Keith Ferrazzi: Never Lead Alone

Keith Ferrazzi is an entrepreneur and global thought leader in high-performing teams and Chairman of Ferrazzi Greenlight and its Research Institute. He is the author of the New York Times bestseller Who’s Got Your Back and bestsellers like Never Eat Alone, Leading Without Authority, and Competing in the New World of Work. His newest book with Paul Hill is titled Never Lead Alone: 10 Shifts from Leadership to Teamship*.

Whenever I’m having a conversation with someone about getting better at coaching, it’s almost always through the lens of, “How do I do it well?” In this conversation, Keith and I explore another perspective most of us miss: how does the team do coaching better for each other.

Key Points

• Good leaders give feedback and hold people accountable. Great leaders ensure the team gives feedback and holds people accountable.
• Teamship starts right at the start. Organizations like e.l.f. Beauty begin these practices during onboarding.
• We over-index on mindset. Starting with the right practices will shape the beliefs that help teamship emerge.
• Use an open 360 where people share one thing they appreciate/admire/respect and one thing they suggest.
• The 5/5/5 Learning Roadmap invites team members to share a struggle, respond to questions, and receive feedback.
• We’re used to feedback being directive. Feedback from peers is data. We can consider it without acting on it.

Resources Mentioned

• Never Lead Alone: 10 Shifts from Leadership to Teamship* by Keith Ferrazzi

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How Top Leaders Influence Great Teamwork, with Scott Keller (episode 585)
• Becoming More Coach-Like, with Michael Bungay Stanier (episode 680)
• Team Collaboration Supports Growth Mindset, with Mary Murphy (episode 695)

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Charles Feltman: The Thin Book of Trust

Charles Feltman is the founder of Insight Coaching. He has over 25 years of professional experience coaching, facilitating, consulting to, and training people who lead others. He is the author of The Thin Book of Trust: An Essential Primer for Building Trust at Work*.

It’s a reality of life that we need to interact with some people we’d rather not. And it’s absolutely a reality of leadership, that sometimes we need to have a conversation with someone we don’t quite trust. In this episode, Charles and I explore how to prepare so it goes better for both parties.

Key Points

• The four assessment domains of trust include care, sincerity, reliability, and competence.

Seven steps to prepare for a conversation:

1. Identify the assessment(s) you are concerned with: care, sincerity, reliability, and/or competence.
2. Define the standard you are using.
3. Identify the specific actions or behaviors that have led to your assessment of distrust.
4. Consider what you are doing that may be contributing to the situation.
5. Determine what you need from them in order for them to regain your trust.
6. Decide if you are willing to talk to the person about it.
7. Ask the other person if they would be willing to have a conversation with you.

Resources Mentioned

• The Thin Book of Trust: An Essential Primer for Building Trust at Work* by Charles Feltman

Interview Notes

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Related Episodes

• How to Handle Pushback From Difficult Askers, with Vanessa Patrick (episode 637)
• How to Help Difficult Conversations Go Better, with Sheila Heen (episode 655)
• How to Change People’s Minds, with Michael McQueen (episode 676)

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Stephen M. R. Covey: Trust & Inspire

Stephen M. R. Covey is a New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestselling author and former CEO of Covey Leadership Center. He led the strategy that propelled his father’s book, Dr. Stephen R. Covey’s The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, to become one of the two most influential business books of the 20th Century, according to CEO Magazine. He’s the author The Speed of Trust and more recently Trust & Inspire: How Truly Great Leaders Unleash Greatness in Others*.

Despite everything we know about good leadership, a lot of places still operate in a command and control mindset. In this conversation, Stephen and I explore the key ways to shift from command and control to trust and inspire.

Key Points

• In spite of all progress, most leaders today are still operating from a command and control mindset.
• The carrot and stick approach still dominates most organizational cultures and tactics.
• The biggest barrier to becoming a Trust & Inspire leader is when we think we already are one.
• People are whole people. The best leaders care for the body, heart, mind, and spirit.
• There is enough for everyone. Trust & Inspire leaders elevate caring above competition.
• Enduring influence is created from the inside out. The job of the leader is to go first.
• All people have greatness inside them. Trust & Inspire leaders work to unleash potential, not control it.

Resources Mentioned

• Trust & Inspire: How Truly Great Leaders Unleash Greatness in Others* by Stephen M. R. Covey

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• Leadership Means You Go First, with Keith Ferrazzi (episode 488)
• The Starting Point for Repairing Trust, with Henry Cloud (episode 626)

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Shandy Welch: Leadership Coach

Shandy Welch is an executive leadership coach. Her coaching focus is around humanizing leadership and re-engaging individuals and teams to inspire change and innovation. She is also a Coaching for Leaders Fellow.

Most leaders find themselves — at least occasionally — in conversations with people who intimidate them. In this SaturdayCast, Shandy and I share what’s worked for us and how it might help you have better conversations.

Key Points

• Nervousness is your friend. If you feel it, that means you care. Try to get the butterflies flying in formation.
• You are there because you are the best person to be there. Full stop.
• People with visibility will expect you’ve done your homework. If they’ve put something out into the world, they want you to find it.
• Preparation helps you improvise. “You’ve got to learn your instrument. Then, you practice, practice, practice. And then, when you finally get up there on the bandstand, forget all that and just wail.” -Charlie Parker
• Always assume there is something you can do to help out someone else. Consider their perspective and what they gain from the meeting with you.
• Everybody has doubts and struggles. Remember the humanity that’s present in every interaction.

What was helpful to you from our conversation? We’d love to know. Share it with Shandy at [email protected]

Related Episodes

• How to Talk to People Who Have Power, with Jordan Harbinger (episode 343)
• How to Help People Speak Truth to Power, with Megan Reitz (episode 597)
• Set the Tone for Speaking Up, with Mike Massimino (episode 672)

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Steve Dennis: Leaders Leap

Steve Dennis is a strategy consultant, advisor, speaker, and author focused on transformational leadership and the impact of digital disruption. He is the president of SageBerry Consulting and host of the Remarkable Retail podcast. He’s the author of the book Remarkable Retail and his newest book Leaders Leap: Transforming Your Company at the Speed of Disruption*.

Every leader needs to stay relevant in order to serve well. In this conversation, Steve and I explore the mindset and tactics that will help us lead in the context of an ever-changing world.

Key Points

• Self-sufficiency is a virtue, until it’s not. Learning to ask for help is a key practice for leaders.
• Be cautious about a deserving attitude. High expectations may be correlated with low resilience.
• Seek insight everywhere. It’s no longer sufficient just to gain ideas from direct competitors.
• Turning pro means showing up and doing the work, especially when we don’t feel like it.
• We must go through discomfort, not around it. Radical acceptance of truth will help you stay relevant in changing times.

Resources Mentioned

• Leaders Leap: Transforming Your Company at the Speed of Disruption* by Steve Dennis

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How to Win the Long Game When the Short-Term Seems Bleak, with Dorie Clark (episode 550)
• How to Help People Engage in Growth, with Whitney Johnson (episode 576)
• How to Keep Improving, with Maurice Ashley (episode 697)

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Seth Godin: This is Strategy

Seth Godin has published 21 bestselling books that have changed the way people think about work. He writes one of the most popular blogs in the world, and two of his TED talks are among the most popular of all time. His blog is at seths.blog and his newest book is titled This is Strategy*.

Seth writes this: “It’s not clear to me why business plans are the way they are, but they’re often misused to obfuscate, bore, and show an ability to comply with expectations.” In this conversation, Seth and I explore the key components of a modern business plan.

Key Points

• Big problems require small solutions.
• We often skip strategy because most of us have trained our whole lives for tactics.
• A modern business is clear about systems and the status quo. Use the system if you intend to change the system.
• Assertions are the heart of a business plan. Leaders need to have empathy for someone else’s “better.”
• Articulating alternatives helps you stay resilient when some of your assertions are inevitably wrong.
• Find people to support you who have a track record of shipping.
• A useful business plan gets easier over time and persists (and maybe even thrives) when the world changes.

The six sections of a modern business plan:

1. Truth
2. Assertions
3. Alternatives
4. People
5. Money
6. Time

Resources Mentioned

• This is Strategy* by Seth Godin

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How Leaders Build, with Guy Raz (episode 491)
• How to Grow Your Business, with Donald Miller (episode 629)
• Doing Better Than Zero Sum-Thinking, with Renée Mauborgne (episode 641)

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Maha Abouelenein: 7 Rules of Self-Reliance

Maha Abouelenein is an American Egyptian with more than 30 years of global communications experience advising global corporate giants, startups, governments, CEOs and high-net-worth individuals. She is the CEO of Digital and Savvy, a strategic communications consulting firm with offices in the States and Dubai. Maha is the author of 7 Rules of Self-Reliance: How to Stay Low, Keep Moving, Invest in Yourself and Own Your Future*.

One of the definitions of the word currency in Merriam-Webster’s dictionary is, “General use, acceptance, or prevalence.” All of us want to be both accepted and prevalent in the work we get to do. In this conversation, Maha and I discuss how your reputation is perhaps the most important currency of all.

Key Points

• Personal brand isn’t about self promotion, it’s about leadership.
• Rather than promoting yourself, promote the ideas that you stand for.
• Reputation is currency. It’s the only thing you truly own and its value comes from how other people perceive it.
• Sometimes it’s the right move to take a job to earn. It’s also important to take jobs to learn.
• Knowing what you stand for is key, but this doesn’t come overnight.
• We all make missteps. What’s often more remembered is how you respond. Apologize and have empathy when things go wrong.

Resources Mentioned

• 7 Rules of Self-Reliance: How to Stay Low, Keep Moving, Invest in Yourself and Own Your Future* by Maha Abouelenein

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• Making the Case for Your Promotion, with May Busch (episode 526)
• How to Tell a Story About Yourself, with David Hutchens (episode 661)
• An Invitation for Kindness in Leadership, with James Rhee (episode 693)

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Jonathan Raymond: Good Authority

Jonathan Raymond is the founder of Refound and Ren AI. He helps leaders make work a better place, one conversation at a time. He’s the author of the book Good Authority: How to Become the Leader Your Team Is Waiting for and hosts the podcast of the same name. He’s also the creator of The Accountability Dial, used by many in our community to support healthy accountability in their organizations.

With all the tools and technology we have access to, it’s so easy to fall in the trap of mostly being transactional. Yet, leadership is at its best when it elevates above the transaction and builds the broader relationship. In this conversation, Jonathan and I discuss how to make that shift.

Key Points

• While the pandemic helped us shift in some helpful ways, it also created an environment where leaders don’t always feel safe with healthy accountability.
• The most healthy conversations have consequences if change does not happen.
• The primary obstacle to holding people accountable is fear. Leaders will find times when then not able to defend themselves.
• Having access to too much detail is a recipe for micromanagement. The best feedback moves away from transitional and towards relational.
• Find places of retreat to spend unstructured, non-transactional time.
• Don’t let the perfect get in the way of the good. Hold people accountable for the qualities of leadership, not the outcomes.

Resources Mentioned

• Ren AI: a platform of AI-powered tools built on the Good Authority methodology
• Good Authority: How to Become the Leader Your Team Is Waiting For* by Jonathan Raymond

Related Episodes

• Five Steps to Hold People Accountable, with Jonathan Raymond (episode 306)
• How to Give Feedback, with Russ Laraway (episode 583)
• How to Connect with People Better, with Charles Duhigg (episode 670)

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Dan Dworkis: The Emergency Mind

Dan Dworkis is Chief Medical Officer at The Mission Critical Team Institute. He’s an emergency physician who helps individuals and teams apply knowledge under extreme pressure and perform at their best when it matters the most. He is the author of The Emergency Mind: Wiring Your Brain for Performance Under Pressure*.

Every leader, at least occasionally, faces emergencies. In an emergency, the only way out is through. In this conversation, Dan and I explore the mindsets and tactics that will help us handle the most difficult situations.

Key Points

• Emergencies are not just worse bad days. They are liminal — the only way out is through.
• Apply graduated pressure. Never allow suffering to be wasted. By going a bit slower, you notice where and why failures happen.
• Label an emergency with language that both recognizes the urgency of the situation and your faith in the team to resolve it.
• The room is always smarter than any one person in it. Tell people what problem they are working and your confidence level in it.
• Staying cool under pressure is not a fixed personality trait. You can get better by noticing and experimenting with what works for you (and doesn’t) to handle high-pressure situations.
• Experience makes working under pressure easier, but you still need to practice for it. Notice what’s effective (and not) in past and new situations before you experiment.
• Use situations in everyday life (a hard workout, an angry customer, getting cut off in traffic) to train yourself for responding in the toughest situations.

Resources Mentioned

• The Emergency Mind: Wiring Your Brain for Performance Under Pressure* by Dan Dworkis

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How to Become the Person You Want to Be, with James Clear (episode 376)
• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• How to Prevent a Team From Repeating Mistakes, with Robert “Cujo” Teschner (episode 660)

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Andrew C.M. Cooper: The Ethical Imperative

Andrew C.M. Cooper is an executive leader and apologist for compassionate business practices. He led as a history-making first Millennial and Black executive to serve as General Counsel of UPS Airlines, the world’s largest logistics airline with over 20,000 employees. His team was essential to the success of Operation Warp Speed, the United States’ pandemic vaccine relief effort. He’s the author of The Ethical Imperative: Leading with Conscience to Shape the Future of Business*.

We all know the power of relationships to help us grow. However, we don’t always seek out some of the non-traditional relationships that might help most. In this conversation, Andrew and I discuss three types of people we often overlook that will help us grow.

Key Points

• Many of us invest in organic, traditional relationships. Those are important, but not sufficient in such a dynamic world.
• Invest 30% of your time into relationships that will add skills, knowledge, or insights you can’t develop yourself.
• Shifters observe well, read between the lines, and help us adapt in uncertain and changing situations.
• Connectors will help your expand professional affiliations. Having a connector in your corner can be as helpful as being a connector yourself.
• People who first appear as sharks may be benevolent antagonists. Listen for what others around them say to determine who might challenge you in healthy ways.

Resources Mentioned

• The Ethical Imperative: Leading with Conscience to Shape the Future of Business* by Andrew C.M. Cooper

Interview Notes

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

Related Episodes

• How to Strengthen Your Network, with Marissa King (episode 525)
• How to Build a Network While Still Doing Everything Else, with Ruth Gotian (episode 591)
• How to Recognize Remarkable People, with Guy Kawasaki (episode 671)

Production Credit

Coaching for Leaders is edited by Andrew Kroeger. Production support is provided by Sierra Priest.

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Laura West: Coaching for Leaders Fellow Laura West is a seasoned leader and researcher with many years experience executing and training others in data analysis and strategy. She's led large teams across several organizations, holds a Ph.D. in linguistics, and is an alum of the Coaching for Leaders Academy. She was selected as one of our new Coaching for Leaders fellows and has taken on a leadership role in supporting our current Academy members. What do you do when you get a request from a stakeholder, but don’t have the resources to fulfill it? That’s a reality almost every leader faces. In this conversation, Laura and I discuss both the mindset and tactics that will help you respond well. Key Points Rather than an immediate “no,” spend an hour working through some steps to creatively problem solve around the request. Show your work. When you respond, share who you’ve talked with and what’s already been considered to respond to the request. Present options by summarizing 2-4 paths forward and your recommendations. Be the data person. Highlight trends over time that help influence different business decisions and maintain your credibility. Prioritize. But tell, don’t ask. Take the lead on identifying what’s important on behalf of the stakeholder and begin the work. Resources Mentioned Responding to Stakeholder Requests With Limited Resources by Laura West (free membership required) Related Episodes The Way to Turn Followers Into Leaders, with David Marquet (episode 241) How to Start Managing Up, with Tom Henschel (episode 433) The Way to Influence Executives, with Nancy Duarte (episode 450) Discover More Activate your free membership for full access to the entire library of interviews since 2011, searchable by topic. To accelerate your learning, uncover more inside Coaching for Leaders Plus.