.org/

Guest’s Links:

Lisa’s website - https://lisacongdon.com/

Lisa’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/lisacongdon

Lisa’s Twitter - https://x.com/lisacongdon

Lisa’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/lisacongdonart

Lisa’s Pinterest - https://www.pinterest.com/lisacongdon/

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. 

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

Cancer is a tough topic—hard to discuss, isolating, and disorienting for those facing it. For Tyler Merritt, a beloved voice in the JHBC community, confronting mortality sparked a fresh perspective on life.

Tyler joins Jen to talk about This Changes Everything, his humorous and heartfelt love letter to life after battling cancer. With his signature humor, pop culture nods, and musical theater references (plus a killer playlist), Tyler weaves candid stories of surgery and treatment with playful asides—think a five-page play about his appendix and Taylor Swift-inspired subtitles.

Things may go off the rails when Jen and Tyler debate whether words like “lovers” and “making love” are officially outdated—we apologize in advance.

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

Because of the way your book is written, in real time and with such urgency, I think 100 people out of 100 will go straight to their phones after finishing the book and Google ”is Tyler Merritt still alive?” – Jen Hatmaker

I found out pretty quickly that I was using a lot of humor to cover my fear. Even in the worst possible scenarios, even though I was sometimes walking with death, it felt like, if I looked around, there was humor. – Tyler Merritt

For people that are in the horrible cancer club, if you have something in your life that has created change in your every day, or something that has made things scary, you’re not alone. You’re blessed to still be here and breathing. – Tyler Merritt

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

This Changes Everything: A Surprisingly Funny Story About Race, Cancer, Faith, and Other Things We Don’t Talk About by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/3Clgwa2

Jen Hatmaker Book Club - https://bit.ly/40KOQ7U

I Take My Coffee Black: Reflections on Tupac, Musical Theater, Faith, and Being Black in America by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/4hjiPcC

Publisher’s Weekly synopsis - https://www.publishersweekly.com/9781546006961

A Door Made for Me by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/4hvCkPn

Cujo - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085382/

Annie - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0083564/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_8_tt_2_nm_6_in_0_q_annie

Where the Red Fern Grows by Wilson Rawls - https://amzn.to/4gdEbqG

Train - Drops of Jupiter - https://open.spotify.com/track/2hKdd3qO7cWr2Jo0Bcs0MA

Blackberry Farms - https://www.blackberryfarm.com/

This Changes Everything playlist - https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0jFoCxX22lzohvdd2tLfkQ

Sandi Patti - https://www.sandipatty.com/

Taylor Swift - https://www.taylorswift.com/

Prince - https://www.prince.com/

RENT - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0294870/

AUDIOBOOK: This Changes Everything: A Surprisingly Funny Story About Race, Cancer, Faith, and Other Things We Don't Talk About by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/3Cm1YHa

Book People (Austin) - https://www.bookpeople.com/

Parnassus Books (Nashville) - https://www.parnassusbooks.net/

Guest’s Links:

Tyler’s website - https://thetylermerrittproject.com/

Tyler’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/thetylermerrittproject/

Tyler’s Twitter - https://x.com/ttmproject

Tyler’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/thetylermerrittproject

Tyler’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPB48_JfK-VMnYQPTYyMX5Q

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

In this second installment of our special Midlife Renaissance series, the delightful Erin Hicks Moon joins Jen and Amy for a super resonant conversation to discuss what it looks like when the faith that you grew up with bears no resemblance to your current values and what matters to you today. But Erin reassures us that if our faith looked like it did 10, 15, even 20 years ago, we would not be evolving.

Erin is the host and resident bible scholar of the Faith Adjacent podcast and author of I’ve Got Questions: The Spiritual Practice of Having It Out with God. She’s a thoughtful guide for processing our questions, curiosity, and doubt.   

Women naturally come into midlife with a posture of comfort in things they are sure of and curiosity to explore the things that they aren’t. There are many people searching for answers in the wilderness of faith but, as Erin reminds us, our questions can lead to a more vibrant and joyful faith.

***

Segments

Midlife Glowup: Trying new things

Amy gives an update on her decision to go out on a limb as a newly-minted podcaster and Jen shares what it’s like to date again in your fifties. 

Thought-provoking Quotes:

We do spiritual practices to be connected to God and I think we overcomplicate it with rigid checklists. – Erin Hicks Moon

Really working through the grief, and the sadness, and anger of watching your faith be weaponized or coming from a church that has split over something really difficult, or something personal in your life, something on a world stage. I think we have to be honest in that grief. That is a really difficult thing when you’re surrounded by toxic positivity in the church.Sometimes it sucks and we have to be honest about that. – Erin Hick Moon

We can still have a relationship with God, we can still have faith, but it doesn’t have to look the way everyone else says it should look. – Erin Hicks Moon

I’m shocked when I have conversations with people who I really did not know grew up in the church and it turns out we have so many of the same beliefs; we’ve been evolving on parallel tracks but they just choose not to identify that way. – Amy Hardin

I have never met one person who has gone through deconstruction and/or because they wanted to sin more. The overwhelming pattern is that they want to figure this out and at the end of the process, they end up with a faith that is stronger than what they began with. – Erin Hicks Moon

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

I've Got Questions: The Spiritual Practice of Having It Out with God by Erin Hicks Moon

I've Got Questions Guided Journal: Prompts and Practices for Rewilding Your Faith by Erin Hicks Moon 

Sarah Bessey - https://www.sarahbessey.com/

Anne Lamott - https://www.instagram.com/annelamott/

Bridgerton - https://www.netflix.com/title/80232398

Eugene Peterson - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_H._Peterson

The Making of Biblical Womanhood: How the Subjugation of Women Became Gospel Truth by Beth Allison Barr

Pastor Trey - https://www.instagram.com/pastortrey05/

Dallas Willard - https://dwillard.org/

Guest’s Links:

Erin’s website - https://www.erinhmoon.com/

Erin’s Substack - https://erinhmoon.substack.com/

Erin’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/erinhmoon

Erin’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/erin.hicks.moon

Erin’s Podcast - https://faithadjacent.com/

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. 

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

In this special episode, we welcome Barnard College professor and accomplished author, Jennifer Finney Boylan, back to the show to discuss her latest labor of love, her book Cleavage, which examines the divisions – as well as the common ground – between the genders, and reflects on her experiences, both difficult and joyful, as a transgender American.

Jenny discusses the importance that things like nuance,imagination, patience, empathy and understanding hold in our divided world, reflecting on her experiences as a transgender woman and noting that for many, “living your best life is not necessarily a political decision, but a matter of life and death.” The ultimate thing she wants, Jenny says, is just to be left alone, to live her life and to be free.

Segments

Bless & Release: Gender stereotypes

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

Conversations about trans-women in sports are complicated and demand nuance, patience, and imagination. For us to be defined by the most difficult and controversial aspects of our existence is really unfair. – Jennifer Finney Boylan

I’m not a woman with an asterisk. At 66 ½ years old, my life has a lot more in common with other women my age than you would think. My life does not revolve around me trying to sneak into your daughter’s soccer game. My life revolves around my family, and reading, and teaching my students, and working in the garden, and things that I hope would seem very familiar to people. – Jennifer Finney Boylan

These are hard times. But we do know that hard times come and hard times go. And, whatever this moment is, is not forever. Although I can’t underestimate exactly how hard it is to be singled out by the President of the United States as a person who specifically is not deserving of love or respect or basic human kindness. – Jennifer Finney Boylan

Nobody goes from male to female in hopes of getting a better deal. – Jennifer Finney Boylan

I hope people will pick up and read Cleavage not because they want to understand more about the trans business but because they want to know what sorts of choices people can make when they feel that the world is against them and there is no room for them. I have found, against all odds, that there is room for me, that I have been loved, and, on a good day, the world is full of joy and humor. – Jennifer Finney Boylan

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Cleavage: Men, Women, and the Space Between Us by Jennifer Finney Boylan 

Mad Honey: A GMA Book Club Pick: A Novel by Jennifer Finney Boylan

Roxane Gay

She's Not There: A Life in Two Genders by Jennifer Finney Boylan

Jennifer Finney Boylan’s New York Times articles - https://www.nytimes.com/column/jennifer-finney-boylan

I Am Cait (Caitlin Jenner Show) - https://tv.apple.com/us/show/i-am-cait/umc.cmc.38b55qpveo4xdxypnk03xfvmp

Torrey Peters - https://www.torreypeters.com/

Kate Bornstein - http://katebornstein.com/

Trans Bodies Trans Selves: a Resource Guide for the Transgender Community - http://transbodies.com/

John Barth - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Barth

Ben Hatmaker’s marathon post - https://www.instagram.com/p/DGI6wt2OyBL/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

Cleavage Tour Schedule - https://us.macmillan.com/tours/jennifer-finney-boylan-cleavage/

Guest’s Links:

Jenny’s website - https://jenniferboylan.net/ 

Jenny’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/jenniferfinneyboylan

Jenny’s Twitter - https://x.com/JennyBoylan

Jenny’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/JenniferFinneyBoylan/

Jenny’s Medium - https://medium.com/@jennyboylan_97964 

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Title: Midlife Renaissance: Building Your Belonging Circle with Dr Thema Bryant

Description:

Today, we’re revisiting a popular topic on this show: Friendships. More specifically, the revival of our friendships and our capacity for friendships in midlife. How many of us have sacrificed a relationship or a piece of ourselves in order to fulfill the implied demands of our role as a wife or mother or woman with a career? 

Dr. Thema Bryant is a renowned psychologist, author, professor, sacred artist, and minister, who empowers women to connect with themselves and to others by exploring fun and comfortable topics like our control issues and emotional unavailability with practical activation activities and teaching how to shift our mindset and patterns.

Today, we’re delving into the impacts of loneliness, the complexities of navigating new and evolving friendships in midlife, and the importance of self-love and “coming home” to ourselves before we can build a community that can support us in the way we need it to.

Aha moments from this episode include:

• Common reasons why midlife can feel isolating to some women
• The role major life changes (e.g., career shifts, divorce, empty nesting) play in creating a sense of disconnection
• Signs that a friendship or community is not serving us well, including navigating shifts in those friendships and letting go of what no longer serves us and welcoming new connections
• Practical activation exercises, such as writing vows to yourself, that you can practice to strengthen your relationships with yourself and others

Plus, Jen and Amy debut a new segment called “Zero Damns to Give” where they suss out what stuff really matters in this stage of their lives and what can be cast off, allowing them to step into full authenticity—without guilt, shame, or over-explanation.

***

Segments

Zero Damns to Give: Unapologetic midlife edition

Thought-provoking Quotes:

When I observe someone making a polite but clear boundary, I respect it. I’m impressed. – Jen Hatmaker

Can you come to the place where you admit, I miss myself? And myself is not my labor. Myself is not my roles. Myself is a living soul and one of the things that feeds my soul are my friendships but those got neglected because I was told that to be a good leader or to be a good mom, I had to deprioritize the things that nourished me. – Dr. Thema Bryant

If a community is not ready-made, something for you to join, it’s something for you to create. – Dr. Thema Bryant

Our wellness is more important than our loyalty. – Dr. Thema Bryant

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Matters of the Heart: Healing Your Relationship with Yourself and Those You Love by Dr. Thema Bryant - https://amzn.to/40XMql6

Homecoming: Overcome Fear and Trauma to Reclaim Your Whole, Authentic Self by Dr. Thema Bryant - https://amzn.to/4hVYQ4c

The Homecoming Podcast with Dr. Thema Bryant - https://soundcloud.com/dr-thema-bryant-davis

Guest’s Links:

Thema’s website - https://drthema.com/

Thema’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/dr.thema/

Thema’s Twitter - https://x.com/drthema

Thema’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/ThemaBryantDavis

Thema’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxpb1ZdNd6M99Fhaw09H81Q

Thema’s Podcast - https://soundcloud.com/dr-thema-bryant-davis

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Back in the olden days of the 1990s with our dial-up internet and AOL accounts, twelve-year-old Brian Kelly was at home honing his budding interest in travel planning by booking his family vacations and maximizing the reach of his family’s points and frequent flyer miles. Cut to a few decades later and that hobby (which started as a small-time blog powered by affiliate-marketing, which his mom was convinced was a scam) has evolved into a whirlwind operation that the world now knows familiarly as “The Points Guy”. 

Brian Sherpas us through all of the twists and turns of booking travel to eliminate the headaches and get THE MOST bang for our buck.

Highlights from this chat include: 

• Why Brian thinks this is “the Platinum Age of Travel” 
• Mastering family travel – Brian has been to sixteen countries with his two-year-old and is currently planning a month-long trip to Thailand with his newborn so he’s figured this out!
• How, when leveraged correctly, you can finance your travel using your loyalty points
• The 3 main types of rewards to have on your radar
• Surprisingly helpful hacks to avoid jetlag
• And Jen shares a hilarious story about a flight to Spain seated next to a nun that quickly got out of hand

Segments:

Rant or Rave: Early Airport Arrivals

GenXCellence: 80s/90s Travel

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

When people tell me that because of my knowledge, they were able to get the family together this year, that’s why I do what I do.– Brian Kelly

Having points in a transferable currency is like an insurance policy. – Brian Kelly

Find where the deals are. That’s how you really save. Let the deal define your destination, especially if you’re booking multiple tickets. That’s when you save real money. Spend your money on the horseback riding experience, spend it on the meals, and the fun. – Brian Kelly 

You need to be your own advocate. I see people melting down in airports and getting bullied around, screaming at airline agents – the ones who hold all the power. I think people need a mentality shift because they assume they are owed something when they’re not. You need to know when to ask for favor and when you are owed something. It makes all the difference. – Brian Kelly

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

Jen first met Tressie McMillan Cottom the way most normal people meet – under the bright lights on the set of an Oprah special, invited by Ms. Winfrey to speak on a panel, along with other influential voices including Rebel Wilson, Amber Riley, Katie Sturino, Jamie Kern Lima, Busy Philipps and others to talk about diet culture, the harmful narratives we have surrounding our weight and our bodies, and how we can begin reframing the conversation away from one centered in shame to one focused on body acceptance. The entire studio was gobsmacked by Tressie which is fitting given that she is a prominent cultural commentator and Professor at UNC Chapel Hill. Her work explores the loaded and nuanced ideas like racial capitalism, beauty standards, the exploitation of higher education systems, but in a way that we ordinary Joe’s can understand. We knew immediately that she was destined to be a guest on our show and today is the day.

Segments:

Bless & Release: The News Cycle

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

I think every life has a trauma so there’s nothing really special about mine. But whatever your trauma is, you are usually faced with a decision, which is, do I want to be who I was before this or am I going to be something different? – Tressie McMillan Cottom

I love really hard questions. I am my happiest, most connected, most joyful, when I am trying to disentangle a really hard social problem that I think everybody has got wrong. I’m really attracted to those things where our beliefs are totally counter-intuitive, where our gut is telling us something is there but the picture is fuzzy, and I think I’m attracted to that because my path was so abnormal and so unique and I know that I wouldn’t have existed if people had just gone along with what was supposed to be. – Tressie McMillan Cottom

I thought my grandmothers sounded as intelligent as my professors and so I really struggled with the idea that there was something counterfeit or illegitimate about them and their stories and the things that I had learned from them. - Tressie McMillan Cottom

History is weirdly comforting when we can look at our worst impulses and know this isn't the first time we’ve faced this level of chaos and inequality and systemic injustice. It’s just our generation’s turn. – Jen Hatmaker

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Leave us a voicemail- https://jenhatmaker.com/podcast/ Click the “Send Voicemail” tab on the right side of the page

Pantsuit Politics - https://www.pantsuitpoliticsshow.com/

Allison Gill - https://allisongill.com/

The Daily Beans | News with Swearing - https://www.dailybeanspod.com/

Lower Ed: The Troubling Rise of For-Profit Colleges in the New Economy by Tressie McMillan Cottom - https://amzn.to/4hv6dPF

Thick: And Other Essays by Tressie McMillan Cottom - https://amzn.to/3Co8gWX

Dr. Tressie McMillan Cottom’s New York Times newsletter - https://www.nytimes.com/by/tressie-mcmillan-cottom

Tressie’s MacArthur Fellowship - https://www.macfound.org/fellows/class-of-2020/tressie-mcmillan-cottom

Oprah + Weight Watchers: Making the Shift special - https://www.weightwatchers.com/makingtheshift/?srsltid=AfmBOortVultNvf8Oy7KWezSW1X6uVsvMm9ziScOvAzxUg3XsWQ_2H44

Guest’s Links:

Dr. Cottom’s website - https://tressiemc.com/

Dr. Cottom’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tressiemcphd/

Dr. Cottom’s Twitter - https://x.com/tressiemcphd

Dr. Cottom’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/tressiemcmillancottom/

Dr. Cottom’s podcast - https://tressiemc.com/podcast/ 

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. 

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Title: No Such Thing As Good or Bad Kids: Dr. Shefali on Conscious Parenting

Description:

Today, we’re taking a trip into the archives to revisit a 2023 episode with renowned clinical psychologist and listener favorite, Dr. Shefali Tsabary, where we dove into the deeply-layered topic of conscious parenting. Those of us in the middle of life, still parenting kids at home, adjusting to parenting adult children who just launched out into the world. or in any season of the parenting journey, really, will find much to learn as we look back (and forward) at our parenting patterns.

Highlights from this convo include:

• Defining conscious parenting and the three stages of the parenting map
• Debunking the notion that as parents we are supposed to create happy, perfect superhumans by following traditional parenting rules
• Dismissing the notion that there are good kids and bad kids—and how to avoid using these labels
• Revealing the five ego patterns that parents might not even realize inform their quest to raise amazing children
• The three reasons why children act out or misbehave and how you can learn not to shame them for it
• The results of over-parenting and how it shows up in your adult children
• How it’s never too late to become a mindful parent

Segments:

Bless and Release: Avoiding difficult conversations

Thought-provoking Quotes:

The evolution of the planet depends on the evolution of the parent. – Dr. Shefali

Everyone wants a new tomorrow. But what we don’t realize is that a new future comes with an absolute willingness to disrupt the past. – Dr. Shefali

There is no such thing as a good kid or a bad kid. So, what kind of kids are there? Just kids – just humans who are terribly flawed like we are, and terribly, but amazingly blissful like we are. They’re just this unique combo and they defy labels. – Dr. Shefali

Punishment, shaming, blaming is never sustainable. I cannot tell you how many times a day I tell parents, ‘Listen, you appear to get control in the moment, but long term, it’s going to be unforgiving.’ – Dr. Shefali

How do we constantly show our presence [to our adult children]? Unequivocal cheerleading. ‘I’m thinking of you. I miss you. I’m remembering you. I adore you.’ Let them know they are on your mind but not involved in their day-to-day. – Dr. Shefali

When the ego crumbles, proportionately the heart expands, and you then are just this heart-centered being able to connect to the other people in a very attuned, compassionate, genuine way. And your children will feel it. – Dr. Shefali

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

The Conscious Parent by Dr. Shefali Tsabary - https://amzn.to/4aNAPd8

The Parenting Map by Dr. Shefali Tsabary - https://amzn.to/3EER148

Dr. Shefali’s previous interview on For the Love:Releasing The Fantasy of “The Good Girl” with Dr. Shefali Tsabary - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-35/releasing-the-fantasy-of-the-good-girl-with-dr-shefali-tsabary/

Guest’s Links:

Dr. Shefali’s website - https://www.drshefali.com/

Dr. Shefali’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/doctorshefali

Dr. Shefali’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/doctorshefali

Dr. Shefali’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/c/DrShefali

Dr. Shefali’s TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@doctorshefali

Dr. Shefali’s Podcast - https://www.drshefali.com/podcast/

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presen

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

Chip Leighton is a guy whose kids describe him as an “unemployed, middle-aged TikTokker“. He has turned the chaos of parenting kids – teens, in particular, into comedy gold. By taking hilarious text from teens and turning them into reels, he keeps the internet in stitches. With his hilarious take on raising teenagers that is so relatable and mirrors so many parents' exact experiences, Chip helps countless moms and dads know that they are not alone in their wild journey. Now he’s compiling the best conversations from texts and real-life moments into his new book, What Time Is Noon?

Chip and Jen talk about: 

• The names we are given as parents of teens: Gangster, Bruh, or Jen’s favorite….Pimp
• Ridiculous questions our kids have asked, such as: Did grandma have kids? Am I a notary? Am I on Medicare? What’s a stamp? 
• Savage burns Chip’s kids have made about his wardrobe: Our favorite – “that looks like the material they make tents from”.
• Endless instructions from the teens on how not to be embarrassing in front of their friends
• Also, Chip tells the story of deciding to leave his corporate job to try his hand at standup (at the urging of one Caroline Rhea).

Segments:

Bless & Release: The clothes we made our kids wear

GenXCellence: Parenting in GenX versus GenZ

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

I’m nostalgic about the feral children going out riding their bikes, building forts, staying out till the streetlights came on. – Amy Hardin

It’s universal, it’s all teens. They don’t know how to dress properly for the weather. But they know what we (the parents) are doing wrong. – Jen Hatmaker and Chip Leighton

You wouldn’t have predicted that I would be funny. Neither of my parents were performers. I wasn’t the class clown. I’ve always had a dry sense of humor and I’ve appreciated that type of comedy, I’ve just kept it inside all these years. – Chip Leighton

I do believe that everybody has some strengths and interests and talents that aren’t necessarily fully leveraged in the typical career or job that they have and these new platforms help bring that out and there are more creative people able to connect with an audience now. – Chip Leighton

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

What Time is Noon?: Hilarious Texts, Ridiculous Feedback, and Not-So-Subtle Advice from Teenagers by Chip Leighton - https://amzn.to/4hp7qrH

Caroline Rhea - https://carolinerhea.com/

Guest’s Links:

Chip’s website - https://theleightonshow.com/

Chip’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/the_leighton_show/

Chip’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/theleightonshow/

Chip’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzdstcflneJKZ_Qi5TQAvQQ

Chip’s TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@the_leighton_show

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. 

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

It seemed like a good idea at the time… a twisty, suspenseful thriller set on a cruise ship. How could this not be the perfect story to build a little buzz and excitement in my community ahead of our upcoming Jen Hatmaker cruise? Did we get more than we bargained for?

Ruth Ware’s writing has rightfully been compared to that of suspense-queen, Agatha Christie, for featuring everyday female protagonists often white-knuckling it through some treacherous situations in places where they are isolated from any rescue – a glass house in the woods, an excluded ski resort, a remote tropical island, a boutique cruise ship! 

Today, Jen sits down with the author of our January 2025 JHBC pick to navigate the many twists and turns of The Woman in Cabin 10 and why so many of our readers are losing sleep this month thanks to her innate skill of setting a heart-pounding scene.  

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

People are comparing me to Agatha Christie which is kind of terrifying. The thing that is so brilliant about some of Christie’s books that I love the most is the closed room setting: the terrifying storm-wracked island, the luxury train in the middle of the snow storm, or the Dahabiya drifting down the Nile. What she does so brilliantly is that sense of corrupted luxury, that setting that should be really idyllic turns out horrific and becomes more and more claustrophobic and more terrifying. – Ruth Ware

I have never been on a cruise but I had a chance to look around a ship as a day passenger and I was so surprised by how much I got right. There was so much that I had guessed at and I turned out to be more correct than I ever could have imagined. – Ruth Ware

The way in which you write fear, to me, it feels the truest version of it when it’s not screaming, ‘you’re so scared, you can’t make a sound’ or ‘you’re so scared, you’re frozen – you can’t move.’ That to me, rings true. – Jen Hatmaker

I do try really hard to drop clues and play fair with the reader. I know as a reader, the feeling that I hate most, is what I feel like the writer has cheated me and there was information that I couldn’t possibly have known, stuff I couldn’t have guessed and that I find deeply irritating as a reader. I try always to feel like I played fair with the reader and they did have a chance of guessing it even if they didn’t get there. – Ruth Ware

Isn’t that why we love reading crime? It’s because you can have bad things happen in a fictional world. It doesn’t always get tied up in every single respect and yes, there’s sadness in terms that someone is usually dead. But there is some kind of restorative justice at the end. – Ruth Ware

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

The Woman in Cabin 10 by Ruth Ware - https://amzn.to/3DKHCrH

In a Dark, Dark Wood by Ruth Ware - https://amzn.to/400kQ6g

Agatha Christie - https://www.agathachristie.com/

Below Deck tv show - https://www.bravotv.com/below-deck

The Woman in Suite 11 by Ruth Ware - https://amzn.to/4gKYDk1

The Woman in Cabin 10 on Netflix - https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/the-woman-in-cabin-10-release-date-photos-news

We Live Here Now by Sarah Pinborough - https://amzn.to/4h7kkKN

Guest’s Links:

Ruth’s website - https://ruthware.com/

Ruth’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/ruthwarewriter/

Ruth’s Twitter - https://x.com/RuthWareWriter

Ruth’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/ruthwarewriter/

Ruth’s Threads - https://www.threads.net/@ruthwarewriter

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:

In this funny, refreshing, and irreverent conversation about parenting, Jen welcomes Caitlin Murray to the show to talk about her Big Time Adulting community space, the blog (and now podcast) that Caitlin started when her 5-year-old son was in cancer treatment for Leukemia, as a place to connect with other moms and parents craving funny, provocative, no-nonsense entertainment to distract themselves from the hamster wheel of life

Like a big sister, Jen offers encouragement to guide Cailin through the years to come, with the two ultimately agreeing that early childhood is hard but middle school is the real shit show.

They commiserate over: 

• Spirit Weeks, PTA obligations, and signing reading logs
• The idea of the 'Hardship Olympics' that creates unnecessary competition among women / moms
• Comparison parenting and why authenticity resonates more with their communities than curated perfection
• How community and humor that can be found in the everyday chaos of parenting

***

Thought-provoking Quotes:

I had begun writing as a therapeutic outlet to family and friends. It was really just for me to put out there how I was feeling on these long days at the hospital and the things that I saw going on around me – the emotion and the stress of it all. I felt like I was protecting myself by saying exactly how I was feeling about what we were going through rather than having anyone assume what I was feeling or thinking. – Caitlin Murray

By the time I had been through hell and back for over three years of pediatric cancer with my son, I knew my worth as a mother. I don’t give a f*ck about what anyone has to say about who I am. I know I am a good damn mom. – Caitlin Murray

The things that you lay in bed at night and obsess over – things that you did poorly, when you lost your shit, you missed something or you messed up – it just falls right out of your kids' brains. It’s not the bones; it’s the soft tissue that sticks and makes it into their adult psyche. ‘I was deeply loved, I lived in a safe, secure home / family, my mom was into me, my mom thinks I’m funny, we laughed a lot in our home.’ That’s the stuff that lasts. Everything else turns into funny, comedic material. – Jen Hatmaker

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

McSweeney’s article - Did You Even Consider Every Possible Lived Experience Before Recklessly Posting Your Chili Recipe on Social Media? - https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/did-you-even-consider-every-possible-lived-experience-before-recklessly-posting-your-chili-recipe-on-social-media

Anne Lamott - https://amzn.to/4h6cwcO

David Sedaris - https://amzn.to/3E48Qtm

Edith Eger - https://amzn.to/4hoXdM4

You’ll Grow Out Of It by Jessi Klein - https://amzn.to/40oiSNm

Guest’s Links:

Caitlin’s website - https://bigtimeadulting.blog/

Caitlin’s Big Time Adulting podcast - https://open.spotify.com/show/7nBEnM3JLnpSsyzxWyKZJJ?si=3b76f80afad345b7

Caitlin’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/bigtimeadulting/

Caitlin’s Twitter - https://x.com/Caitlin98714163

Caitlin’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/OfficialBigTimeAdulting

Caitlin’s Soul Snacks Newsletter - https://bigtimeadulting.beehiiv.com/

Connect with Jen!

Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker

Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices