What are the things you can control in your business? What are the things that we can look at? Identifying the very specific companies, the very specific industries that we need to be able to interact with, to be able to get our customers as close to what they need as possible.

We might not be able to get them exactly what they want at the price they want it. But most of them are going to understand that. Most clients are not going to blame you for the fact that the economy is doing certain things, or that there are things happening in the world.

David: Hi, and welcome back. In today’s episode, cohost Kevin Rosenquist and I will be discussing focusing on things you can control. Welcome back, Kevin.

Kevin: Hey, it’s great to be here, David. I always am a big preacher around the house of “control what you can control.” You know, I can’t do everything. So control what you can control. So I’m excited to talk about this.

David: Yeah, it’s a really good topic, both from a personal standpoint and from a business standpoint. It’s so easy to get caught up in the day to day of what’s going on outside our own environments. Especially with the news. Everybody’s talking about different things that are happening regarding the economy, the stock market, all kinds of things that are happening.

When we focus too much on the things that are outside of our control, we basically abdicate the things we can work on that move the needle for us.

Kevin: Do you feel like people are even more focused on stuff they can’t control? Like what’s happening in the world and in the news now because of how much news is thrown at us in so many different ways with social media and whatnot?

David: I think so. Yeah. I think it’s always been like this. But yes, it does seem to be more of an epidemic lately, than maybe it has been in the past.

I remember being exposed to this concept, I think it was in the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People.

Stephen Covey was talking about your sphere of influence.

Kevin: Mm-hmm.

David: Where you basically draw a circle and you say, okay, inside this circle is what I can control. And everything outside. It is what I can’t control, which is basically the world and everything else. Right.

Kevin: Which is, which is a lot of stuff.

David: It is a lot of stuff. If this is the circle, then everything outside the circle off into infinity is the stuff you can’t control. Exactly.

In a situation like that, the more you focus inside your sphere of influence, the bigger it gets.

So when you’re focusing on the things that you have control of, you end up having control of more things.

When you focus your attention outside the sphere of influence, the smaller it gets. That’s because you’re not working on the things you can actually control.

And so for those of us in business… When we are able to really pay attention to that, you can grow your sphere of influence. You can control more of your own environment to accomplish the things you’re looking to accomplish.

Kevin: Absolutely. So let ‘s get a little specific here. Let’s talk about sales for a second. ’cause one of the things I think about with sales is that sales teams can get really tied up with market conditions and what competitors are doing and all that.

How can sales teams kind of focus on what they can directly influence.

David: That is such a brilliant example because it’s so true. In sales meetings very often you’ll have conversations. “Well, this person’s doing this, or this person’s doing that. Or these people are cutting their price.” It’s all valid.

Those are all things that may actually be happening in the marketplace that we have to respond to.

But the first thing to do in that situation is to say, how can we flip the script on this?

How can we turn this into something that we can do that is going to be better, different, and received by the market in a way that makes what they’re doing less important.

Because we’re not going to be able to control what they do, or how they do things. That’s outside our sphere.

Now, being aware of those things is good. But then it really boils back down to what are we doing in our business that is causing that to be a problem to us?

Because if we’re doing things well in our business, then whatever it is that they’re doing shouldn’t be a problem.

Of course, that’s not always the case.

I mean, there are things that they’ll do that are going to cause us to have to adjust, adapt, all that sort of thing. But when we focus on the things that are actually within our control, then all of that becomes a lot easier.

Kevin: Sticking with sales a little bit, I feel like a lot companies or a lot of sales teams have a really long sales cycle, which can make it really tough to focus on the things you can control.

Is that something you see? Is there any advice for people on how to take their sales cycle and bring it down to a place where they can manage it better?

David: Yeah, that’s a great question as well. I think a lot of times the sales process is maybe longer than it has to be, depending on the frequency of contact and the way that we’re able to interact with people to accelerate it.

Now, as you indicated, there are some professions where the sales cycle is going to be longer in some than in others. you can’t really change that.

The only thing you can really do from a circle of influence standpoint in terms of what we can do, is to make sure that we are there in front of them in advance of every bit of information we need from them, all the things that we’re going to need to be able to get from them, and to make sure that they’re staying on track with whatever they have to do in order to move the sales process forward.

Kevin: Mm-hmm. You know, we talked a little bit last episode about automation, ai, stuff like that, which I’m sure it’s going to come up probably every episode.

But can businesses get too distracted by that, where they’re not focusing on what’s already working and they’re just sitting there chasing the next cool new thing?

David: I think shiny object syndrome is real. Yes. That can definitely happen. I imagine that’s happening in some organizations. In a sense I almost wish that more people were paying attention to it and trying to figure out how to integrate it now as opposed to later.

It seems to me that a lot of people are sort of thinking about it in general terms and focused on it in general terms, which is sort of outside the sphere, right?

So if we’re looking into things like how to best use AI in our business. Then you want to say, okay, well how can I apply it with what I’m doing now?

What can I do to be able to utilize AI to allow me to be in touch with these people in a better timeline, a better timeframe to be able to provide them with more helpful and useful information in a faster way so that we can keep things moving forward.

So I think as long as we’re utilizing the tools that we have available to us to be able to focus on our primary goals of whatever growing business, growing sales, making sure that we’re outperforming our competition, then we’re focused on the right things.

Kevin: How do you kind of coach people or business owners when you talk to them about staying with the times, but not going too far and chasing that shiny object?

Especially if someone may be not all that tech, you know, they might be tech averse. So like how do you coach people?

David: A lot of times in the conversations I’m having with clients, the shiny object thing is definitely an issue.

So part of it is just pulling back on that and saying, okay, let’s see how that actually works into what you need to do. Because it’s really tempting. You see something shiny, you want to go after it.

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve talked to people and they’re like, well, you know, I want to focus on sales, but I really need to get my website done first. And I’m like, okay, well, that’s usually a big project. It usually takes a lot of time, more time than you need.

It usually takes more money than you need and it needs to be funded by something.

So there’s an example of where I will say to a client, listen, I think if we focus on this one thing first, we can allow you to generate the money, the revenue you need to be able to fix up your website without you having to take a lot of time to do it because you can pay somebody else to do it.

So I think a lot of it boils down to identifying what is the thing that they really need to get done so that we can then gear their time and attention, gear their activities toward the activities that’ll make it happen.

Kevin: About five years ago, almost exactly I think, we had one of the ultimate things that we cannot control in a pandemic.

How do some businesses Thrive? What do they do differently in those situations to stay alive? I mean, obviously certain ones, there’s only so much you can do, but when you saw what businesses survived or even might have thrived during that time, what did you see them do?

David: The biggest thing was the ones who stuck their heads in the sand, they were DOA.

They were just out of luck. Because they were too scared to move and too scared to move is not a good recipe in business.

So at the time, the biggest focus that we were working on with our clients was to make sure that they were just remaining engaged. They were getting in touch with their prospects and clients in the ways that they could, because all of a sudden it all changed.

Right? And there are salespeople who only sold face to face. So the first thing for them is, okay, can’t sell face to face. How are we going to do it?

Which different marketing vehicles are we going to use to reach people? Is it going to be more email? Will it be more text? Is it going to be more Zoom meetings? What is it going to be?

How are you approaching them now and how are we going to approach them moving forward?

Because those small hinges are the things that swing the big doors. And in situations like that, people are so focused on the macro that they forget they need to focus on the micro of remaining in touch with people.

Having the conversations, advancing the dialogue, people were saying, okay, well nobody’s buying anything. And that is just never true.

You know, there’s always someone buying something, but if you think that no one’s buying, then you’re not going to go after them, and you’re not going to be able to find the people who are.

So, it’s still needles and haystacks, there may be more hay and fewer needles, or there may be less hay and less needles. But our goal is to find it.

Our goal is to dig through and find it, regardless of what’s going on. But a lot of that is all about focus.

Kevin: Right now, we’ve got certainly lots of other things happening, lot of uncertainty. There are tariffs, there are all sorts of things.

How can business owners and management teams sort of make sure they’re focusing on those things that they can control and try to help keep the outside noise to a minimum?

David: That’s a great question. I think a lot of people get focused on the idea of something and they forget that the rest of the world is aware of all this.

It’s like, oh, my customers, what are my customers going to say if I have to charge them more money? Well, they know what’s going on. right?, You’re seeing it too. That’s not different.

So once again, if we stay within our circles of influence, we say, alright, well what can I do to control this?

If I’m utilizing a supply chain that is dependent on a lot of overseas products, then can I identify some US companies that are able to do that? Or can I identify some markets that are less affected?

Once again, we just have to look at what are the things that we can actually control? What are the things that we can look at?

Identifying the very specific companies, the very specific industries that we need to be able to interact with, to be able to get our customers as close to what they need as possible.

We might not be able to get them exactly what they want at the price they want it, but most of them are going to understand it.

Most clients are not going to blame you for the fact that the economy is doing certain things, or that there are things happening in the world.

If we stop the focus on that because we can drive ourselves crazy with that sort of thing.

Kevin: Absolutely.

David: We can literally drive ourselves nuts with that sort of thing. And that’s not smart.

We need to say, okay, this is happening, this is reality. Right? One of my favorite quotes of all time is from, Byron Katie, who said, “whenever I argue with reality, I lose, but only 100% of the time.”

And this is about arguing with reality. This is the reality, so how are we going to address reality?

When you focus on that and you put the rest of it to the side, you are going to beat your competition so soundly, they’re not going to know what happened. Because they just get their heads all tied up in this stuff and it’s not worth it.

Kevin: Yeah. I think we all kind of, as business people, sometimes we’ll get so focused on that. “Oh God, my client’s going to be upset,” or “they’re not going to like that this is happening.”

And in my experience, a very high percentage of the time, they’re very understanding and they get it. ‘Cause they’re business people too.

David: That’s right. And if they don’t, you’ve got to look at that client and say, okay, well, if they’re unreasonable, if they don’t understand what’s happening, and if I can’t explain it to them, then, you know, maybe they need a hiatus.

Maybe you need to take a break from them for a while and find the people who get it. Because there are always people who get it.

Kevin: Absolutely. Yeah. All right, so for anybody listening out there who feels like they need to figure out how to focus more on the things that they can control, how can they get more insight from you?

David: Schedule a call, TopSecrets.com/call. Love to have a conversation with you.

If you’re looking for those small hinges that swing the big doors, if you’re looking for the things that you can control inside your business, focus on those things so that you can continue to grow your own circle of influence then go to that URL: TopSecrets.com/call.

We’d love to have a conversation with you.

Kevin: Awesome. Thanks so much, David. Great chatting with you as usual.

David: Thank you, Kevin.

Ready to Tackle the Things You CAN Control in Your Business?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

We’d love to help you to get from here to there in terms of eliminating waste in your business. When you’re focused on getting those things done and when you’ve got processes and procedures in place to allow you to accomplish it more quickly, then everything gets a whole lot better.

David: Hi, and welcome back. In today’s episode, co-host Kevin Rosenquist, and I will be discussing eliminating waste in your business. Welcome, Kevin.

Kevin: Great to see you. David. Excited to be here.

David: I’m excited to have you here.

Kevin: Yeah, so we’re talking waste, obviously waste in business. There’s different kinds of waste.

A lot of people will immediately think of money, but that’s not really what we’re talking about, is it?

David: Well, some of what we’re talking about, I guess. Yeah. There’s been a lot of talk about finding and eliminating waste in the news. So I thought, how does that really apply when you’re operating a business?

Kevin: Mm-hmm.

David: Anyone in business, particularly small to medium sized businesses, must be aware of the fact that there is always likely to waste in the business.

And as you pointed out, I mean, very often it starts with money. We’re afraid that we might be wasting money, and in many cases we are.

Kevin: Sure.

David: But for most businesses who are reasonably run well, that’s usually not the biggest thing.

Kevin: What would you say is the biggest thing, or can you give me like your top three?

David: Okay, sure. Yeah. I think for most of us it probably starts with time.

Kevin: Yeah.

David: Because the time that we waste is something that we can never get back.

I think I heard Brian Tracy say this years ago. If you lose money, you can always make more, but if you run out of time, that’s it. All the money in the world won’t help you. That’s pretty much how it went.

Kevin: Yeah. I mean, there’s no going back. So far they haven’t figured out a way.

David: No. We have not figured out a way to do that.

So when we look at our days, weeks or even hours, we look at things like meetings. Are our meetings productive?

Are our processes organized or disorganized? What are the distractions like during the course of a day? Because when we’re focusing on one thing and then we’re distracted and we have to switch back and forth, it requires flipping the switches in our brains and getting ourselves adjusted to the new thing that we’re thinking about.

All of those things consume time, which is, in many cases, even worse than money when we start wasting it.

Kevin: You brought up a good one, meetings. And I think that’s something, especially in this day and age of Zoom calls and all that stuff. I have a lot of friends who are in the corporate world or in the business world, and they talk about the needless meetings, the constant need for them, for people to feel like you got to get the crew together.

Why are small businesses and medium sized businesses so focused on that and how can they like pull back?

David: Yeah, it’s a great question. I think there are some people who just feel like it’s necessary. I think there are some business owners, some managers who feel like their presence in everyone’s day-to-day life is critical

Kevin: Right.

David: And that’s true more of some people than others. Some employees are happy to be able to just do their own thing and get everything done. Others do need more interaction.

So it is an individual kind of thing. I think most business owners have to take a look at that and say, how much of me do they need? How much of their sales managers do they need?

But being aware of the fact that each time we force everyone to get together, the clock is running. The clock’s running on everyone. And when you have a bunch of people on one meeting, that means that all those people are tied up for that period of time.

And if it’s not productive for everyone on that meeting or in that meeting, then it may make sense to do things a little differently.

Kevin: Yeah, we’ve all been in that situation where someone calls a meeting and you’re just like, “oh, come on. I have so much to do, I don’t wanna do this!”

David: Right. Yeah.

Kevin: Yeah.

David: It’s funny because I think in a lot of cases, employers are thinking that way and employees are thinking that way, but the one is not thinking that the other is thinking that way necessarily. Right?

Kevin: Of course.

David: So there’s that disconnect sometimes. But I do believe that time is probably one of the biggest things that we need to look at, particularly in small to medium sized businesses.

Beyond the time then, you mentioned the idea of money, obviously that’s the first thing that most people think of when it comes to not wanting to waste things inside your business.

When I think of wasting money in a business, some of the things that leap to mind first are things like marketing that doesn’t work, marketing that doesn’t convert.

Kevin: Mm-hmm.

David: And things like that. That can be a time waster as well as a money waster depending on what you’re doing.

Kevin: Yeah, well, a lot of marketing, you know, we’re both marketing people like the, a lot of marketing efforts are very time consuming. They’re very all consuming, you know, as far as if that’s your job. It’s like that kind of becomes your focus for whatever period of time to get that rolling.

And if it’s not successful, there’s waste right there.

David: Yeah, exactly. And when we think what we’re doing is supposed to produce a result and it doesn’t, then we really have to start reevaluating what’s going on.

I think a lot of that boils down to the tracking that we’re either doing or not doing to see how well our activities are actually paying for themselves in that regard.

Kevin: What about data? Like I feel like we’re so obsessed with data right now, and for good reason. I mean, like it’s so available to us now. Do you feel like people might spend too much time worrying about the customer data or how to use it effectively? Trying to collect every piece of data they can?

David: Yeah, it’s a great question, and I think in some cases people do. I think the opposite is also true, maybe in more cases than not. Where sales representatives are maybe not capturing the data they need to be able to advance the process. I think a lot of times in a sales situation, the focus is on closing in a lot of cases, which is important.

I’m not taking anything away from that, but when you’re having a conversation with someone and you say, “alright, what do I need to advance the sales process in the next conversation,” right?

Kevin: Mm-hmm.

David: Is it a piece of information that I need? Is it something specific that I’m waiting for to be able to sort of seed the ground and say, okay, so when we get together on Thursday, let’s make sure we have this, this, and this.

We can make sure those things are lined up so we have access to the things that we need to move forward. In fact, that’s probably a good topic for a future podcast. We should look at that.

Kevin: Yeah, I would say so.

David: All right. but those types of things are really critical in terms of what are we going to capture?

In a lot of cases, one of the biggest things we want to capture is what is the next step for the next meeting?

When is it going to happen, and what needs to happen in that meeting? So that each contact that we have with a prospect or a client has purpose and we know what that purpose is and we know what to look for in those conversations.

Kevin: Another example of waste, of wasted conversation, wasted time with clients, wasted meetings. Those meetings don’t just have to be internal, they can be external as well.

David: Right.

Kevin: Where you’re not getting to the point where you need to get to.

David: Yeah. And that tends to happen a lot. When we look at these different things, you look at time waste, you look at money waste, there’s another one that I think is big, which people may not consider, and that is energy.

I mean, we each have a limited supply of energy in the day, right?

Kevin: Yeah.

David: Some people are morning people, some people are nighttime people.

So our natural energy peaks at different times a day. And just looking at that sometimes and saying, okay, well, how can I make sure that when I’ve got the most energy, I’m being the most productive?

Because if I’m wasting my sort of personal prime time, then the likelihood of success goes down quite a bit.

Kevin: And speaking of energy mine’s at a dipping David, so don’t expect much from me for the rest of this episode. Okay?

David: Okay.

Kevin: You kind of led the talk about what’s going on in the news and stuff like that. And of course, that comes down to talent, to people. Like that’s what is happening. A lot of people are getting let go of their positions, whether it’s the government or the tech sector. You’re seeing it a lot.

Obviously there can definitely be waste with people. How can business owners and companies identify where that waste is in their talent without resorting to mass layoffs or without putting too many people out.

David: Yeah, in the kinds of business that we interact with, with small and medium sized businesses, it’s a different thing. I mean, ’cause obviously you’re not going to have mass layoffs in a small company.

Kevin: True.

David: But most people, particularly, you know, when the economy’s a little uncertain, people aren’t really sure, do I need to start cutting costs from a personnel standpoint?

It’s a big decision, and in those circumstances it usually makes the most sense to say, okay, where are the holes in the bucket, essentially?

In most small to medium sized businesses, it’s very likely that there are people who are probably the go-to’s when it comes to not pulling their weight.

It’s not a popular conversation to have, but in most businesses it’s true.

Of course, that also goes to how well are we tracking what’s going on in our own organization? Are we aware of what people are doing on a day-to-day basis?

Now in sales, if salespeople are tracking their calls and if they’re making notes about who they’re interacting with and all that sort of thing, then there’s documentation behind that.

You can see sort of who’s doing what and what sort of impact it’s having. If their sales are trailing off, is that because of what they’re doing or is it because of the effort they’re putting in?

So as long as you’re reporting systems are okay, you can usually spot that kind of thing in a small to medium sized business in a way that you can adjust it when it becomes necessary.

Kevin: That’s a great point too, as far as, especially with small businesses, I feel like a small business is more prone to not doing that tracking that you’re talking about.

’cause they don’t have systems in place. It’s more of a “Hey, we’re all cool. Everybody do their job and we’re gonna be fine.” You know, I mean, so there’s not a lot of tracking. There’s not a lot of accountability there.

David: Yeah. And it’s a very easy trap to fall into, particularly in small businesses where small business owners very often engage in management by abdication.

It’s like, okay, mm-hmm. You do it. I’m out of here. I’m going to go do my thing. You go do your thing.

Kevin: Right.

David: And if there aren’t reporting procedures in place that allow everybody who needs to know in the organization who’s doing what and that it’s happening, those kind of things can get out of control pretty quickly.

Kevin: No doubt. Well, kind of piggybacking off of that, to some degree, automation’s a big thing that people talk about, whether it’s AI or automation’s been around for a long time, but it’s definitely getting to another level with ai.

How can companies balance the need for the human touch versus maybe a position that might be wasted, what they can use with automation instead.

David: Yeah. That’s becoming more and more of an issue, and I think the challenge is being able to utilize the technology to be able to allow the people to do more and better.

I tend to think of it in those terms more so than in terms of, okay, well who can I replace with automation?

Kevin: Yeah.

David: Who can I replace with ai? Right? Because when we’ve got good people in our organizations, we want them to be able to do better. We want them to be able to do more with the resources.

So when you’ve got resources like that, it’s no longer about who’s getting replaced with ai. It’s like who’s going to be able to use the AI in a way that will allow them to do their jobs better and more efficiently.

Because that creates job security for people, as opposed to creating problems and having them lose their jobs because they’re not keeping up with the tech.

Kevin: Yes, very good point. And maybe technology can also help us in other ways. Like what might be considered opportunity waste, where businesses might be spending way too much time and back to your energy, way too much energy chasing low quality leads or just ones that aren’t ever gonna get anywhere instead of nurturing existing relationships.

Is that another place that you see a lot of waste and are there ways for people to utilize technology to avoid that?

David: Well, yeah, I think anybody, particularly who is paying attention right now with everything going on with ai, it’s not always a focus for everyone, and that’s perfectly understandable.

For some people it’s like, oh, okay, well I don’t have time for that.

Kevin: Mm-hmm.

David: The truth of the matter is with the way things are going, better find some time for that. You’d better be able to find some time to at least look into it and say, “how can I use this?” Not just “can I use this,” but “how can I use this?”

What can I do that would allow me to save my own time, save my people’s time to be able to allow them to get things done better and more efficiently and more effectively?

Because as things get tighter, as things get a little crazier in business, those are the types of things that are going to give those who are paying attention a big advantage.

Kevin: Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, this very interesting conversation about waste. It’s definitely something that a lot of people need to know more about. If people want to get more information from you, what’s the best way?

David: You can go to TopSecrets.com/call, schedule a call with myself or my team, we’d love to help you to get from here to there in terms of being able to eliminate the waste in your business.

A lot of times, when we’re looking to grow, the challenge is to be able to get in touch with the people that you need as quickly as possible. Get them qualified in or out as quickly as possible, so that you can be onto the people who actually are ready, willing, and able to do business with you.

Those are the types of things that when you’re focused on getting those things done and when you’ve got processes and procedures in place to allow you to accomplish it more quickly, then everything gets a whole lot better. So TopSecrets.com/call.

Kevin: Awesome. Well thanks David. Really appreciate it. It was great chatting with you.

David: Thanks a lot Kevin.

Are You Ready to Start Eliminating Waste in Your Business?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

If we look at the idea of reactivating your client base in as many ways as possible, it means interacting with the people who have spent the money with us and doing that at a personal level, building the relationship, that’s about the best thing we can do.

David: Hi, and welcome to the podcast. In today’s episode, cohost Jay McFarland, and I will be discussing reactivating your client base. Welcome Jay.

Jay: It’s good to be here. You know, it’s funny. I hear this everywhere I go now. If I watch Shark Tank or anything else, I hear this term CAC. You know, what is your CAC? And it’s your customer acquisition cost.

And I have to believe that your CAC, for a customer you’ve already worked with, has got to be lower than trying to bring in a brand new customer. Am I right?

David: Oh, absolutely. And I think instinctively as business people, we probably already know this. We’ve probably heard it a hundred times, but the purpose of this discussion is not to have you hear it again. The purpose of this discussion is to ask, “are you doing this?” And if so, how well are you doing this? How much better could you be doing this?

Because as you pointed out, once you’ve invested that money to acquire a customer, now you want to be able to leverage that relationship as much as possible to provide them with additional help, additional solutions so that you can generate the revenue. They can get the results they’re looking for, and you’re not spending more money to attract people. You’re able to just expand the relationships that you have with the people who you’ve already acquired that first time.

Jay: Yeah. And I think it’s disappointing if you spent that money for customer acquisition and then you don’t have a system to retain them or keep them online. And so now it’s almost like you’re spending the same money twice. If you’re trying to get them back again.

David: Right. Yes. And so when we think about reactivation, there are a couple of aspects to it. One is just people who haven’t bought from you in a little while, to touch base with them again, to reengage those people and to see what they want, what they need. Essentially, requalifying them to find out where they are in that process.

Are they ready to buy more things? Do they have a date in mind when they want to buy? Are they ready to go now? Or are they just not ready to do anything? Are they sort of disqualified for the moment? Are they unresponsive to you?

Because they’ll generally fall into one of those five categories. They’re either ready to buy. They have dates in mind when they want to buy. They’re open to the idea, but not sure when. Or they’re disqualified, or they’re not responsive.

When you are able to go back and sort of requalify your existing clients, you can reactivate the ones who are ready to go now. You can schedule the ones who know when they want to go next. And the ones who are generally receptive, you can just stay in touch.

Jay: Yeah. Or what about the ones who were disappointed, but they didn’t take the time. Right? So many customers will never tell you that they had a bad experience. They just move on and…

David: Yeah.

Jay: you had no idea. So you’re not improving your customer service and your chance of reviving that customer is very low.

David: Yeah. And that’s an excellent point, too. Because as you indicated, if you don’t know that, but you’re reaching out to them to see how you can help next, and you find out about that problem, then at least you have the possibility of restoring the relationship, if not doing anything about the previous order.

Jay: Yeah. So what are we talking about here? Like good drip campaigns? Is that kind of where you would start? So you’re in constant contact? What do you think is the best way to go about this?

David: Well, I do think it starts with engaging your people. You can engage your people in a lot of different ways. It can be done via email with a drip campaign. You can also do it on the phone. Or it can be done in person.

There are lots of different ways that we can engage with people. But recognizing that there is a tendency, sometimes, after we’ve sold something, to immediately move on to the next thing. “Okay. That’s taken care of. That’s done. Now I’m onto the next thing.”

And then we sort of forget about that person until we either hear back from them. Or until and unless we’ve got some sort of procedure in place, in our own businesses, to remind us to go back to those people and see where they are in the process. And see how we can help them again.

So I would say it starts with engagement. Just recognize that we need to constantly engage with the people who have provided us with a hundred percent of the revenue we’ve generated to date, right? That’s what they’ve done.

Before you look for three more people to add to the list, make sure that the ones you have don’t need anything. Because you’ll be saving yourself a lot of money and you’ll be better satisfying the people that you’ve already paid to acquire.

Second thing I would look to do is to ask questions. Find out what’s going on in their heads — what they’re thinking, what they need, what they’re open to, and their timelines, that type of thing.

So it’s relatively easy to do. And because you already have a relationship with them, they’re going to be a lot more likely to answer those questions than if you were talking to somebody who you’ve never engaged with before. So I think engaging, asking questions and really trying to connect with the important people in your business, your existing clients, wherever you can.

Jay: I do see this a lot more now. The minute that I finish placing an order online or in an app, I suddenly, instantly get the “how did we do?” Then the stars come up. And they’re instantly asking, “how did we do?” Sometimes it’s frustrating for me because if it’s something that they’re shipping to me, I’m like, “well, I don’t know how you did yet, because I don’t know what your product is.”

Others are designed to where that question happens after it’s been shipped. So they have a system that’s set up. They know it just arrived at my house and then boom, I get the email. And it says, “how did we do?” And I think it’s very, very smart to be asking that question right away. My background’s the restaurant business. So I always go back to restaurants. It’s you’ve delivered the food. Now you wait a few minutes and you come back, they’ve had a chance to taste the food. Now I’m going to say, “how is everything?” And make sure that everybody’s happy.

David: Yeah, that’s true. And in a lot of other types of businesses that is not done. Obviously, as you indicated in a restaurant, people are going to ask, how is everything? What else can I get you? That type of thing.

But in a lot of other businesses that doesn’t happen. Or doesn’t happen consistently. One of the things that we encourage our clients to do is to have a procedure in place for after an order is delivered. So that they’re getting the product and then you know, within a certain period of time when that should have arrived and you’re touching base with them to find out.

A lot of my clients in the print and promotions industry, particularly if it’s a promotional product that was shipped from a supplier, the distributor who sold it might not know exactly when that arrived. And so that person might assume that yes, it arrived exactly as it was supposed to. I didn’t hear anything. That’s all good. And that’s not a good assumption to make.

Particularly now with supply chain issues and with delivery issues on a lot of things. You don’t want to make those types of assumptions.

And so if you schedule out the idea of contacting somebody within a day or two, after that should have arrived, to find out, did you get it? Was everything good? Are there any concerns that you have? You’re far better off doing that than waiting until there’s a problem and having them call you. Because at that point you’re going to have to be a lot more reactive. You’re not being proactive and clients don’t like that at all.

Jay: Yeah. Yeah, you can still salvage the situation, but it’s much harder.

The other thing that I’ve noticed about the follow-up, the follow-up survey, is it’s actually a great opportunity for the upsell. Right?

David: Right.

Jay: You know, if they’re like, you know, you’ve got five stars, Hey, how did we do? They’re like, Five stars. And then you’re like, Hey, just wanted to let you know, we’ve got this special on this and it’s similar to what you just bought. To me, it’s a great way to keep that sales process going, if they were happy.

David: It is, and it’s just good relationship building. It’s the type of thing, once again, we should be doing this anyway. We should be interacting with the people who spend money with us. Finding out what they need and how we can help them.

And the one other thing that I would say, particularly now, with the ability to have various groups. You can have Facebook groups and things like that. The idea of creating a community is, I think, very overlooked by a lot of business people.

And if you’re interested in keeping your clients engaged and interacting, then by creating a community where you can interact with them on an ongoing basis, and they can, in some cases, interact with each other, it creates more of a bond than they would likely have with somebody if they’re just doing more of a transactional type of thing.

Jay: Yeah, I love that you brought this up because you know, there was a time when you’d be the mom and pop store and they’d have to come in the front door and you knew everybody by name. You probably knew about their kids. You’re always asking ’em questions.

All of that aspect of relationship building in business is really gone with online sales. So the question is how do you revive it? How do you apply that relationship word to a digital world? And it’s not easy, but there are people who pull it off.

David: Yeah. And I think it’s not easy because it’s not particularly intuitive.

We look at the tools we have at hand and we say, okay, I can post things. I can make comments. I can click “like.” I can post video. You can look at all the different things that you can do. But you don’t think of it strategically in terms, necessarily, of relationship building, which is really what should be happening.

How can I post something that is going to be helpful to people that’s going to get them to engage with me? How can I comment in a way that is not designed to just try to get to the next sale, but to let them know that I’m actually interested? That I’m another human being, taking in air on the planet, who is interested in what’s going on with them.

So a lot of the things that we might normally tend to do in person automatically. We sort of forget how to do when we’re online. And it’s really just a matter of reconnecting with the idea of… if it’s a person interacting with another person, how can I do that in a way that’s not going to be really annoying?

Jay: Yeah, and I think it also depends on the size of your business. If you’re a smaller operation, you may have the time and the ability to pick up the phone and call your customers and just say, Hey, thanks. And just wanted to see how the process went. And, get any ideas, but you know, if you’re doing, a thousand orders a day, that’s just not going to happen.

You could hire a company to do that. And some do, and it can be very valuable. But I think finding any way you can, to follow up on that order, to find out how it went, what their impression of you is, what is the likelihood that they would use you again? This is invaluable information if you’re going to stay alive in today’s competitive world.

David: Yeah. And even sending a follow-up email like that is the kind of thing now, that can be automated a lot easier than it could have even three or four years ago. So there are really no excuses. I think sometimes small businesses say, well, I can’t do that. I’m not Amazon. I can’t do that. Well, you probably can.

You can probably have an assistant. Or even a virtual assistant who could send out an email to ask how something went. And it’s really just a matter of having the will to do it rather than anything else.

Jay: Yeah. The will to do it and then having a system to follow up on it. Cuz some people are just not good.

I’ve always looked. And I think we’ve mentioned this before, but I’ve always looked at a breakdown in your system as an opportunity to build loyalty. They’re not perfect, but man, if they mess up, they are going to just take care of it so well. I’m going to go back to that company over and over again, instead of the company that tries to blame other people or you know, it wasn’t us or makes it very hard to complain and things like that. Customer issues are an opportunity to get loyalty in my opinion.

David: Absolutely. And it’s part of a process that should be taking place regardless. But, to nutshell it, if we look at the idea of reactivating our client base in as many ways as possible, interacting with the people who have spent the money with us and doing that at a personal level, building the relationship, that’s about the best thing we can do.

Jay: Yeah, absolutely. And again save you a lot less money than trying to generate a brand new customer where you have to start the process over and over again.

David: Yeah. No question. And we will be continuing this topic inside the Inner Circle all this week. So if you’re already an Inner Circle member, be sure to log in, continue the discussion.

If you’re not, check out TopSecrets.com/ic for Inner Circle, that’s TopSecrets.com/ic, and we will continue the discussion inside.

Jay: Yeah, go there. You may have a lot of customers that you can reactivate that you could have access to right now and reduce that CAC, that customer acquisition cost.

David, it’s always a pleasure.

David: Thank you so much, Jay.

Are You Ready to Start Reactivating Your Client Base?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

There are reasons people buy from you, and reasons they don’t buy from you. Today I’d share a presentation I put together for my clients in the print and promotional products industry that reveals many reasons why clients don’t buy from you, and the one solution that addresses them all.

Hi and welcome to today’s presentation Why Promo Clients Don’t Buy from You and the One Solution that Addresses Them All.

I am so happy to have you with me today. This is a topic I find extremely interesting and extremely powerful. It’s information that I’ve shared with my Inner Circle clients and our Total Market Domination clients. But I wanted to give you just sort of an overview of some of the things that you might be addressing. And when you address them correctly, you can actually create amazing solutions inside your business.

So with that said, let’s take a look at why promo clients don’t buy from you, and then what we can do about it.

Well, first of all, why don’t they buy from you? One of the first, primary reasons that people don’t buy from you is that they have no idea that you’re alive. If they don’t know you’re alive, they can’t buy from you.

Next is that they don’t know what you do.

Obviously, if people have no idea of what you do, they’re not going to come to you for solutions. This also ties into the next one, which is that they don’t know how you can help them. If they have absolutely no idea how you can help them, no one is going to seek you out.

Sometimes they may know you’re alive, they may know what you do, they may know how you can help them, but they don’t yet trust you.

Another reason is that they don’t know if they should trust you. Even if they can, they might not know if they should.

Many of your prospects aren’t going to know why you’re different, and if they don’t know why you’re different from what they already have, or what they’ve already tried, then they have no incentive to try you.

Next, they don’t know if they can afford you. Obviously, they’re not going to know what you charge or any of the above until you first overcome the problems that we addressed earlier.

They won’t take your calls. Obviously, if people aren’t going to take your calls, then you’re not going to be able to sell to them.

Same thing if they won’t return your calls. If you’re calling people again and again and again, and they don’t return your calls, they’re not going to be able to buy from you.

Next we have, “they already have someone.” Have you ever heard that one?

The answer, of course, is yes, you’ve probably heard that quite a lot, unless you have not been in business very long.

They view you as a commodity. In the promotional products industry, this is relatively easy to do, because they look at it and they say, “Okay, if everybody has access to the same products and services, then why should I choose you?” Right?

And one of the problems is that many distributors don’t have a good answer to this either. If you don’t know why they shouldn’t view you as a commodity, you can’t convey it to them, and so they’re never going to know either.

They’re on social media and you’re not. I’ve heard distributors tell me this. The reason they won’t buy from me is that they’re on social media and I’m not. I can’t reach them. Okay, we’ll talk about that, but the reverse is also true.

They’re not on social media and you are. “Oh yeah, they’re not on social media. I’m trying to reach them and I can’t.” This is true. It’s objectively true. If either of those scenarios are the case, if you’re on social media and they’re not, or they’re on social media and you’re not, then yes, you’re not going to be able to reach them there and get those customers to buy from you.

They don’t know if your recommendations are any good. How can they possibly know that until you have an opportunity to really communicate with them?

They don’t know if your recommendations are going to work for them. Even if your recommendations are good, “will it work for me?” How many clients have you heard say something like that? In other words, “yeah, that sounds good, but I’m not sure it’s going to work for me.” It’s another reason some promo clients will not buy.

They don’t know why they should choose you over every other option available to them. Wow, that’s a big one. Now, if you think about it, how could you possibly address that one?

I’m going to explain it in a moment, but I’d like you to just take a moment and think about it.

Really, think about it related to all of these. How would you possibly address any of these things? If they don’t know you’re alive, if they don’t know they can trust you, if they don’t know they should trust you, if they already have someone?

What is likely to be the solution to this?

You may already know, you may already have an idea. But I want to get to what I believe is the actual correct complete solution in just a moment.

What if they’re unclear on the kind of results you can get for them? If they don’t know… if they think you might be able to help with this, or think you might be able to help with that, but they’re not crystal clear on it. are they going to choose to buy from you?

Once again, the answer is very probably not.

You name it. Okay, why promo clients won’t buy from you. You name it. There are a lot of different reasons. I named a bunch of them here. But of course there are likely to be more.

So what is the one solution you can use to address them all?

That’s what we’re going to talk about now: Bottom line, it’s a communication thing.

If you’re not communicating with your prospects and clients clearly and directly and with purpose, you’re not going to be able to solve any of these problems. If you think about it, when you have the ability to communicate correctly and directly and reach the people you need to reach, all of these problems, all of a sudden become solvable.

You’ll be able to let them know you’re alive, know what you do, know how you can help them know that they can trust you, and how and why they should trust you.

You’ll be able to explain how and why you’re different, what your prices are, so they know whether or not they can afford you. They’ll be more likely to take and return your calls when you know the right things to say to them as you’re communicating with them or leaving them voicemail.

If they already have someone, you’ll have a response for that. If they view you as a commodity, you’ll have a response for that. If they’re on social media and you’re not, you can decide, do I need to target the people on social media, or should I go after the people who are not? Same if you flip it around.

If they’re not on social media and you are, then should I just target the people who are on social media for now and target the others separately? There are solutions to each of these specific issues, and every single one of those solutions is a communication issue.

If they don’t know your recommendations will be any good. If they don’t know your recommendations will work. All of these are things that can be solved through your communication.

So how do we do that? And what is the one solution that addresses them all?

Well, the one solution that addresses them all is not just communication. It’s a specific type of communication that I refer to as the MVPs of Marketing and Sales.

Now, you’ve probably heard me mention the MVPs of Marketing and Sales in the past, and if you have, that’s great. I’ll be revealing a lot of things that you have probably not heard before in previous communications about it, and you should still get a lot out of this presentation.

If you have not heard about the MVPs of Marketing and Sales before, I’ll give you a good grounding in terms of what they are, and provide you with access to additional resources where you can go to learn more.

So let’s talk about the MVPs.

In sports, MVP stands for what? Most valuable player, right? Well, the MVPs of Marketing and Sales are effectively the most valuable players of sales and marketing. But MVP here doesn’t stand for most valuable player. Instead, it stands for Message, Vehicles, and People.

Let me explain.

Let’s start with the messaging. What is the marketing message I need to communicate to my ideal target client? We need to get that right first.

Second, what is the combination of marketing Vehicles I’m going to use to communicate that message?

And then third, who are the People or prospects I need to reach with my marketing message?

When you get all three of these things right, you have a successful promotion, a successful connection with a prospect, and very likely a successful sales transaction.

However, if you get just one of these things wrong, It doesn’t work. And here’s why…

The MVPs of Marketing and Sales are like the three legs on a stool. You get all three of them in place, and it’s nice and solid. But if just one of them is missing, the entire promotion is a bust.

This goes for any type of promotion that you’re doing to reach out to a prospect or client and get them to become a customer. It also applies to them. It applies to every effort they engage in to be able to get customers for themselves.

So as you’re selling your products, you’re also going to be able to help them better sell their own.

Let’s take a look at what happens when you’ve got the right marketing Message and the right marketing Vehicles in place. When that happens, you’re able to create a connection, right? You’ve got a good connection between the Message and the marketing Vehicles you’re using.

That connection is going to be important when you’re reaching the right People. However, if you’re reaching the wrong people, then what happens? You’re going to create confusion.

For example, if you’ve got a great message that’s about plumbers, and you’ve got a right combination of marketing Vehicles to reach people, and you’re reaching a group of lawyers, it’s just going to confuse them. Make sense?

Okay, let’s take a look at another scenario. Let’s say you’ve got the right Message and it’s getting to the right People. All right, what does that create? That creates communication.

If you’ve got a great marketing message and you’re getting to the right people, you are able to create communication with that.

However, if the marketing vehicles that you’re using are vehicles they don’t like, all you’re going to do is annoy them.

So let’s take a look at this scenario. I’m using the right combination of marketing Vehicles to get to the right People. When I do just that, I create compatibility. Compatibility between the people that I’m trying to reach and the marketing vehicle that they like to be reached with.

So that’s good. But what if I have a terrible marketing message? Well, if I use a terrible marketing message using exactly the right combination of marketing vehicles to reach exactly my ideal target audience, all I’m going to do is create alienation.

I’m going to alienate those people because they’re going to say, “why are you telling me this?” Right? So now you have alienated your potentially very best customers because you didn’t have your messaging right.

Now that’s an extreme example. Not everyone is going to have, and most people aren’t going to have, a terrible marketing message.

But consider this. If your marketing message isn’t really focused and on target, it is very likely, if not to alienate people, then at least to discourage them from interacting with you.

So you may take a look at this diagram now and say “okay, so if I’ve got the right marketing message and I’m using the right combination of marketing vehicles to reach the right people, then I’ve got an excellent likelihood of success!”

And that is absolutely true. But as you look at this diagram, you may say to yourself, “okay, so what goes at the center of this diagram? What goes in the middle of all this?”

And the answer is you do! You’re at the center of all this. This is true if all of these things are going well, and if any of them or all of them are going poorly. You’re in the middle of all of it.

So the way that you engage in these things determine if you’re creating connection, compatibility, and communication, or if you’re creating alienation, annoyance, and confusion.

That’s why it is so important to make sure that you’re on the right side of all three of the MVPs of Marketing and Sales.

Do I have the right marketing Message? Am I using the right combination of marketing Vehicles to reach my ideal People, my ideal prospects?

If the answer to that question is yes, you’re going to be extremely successful.

But if the answer to any of those is no, it is guaranteed to be a struggle for you.

In short, when you’re able to create that Connection, Communication, and Compatibility, you win.

Over the years, we’ve used the MVPs of Marketing and Sales to help thousands of professionals in the promotional products industry to increase their sales, improve their profit margins, and grow their businesses.

If you’d like to know more, go to TopSecrets.com/MVPs. That’s TopSecrets.com/MVPs.

There you’ll find a video where I’ll explain more to you about what we do and how we do it. And if it makes sense for you, I’d love for you to schedule a call with myself or my team.

We walk you through how we can help you to apply the MVPs of Marketing and Sales and integrate them into your business.

Once again, it’s TopSecrets.com/MVPs.

Ready to Systematically Eliminate the Reasons Why Clients Don’t Buy from You?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

Disrupting sales relationships is tricky. When you go into a sales presentation, if you recognize that it’s likely they’re going to have someone, and if you’ve got an arsenal of responses that you can come back with to demonstrate to them why you are obviously the better choice, then they’re going to be a lot more likely to at least give you a shot at that business, than if you don’t have those things in place.

David: Hi, and welcome back in today’s episode, cohost Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the idea of disrupting sales relationships. Welcome back, Jay.

Jay: Hey, David. It’s a pleasure as always. I don’t want to do it.  Don’t want to disrupt sales processes. I refuse. Don’t want to do it.

David: Okay. I refuse to participate. Yeah, it’s a tough one. The word disrupt is a tough word. But the reality of the situation is that when we’re approaching a new prospect, a new client, and that person already has a business relationship, perhaps with a competitor of ours — the only way that we’re even going to get a shot at that business is if we can, in some way, disrupt the existing sales relationship.

Now, I’m not talking about trying to drive a wedge between people. I’m not talking about anything nefarious. I’m just talking about the idea that to disrupt an established sales relationship, particularly one that is going reasonably well, requires you to be significantly better and different than the option that they’re already looking at.

Jay: Yeah, I agree. and I think that this starts way ahead of trying to disrupt any particular process that’s going on right now. We’ve talked about, in the past, do you know your competitors at all? Do you know their sales process? I mean, how would you disrupt anything if you didn’t know the process of what was going on?

David: Yeah, exactly. And if you think in terms of business relationships versus personal relationships, when you’re in high school and you first start dating, and the person that you like is already attracted to somebody else, like, oh, okay, well, how am I going to position myself as a better alternative, a better option, right?

So it requires strategy. It requires persistence. It requires some sort of advantage, right? Some sort of, what we would call in business, a competitive advantage.

And we need to think through those things, because it’s the same in a business relationship. If they’ve got a great business relationship, it’s going to be a lot harder.

In those situations, we have to determine whether or not it even makes sense for us to try to provide a better solution.

But here’s the thing, if we truly believe that our solution is better than whatever they’re currently receiving Then we kind of owe it to them to let them know that, don’t we?

Jay: Oh, yeah, I absolutely agree with that and we talked I think in the last podcast that we’re a company that loves it when you talk to our competitors. We love it when you’re in a sales process with somebody else, cause we know how unique we are in our presentation, in our initial consultations. We know.

And so the key for us to disrupting an existing sales process with somebody else is just, how do we get them to call us?

How do we introduce ourselves to them mid process? Because we know if they can find us or we can find them, our chances are pretty good.

David: Exactly. And so in your situation where you’re using online resources like pay per click and things like that, it’s a matter of getting some sort of messaging in front of them that has them questioning at that point, whether or not there is a better alternative out there for them.

And so the only people who are going to schedule a call with you are the ones who have determined that they are at least open to exploring that sort of relationship.

I think it’s interesting that a lot of times in business loyalty is often based on inertia, right? It’s just easier to stick with what I have rather than to try to find an alternative.

And in those situations, when you are able to get in front of someone who’s just doing business with a competitor of yours out of habit, it does become a lot easier to be able to create messaging that will intrigue them to the point where they’re willing to have a conversation.

Jay: Yeah, I love that line. Loyalty a lot of times is about inertia. I think about, in my own case, maybe a company that I’m using wasn’t perfect last time, and I probably would like to see if somebody else is out there.

But I know them. I know their number. I have a relationship with them. So suddenly I’m going to be a little bit less demanding, I guess.

And that means I’m compromising on what I want. And that’s not something that I should be doing.

David: Yeah, I completely relate to that. We’ve had situations with some of the CRMs that we’ve used over the years where they’re doing things that are just so incredibly frustrating. And the support is so terribly bad.

But the pain of having to move everything and switch everything over and all those dead links and all the things that go with it’s like, okay, well, I guess I’ll stick where I am.

So in this situation where you’re trying to attract a new prospect or client to you, you have to make sure that the rewards outweigh all the downside that comes with having to switch a relationship from the current one to the new one.

Jay: Yeah, exactly. And so, once again, you’ve got to identify what are the differences, then you have to identify how are you going to get in front of them to even talk about your differences? And then there’s the approach.

Because if your approach is to just bash the other guy. I’m sure you remember the Burger King and McDonald’s wars and Burger King, all their spots were just bashing McDonald’s.

And I’m like, I’m not going to stop going to McDonald’s cause you think that they’re bad. Of course you think they’re bad. You’re their competitor.

It always blows my mind in politics or anything like this. Why would I trust your competitor to give me a valid review about you? That the worst possible person to get a review from.

David: Exactly. And I think in some of those situations, what they did, rather than saying “we good, they bad,” was that they would look at a specific difference.

Like in the example you mentioned with McDonald’s and Burger King back in the day when the burger wars were going on. I believe Burger King’s positioning was all about flame broiling or was it flame broiling vs. frying?

Jay: Flame broiling. Yep. Mm hmm.

David: And so that’s the message that people can actually evaluate objectively.

Do I want it flame broiled or do I want it fried? Okay. Yeah. Flame broiled. That may sound better, right? So that was an approach that appealed to logic and fact, and it gave people an opportunity to make that decision.

So in that regard, it wasn’t just like, “Oh, our competitor is terrible. It’s really bad.” Although there were some commercials that came close to that. But I think. That’s a reasonable example of where they were able to define a clear difference that perhaps could change some minds.

Jay: Yeah, I remember Burger King was “have it your way.” And that was a whole spin on the fact that McDonald’s, you could not, custom order anything, right?

And so they were literally saying, we can treat you better, right? Identifying differences.

David: Yeah, that was a good one, too. Really back in the day when McDonald’s wouldn’t customize anything. I don’t know if they will today. I’m assuming they probably would.

Jay: They do. Yes,

David: But at that particular point in time, you couldn’t say, “Hey, can I get it without ketchup or whatever?” No, you just couldn’t.

And so when they came out with that campaign, it’s like, okay, that has definite appeal to people. Because again, it just makes sense. It resonates with them. “Have it your way” is just a great statement when you’re talking to a prospect.

“Hey, listen, have it your way. Let’s do it the way you want to do it, not the way that we’ve prepackaged it.”

It’s a great example. And so all of this really goes back to messaging, right? What is it that we’re saying about what we do, which is the subject of a previous podcast.

And when it comes to trying to disrupt or displace a current vendor or a current supplier, what is it that we’re going to have to say to make that happen?

Now, in a lot of cases, when you’re approaching someone new and they’ve already got somebody, they’re going to tell you, yeah, we already have someone we’re dealing with. Or we’re already happy with the person we’re dealing with.

And sometimes that’s true, and sometimes it’s not. But if you don’t have sort of a series of go-to responses about what to say to overcome that, you’re pretty much dead in the water.

Jay: Yeah, and it’s really difficult cards to play because if your whole thing is I’m just gonna bash the person that you’re working with? I’ve always felt like you’re bashing me, right?

It’s like in politics. If I question somebody on your side of the aisle, it’s like, I’m personally questioning you. And so I’m never going to change your mind by attacking you.

There has to be a different play there. That play could be talking about your services. So you’re strategically bashing the other person, but not by saying a name, you’re identifying a need that you can fulfill that is not being fulfilled right now.

But if you think you’re just going to attack the person they’re working with, I’ve always felt like that was an attack of the person who you’re trying to get their business from.

David: Yeah, I think that’s a really bad strategy. I think bashing your competition is just a really bad strategy. It works much better if you can think in terms of how can you outshine your competition?

How can you outperform your competition? And how can you convey that in a way that doesn’t bash them? It just points out the differences like we were talking about in those examples from Burger King.

It points out the differences and then they can decide which of those approaches they like better.

Because the whole idea of bashing competitors, most people I think don’t like that because it forces you to engage in a level of negativity. Now you’re saying negative things, you’re using negative words.

If you know what your competition does not do as well as you do, and they tell you that they’re using someone like that, there are ways that you can just ask them about their potential weak points without even identifying those as potential weak points.

If you know that your particular competitor is not particularly responsive in terms to getting back to people, then you can say to them, Oh, yes, you know, I’ve heard very good things about them. are they pretty good with the responsiveness? Are they pretty good with the things that are important to you?

And even if they’re not, they might say, Oh, yeah, they are. But in the back of their mind, they might be going, eh, could be better, could be better.

And then that way they’re doing the bashing mentally in their own heads and you’re not having to do it. I just don’t like the idea of bashing competitors. Just never did.

I think that it is a sign of desperation and I think it’s really unnecessary. Because when you’re bashing the competitor, it’s like you’re trying to put them down rather than trying to show them how you are above the fray.

Jay: Yeah, and I think anytime there’s feelings of negativity in a sales call type situation, that’s a losing battle.

I don’t think you should do this. Interestingly, as I think about it, our process in these circumstances, is to take them through the same questionnaire that we take everybody else.

In fact, we don’t really change our process. Because our process is to find out where they’re at and then ask them questions about what they’ve done.

And then find out if they know about the solutions and the problems. So if we’re doing that and the person they’re working with has never done that, because our competitors don’t do that, then we’ve already demonstrated the difference.

They can tell in a nanosecond, wait a minute, these guys are different.

The people I’m working with, they don’t even care. They just pushed past all of these things. So you can do it. And if you can achieve it, wow, can it be a game changer for sure.

David: No question. And I think a lot of that really comes down to the idea of making your offer so compelling that they will want to leave their current provider and come to you because of what you’re describing to them.

Now, of course, this is where what we’re saying about what we do, and then what we actually do have to be integrated, right? You can’t say you do this and then you deliver something that is completely different than that.

But if you’re consistent between what you’re saying and what you’re doing, and what you’re saying and doing is actually better than what they’re currently getting, they’re going to be a lot more likely to make that switch.

Jay: Yeah. And if you think about it, your competitor will help you make the sale. Cause if they’re bad, if they’re not good, and you’re leveling up, they’re going to be like, why wasn’t I with you in the first place, right?

And we get that a lot. So there is a way to do it, but very industry specific and unique. And, Dave, that’s why I think a call to you guys could really help them walk through the process. How do they find out more?

David: Yeah, we’d love to have that conversation Just go to TopSecrets.com/call, schedule a call with myself or my team The reality of the situation is that most of the people that you interact with, particularly the type of clients you actually want to have, probably already have a provider of the solution you provide. Right?

Because if they don’t, then do they even need it? Are they early stages? Why don’t they? Or they’ve at least had some experience with a competitor.

So when you go into a sales presentation or even a prospecting session with somebody to try to find out if they are a potential client of yours, if you recognize that it’s likely they’re going to have someone, and if you’ve got an arsenal of responses that you can come back with to demonstrate to them why you are obviously the better choice, then they’re going to be a lot more likely to at least give you a shot at that business, than if you don’t have those things in place.

So once again, if you want to go to TopSecrets.com/call, we’d love to have that conversation with you.

Jay: Absolutely. And I know it’ll be worth it.

David: Thank you so much, Jay.

Ready to Start Disrupting Some Existing Sales Relationships?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

Getting to your ideal prospects involves identifying what our ideal prospect looks like in terms of the type of customer we’re looking for, the type of industry they’re in, the number of people in their organization if we’re selling B2B. All these considerations that are going to add up to the ideal prospect, because until we know who it is we’re going to go after, we have absolutely no idea where to go to find them.

David: Hi, and welcome back. In today’s episode cohost Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the idea of getting to your ideal prospects. Welcome back, Jay.

Jay: Hey, thank you so much. Another great topic. We could call this one the Holy Grail of Sales.

How much time does everybody spend talking to people who would never be their client in the first place? What would you do with all that extra time?

David: It is an amazing amount of time. When we work with clients, that is one of the biggest ways that they get back time that is otherwise spent. Very often, when people are considering the idea of working with us to help them grow their sales and profits, it’s like, “well, am I going to have time to do this?”

And nine times out of 10, they don’t have time not to do it. Because they’re wasting, in many cases, so much time with poor, unqualified prospects. And simply by taking a few specific actions, you can pretty much eliminate a lot of that right up front, save yourself enormous amounts of time, and better still, being able to then interact with the types of clients you actually want to do business with

Jay: But I’m a new company.

I need money to pay my bills. I need to try and close everybody. Isn’t that what you would hear?

David: In the early stages, everybody says that, and after they’ve been in business for a while, they try to figure out, now how do I undo what I’ve done? How do I untie this knot that I’ve tied for myself over the past however, many months or years?

But yeah, in the early stages, we just want to take anyone who’s willing to do business with us. But eventually, when our true selves kick in — when we find ourselves in a conversation with the wrong client, somebody that we took on a while before, and we recognize, wow, this was a mistake — that’s when you start thinking, Okay, well, maybe what I need to do going forward is to not just take anyone.

I need to identify who are these ideal prospects. How can I identify and initiate contact with the right people up front so that I’m not wasting a lot of time with the wrong people down the line.

Jay: Yeah, absolutely. I have a business partner and he’s this sage old business partner. He’s built several businesses on his own over the years and I didn’t know he was even doing it, but he has this list of people who he doesn’t want to do business with anymore. He calls it the naughty list.

And, somebody came around and they were repurchasing our services. He just, with no emotion said, “nah, I don’t want to do that.”

And I’m like, what are you talking…? I didn’t even remember the customer. And he’s like, “no, they’re on the naughty list. They were a pain. They didn’t provide what we needed soon enough and they harassed us on our pricing. The answer is no.”

And so he’s got this Santa Claus naughty list, and I was like, “but they want to give us money.” And I’ve just come around to his way of thinking. I am not emotional about it anymore. They’re on the list. Forget it.

David: It’s a lump of coal for you, baby. That’s how it works. Yeah. I mean, it is a strong argument for the fact that you don’t need more prospects, you need the right prospects.

You don’t need more customers necessarily, you need more of the right customers. Because life is too short to do anything else in my view.

Jay: Yeah. Let’s say that you spend 10 hours a day working with customers are doing sales for potential customers, and five of those hours are spent on people who are not the right fit.

What if you could take those five hours and apply it to finding customers who are a good fit. Or even just providing a better product to the other five customers. Both of those are a win. The first option is, is a complete loss.

David: Yeah, and when you do that, when you actually save those five hours and channel that time toward better, higher quality prospects and clients, not only does it improve your bottom line, it also improves your quality of life, right?

I mean, in this podcast, we talk a lot about marketing and sales, but all of this also pertains directly to your quality of life. Your quality of life gets better when you’re interacting with ideal clients versus just any client.

Jay: Oh, such a great point. There are few things worse than running around like a chicken with your head cut off for customers that you don’t like to work with.

That is a nightmare. And when you think about why you wanted to get involved, why did you become an entrepreneur?

Why did you get involved in this process? Did you envision yourself being worked every day by people that you didn’t want to work with.

I don’t think that’s what you envisioned. So how do you get back to that ideal?

David: Yeah, because a lot of the words that I hear from entrepreneurs in the way they want to build their business involves the word freedom, right? It’s about the freedom to be able to do what you want to do in your business, to be able to make your own rules, set your own pricing, decide what types of clients you want to interact with.

And many entrepreneurs end up harming their own freedom by accepting people that they shouldn’t accept. So, to answer your question, you know, how do you get around that? I think it starts with identifying what truly defines a high quality prospect for you? What defines an ideal client for you?

Because until you make the call about the type of business that you want to interact with, the type of people that you want to sell to, in terms of their ability and willingness to communicate. I mean, that’s a big one. Prospects who ghost you? Do you really want to deal with people like that?

Particularly when it comes time to getting paid, right? So we have to make these calls. At least in my view, we’re better off making these calls up front. Setting the criteria of what’s acceptable for us and what’s ideal for us and trying to stick to that as much as possible.

Now are we going to get it right 100 percent of the time?

No, we’re not. But if we at least go into the sales experience, the prospecting experience with the idea of attracting and converting ideal clients, we’re going to be a lot more likely to be able to pull it off.

Jay: Yeah, it’s so important and you also kind of alluded to something there and that is training the customer.

Before they even sign up, letting them know what the expectations are. We do a lot of this now. We’re like, okay, here’s what will happen. And in order to make this work, here’s what our expectation is going to be.

Then once they sign up, we do it again. We say, okay, here are the next three steps. After three weeks, we do it again.

And this protects us, right? But it’s also a constant reminder to them that we have expectations. And this just comes to my mind talking about my seasoned partner. Let’s, let’s call him that way.

He fired off an email to somebody who we were so upset at. This person was unbelievable. And my partner fired off an email and he said, look, I don’t want to do business with you anymore unless you agree to these five conditions.

You will not do this, you will do this. You won’t do this. And I’m like, I’ve never seen anything like that before. The customer apologized, and they’ve been an ideal customer ever since.

And I’m like, there were one of two choices. We kiss them goodbye, or we give them the opportunity to play on our terms.

That’s just genius. Just genius. I just loved it.

David: It is. It’s amazing. And fortunately, that particular client had it within them to be able to adapt, to recognize, oh okay, I probably shouldn’t have done that.

And to be able to admit it and to be able to change the behavior. Not everyone’s going to be like that.

So we have to be open enough with our clients in our communication to be able to find out where they fall along that continuum between being totally obnoxious or being educable.

You know, you talked about training them, being able to be trained. And if they are able to be trained to be able to interact with you in a way that works for you and your coworkers…

One of the things that I had in our business was when we had people who were inappropriate or unprofessional with my coworkers. That was basically the kiss of death, because we’re not going to put up with that.

The people in our organization have been with us for a really long time. We know how they are. We know how they act.

Now, if you’ve got a brand new person talking to them and they’re a wild card, you can’t be as sure. But when you’re very confident about the people that you work with and there’s an issue, you can generally take the side of the person you work with over the side of the prospect in most cases, if you know the person you’re working with better.

Jay: Yeah, exactly. We had exactly the same thing. Somebody made one of our cherished employees cry, and I was about to climb through the phone. That’s a deal breaker. I don’t care how much money you pay us. I don’t care. Your staff has to believe that you have their back and that there is some loyalty there.

And so, I don’t think you ever want to choose good money over an employee, right? But I just really encourage people to think about why you got involved in the first place. And what type of customer and experience is going to give you that?

Is it quality of life that you wanted? Is it money? I’m sure financial freedom was part of that. But so often what we talk about, and I know that you do, is help people think very specifically in these terms.

Because most of us are running around haphazardly. We’re not being specific about, if you ask somebody, well why did you even do this? Could they answer the question?

If you ask them, what is your ideal customer? Could they answer the question? I think in most cases, the answer is no.

David: I completely agree. I think another thing that we should consider is the fact that there is always a cost of selling to the wrong people. And that cost comes in terms of wasted time, wasted energy, lost sales, of course, from chasing the wrong prospects rather than the right prospects.

There are a lot of costs associated with that, and it doesn’t show up on a bill, right? So you’re not seeing what the dollars actually are, but you have to know what your time is worth.

And if you’re spending a lot of time trying to fix problems caused by the wrong prospects and the wrong clients, it’s a strong indication that it’s time to make a change in that regard.

Jay: And also, it can show up on a bill. In our case, we pay per click online. I can tell you, we pay $300 plus to get somebody to sign up for a consultation. And if I don’t close that consultation. That’s $300.

David: Absolutely. And those costs are real. They are tangible. Plus, the time that you spend on the phone with someone like that.

So you’ve got the initial cost for the meeting itself. And then if you spend an hour with that person rather than 10 or 15 minutes, that’s more money that doesn’t show up on the bill, but is still very much a cost.

I think part of our consideration too, is to think about where are our ideal prospects and clients hanging out? Where are they hiding? Are they online?

Where are they hanging out in person? Where are they in terms of other people we know? Can we get introductions to those people? Because they’re out there!

Sometimes we feel like they’re not. It’s like, oh, nobody wants this. There’s always someone who wants it.

Our job is to find the buyer. And if we’re not finding the buyer, that’s on us, it’s not on them.

It’s not their responsibility to come out and introduce themselves to us. It’s up to us to try to find them.

So that really involves identifying what our ideal prospect looks like in terms of the type of customer we’re looking for, the type of industry they’re in, the number of people in their organization if we’re selling B2B.

All these considerations are going to add up to the ideal prospect, because until we know who it is we’re going to go after, we have absolutely no idea where to go to find them.

Jay: Yeah, being specific and that’s so important thinking about these things at a time and then planning towards them. David, how do people find out more?

David: You can go to TopSecrets.com/call. Schedule a call with myself or my team.

If you’re in a situation where you are looking to grow your sales and grow your profit and identify more of your ideal prospects and clients rather than just anybody, be sure to go to that URL: TopSecrets.com/call. We’d love to have a conversation with you.

Jay: All right. As always, it’s a pleasure.

David: Thank you so much, Jay.

Ready to Start Getting to Your Ideal Prospects?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

In order to turn the tables on rejection in sales, there are very specific steps you can take, and we work with our clients to help them do that every day of the week.

David: Hi and welcome back in today’s episode co host Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the idea of turning the tables on rejection in sales. Welcome back, Jay.

Jay: Hey Dave, it’s always good to talk with you and I love these topics. They’re so important I think more than anything, at least for me, rejection, fear of rejection stops me from doing a lot of things that I know I should be doing.

David: Yeah. And you are really not alone. I think we’ve all felt that way at one point or other. I know there was a period of time, a lot of years ago, where I was so frustrated by this that I’m like, okay, what can we do? To not just try to overcome it, not just try to overcome the fear, but to actually turn the tables on rejection in sales.

And essentially what I came up with is that in order to make that happen, we have to take the initiative in terms of identifying the types of clients that we want, the types of clients that we will accept. And by leading with that strength, going into each prospecting opportunity with the idea that I may accept this client, I may not.

They may accept me, they may not. If the two of us agree that we want to work together, we will. And if one of us doesn’t want to work together, we won’t. And being okay with that, Once I embraced that idea and that concept, everything became a lot easier.

Jay: Yeah. So just a paradigm shift. I will tell you, and this is no joke, before we dive into your concept a little bit more, I went to a doctor and I said, just give me a drug that makes me not fear rejection. He didn’t have it, but hey, I was willing to try anything.

David: Yeah, it’s funny because you would think there’d be something for that. I guess maybe something that might relax you or make you not care as much about the rejection, but, short of medication, I think the idea of sort of reframing it in some ways and saying, all right, I’m going to do what I can on my end in terms of identifying the clients that I want to work with.

And just by doing that, you can actually eliminate a lot of rejection when you decide in advance that there are some people you’re going to talk to that are probably just not a good fit for you.

Jay: Yeah, I love this and I feel like I’ve been doing this, but not purposefully like you’re talking about. I get to the point now where when I talk to somebody and they’re not interested, I almost feel glad.

Because through the conversation, I learn they’re not really a good fit for me. So we both kind of decide that on our own. We wish each other well. I add them to our drip campaign and it’s done. I can hang up the phone call and do other work or move on to the next call.

David: Yeah. It’s so much better when you’re able to take an approach like that and feel good about the fact that we really weren’t born to do business with anyone who can fog a mirror, right?

It’s not an ideal scenario for either of us. I also realized at some point or other that rejection in some ways can actually be a tool to help you find better clients, whether you’re the one who’s rejecting them, basically saying, okay, this isn’t a good fit.

Or even in a situation where if you decide you would potentially like to work with them, if they decide they don’t want to work with you, if you view it as essentially a way for you to be able to find better clients, that also makes it quite a bit easier to take.

Jay: Yeah, I think I told you in the past, my dad was a salesman his whole life and I asked him how did you deal with rejection and he said I look at no’s as a positive.

I know what my close rate is. I know how many cold calls I have to make. And so every time I got a no, that means I was one step closer to the yes. So, changing your outlook, your mindset, it actually made him feel good.

Okay, one more closer. I got that no. And so I’m on my way.

David: Yeah. And going along with that exact mindset, when you recognize that every wrong client that you take on is going to cost you time, money and energy that could be spent with better quality clients, that also makes it a lot easier to deal with.

Jay: Yeah. And I, when somebody says they don’t want to work with me, I’m like, whoo. You know, it’s like,

David: Slipped the noose!

Jay: That’s right. Because they’ve listened to my services. They’ve listened to my spiel. They know what I’m going to cost. And if after that, they’re like, you know, or even when they start asking for discounts and things like that, we’ve just learned.

No, we’re proud of our product. We know what it’s worth. We know what it costs. And if you’re not in that strike zone, then whew, I’m glad that we decided before we went any further.

David: Yeah, the idea of just clients in general, particularly when you’re starting out in business, it’s like, okay, I need clients.

I want to bring a new client through the door. It’s all about client, client, client, or customer, customer, customer, whatever you refer to the people as. But one of the terms that I tend to use a lot in my material and just what I’m talking to prospects and clients in general is the idea of the ideal client.

What is the ideal client? Who exactly are the types of customers and clients that you want to work with? And when you come up with your own sort of filter of the types of prospects and clients you want, it really allows you to be far more selective in terms of who you bring through the door, but it also allows you to feel a lot less concerned when you talk to somebody who’s not a good fit. Because you don’t feel like, Oh, I have to sell this person anyway.

Jay: Yeah. And , you had mentioned something to me in a previous podcast that really hit home. And it kind of changed the way that I look at things.

You talked about the salesperson interviewing the potential client to see if they’re a good fit as much as the other way around. And I find myself now saying, is this somebody that I even want to close or do I want to start getting out of this conversation early.

Sometimes now in the first 2 or 3 minutes, I can say, this one’s not going to work out. It’s not going to go the way that I want it to And so let’s get it over with.

So I love that idea that i’m interviewing them As much as they’re interviewing me.

David: Exactly. Because you can’t decide for them whether or not they want to work with you. And they can’t decide whether you want to work with them, right? We can only make those decisions for ourselves. When we realize that, I think everything gets a whole lot easier.

Jay: Oh, I agree with you and I love easy when you do sales. Right? And then the other thing that I know we’ve talked about a little bit is if you can change your sales pitch into more of a feeling like you’re not pushing your services on them, but they really need your services.

I mean, I’ll give you an example. I never have to tell somebody, Okay, let me show you what our costs are. Never have to do that. They always ask me, What are your fees?

And to me, that’s such a great place to be. I’m not a salesperson. I’m just somebody showing them what our expenses are. And then when we get to the screen that has our expenses, I say.

Would you like me to walk you through each of these? Right? I’m never, “okay, let me show you each of these and this is the most important for you” and, and whatever. And then they’ll say things like, ” well, I really think maybe the third package is something that would work for us.” And I’d say, “you know what, based on our conversation, that’s probably right. And let me tell you some of the other benefits.”

So there’s no real sales going on at all. I’m just answering questions. To me, that is the most beautiful way to be doing sales. And there’s really no chance of feeling like I got rejected. Because they’re the ones asking the questions, right?

David: Exactly. And there’s also a layer of exclusivity that comes with that. When you are in a position where you can say to somebody, “Hey, I don’t think this is a good fit,” where you can make that determination as you’re having the conversation.

“Listen, based on what you told me, from my side, it sounds to me like you’re a perfect fit for this. It seems to me like this is something worth pursuing. What’s your take?”

And then they’ll say either. Yeah, I agree. It sounds like this is something that’s good. Because then at that point, it’s okay to have conversations about, what’s it going to cost and how does it all work and everything like that?

Because until you can get to the point where you’re in basic agreement about whether you even want to work together at all, the price doesn’t even matter at that point.

In some sense, the deliverables don’t even matter at that point. You want to get a good feel up front for whether or not this is the type of person you can interact with.

And if it is. Then you go forward with it. And if it’s not, there’s not a lot of point wasting a lot of time, as you just indicated.

Jay: Yeah. And, it depends on the type of business, but in my case, I’m looking for partners. I’m looking for a long term relationships, year after year after year. I’m not looking for the turn them and burn them, one time hit.

It really surprises me though, how often now I say. You know what? I really don’t think that we’re right for you, for whatever reason. And early on, I would have been clawing and scratching to get their money And it would turn into heartaches for both sides.

And I just say it comfortably. I’m like sometimes i’ll say I know I shouldn’t be talking you out of our services, but I really think that because of abc and d This is not going to be a match and they really appreciate that. And if anything does change down the line, then they’re going to think of me.

And I’ve also gotten referrals off of that. Because they’re like, “Hey, I talked to him and they were really straight shooters.” So, it’s not necessarily a waste.

David: I completely agree. And just keeping it that way, keeping it as a conversation. It’s not a monologue. I’m not trying to convince you to do anything. You’re not trying to convince me to do anything.

We’re having a conversation. We’re determining if we have a fit. If we do, great. If we’re both in agreement, we put it together. If one of us is not in agreement, we count it as a win and move on quickly. I think the biggest problem that a lot of salespeople have is that they feel like they have to close every single one. And when they don’t, it’s like a failure.

But the truth of the matter is, not everyone’s going to be a good client for you. And when you recognize that up front, it’s a whole lot easier to take this approach.

Jay: So very true. All right. How do people find out more?

David: Well, you can go to TopSecrets.com/call, schedule a call with myself or my team.

We’d love to have a conversation with you. If you’re in a situation where you’d like to turn the tables on rejection in sales, you don’t want to have conversations that you feel are leaving you on sort of the downside of the equation, or you’re feeling like you’re the one who’s being put out. In order to turn the tables on rejection, there are very specific steps you can take, and we work with our clients to help them do that every day of the week.

If that sounds like something that makes sense for you, TopSecrets.com/call.

Jay: And no high pressure sales call, right?

David: No. Definitely not.

Jay: All right. As always, it’s been a pleasure.

David: Thank you so much, Jay.

Ready to Turn the Tables on Rejection in Sales?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

“You have to create value in the sales process, create value in all the communication that you’re putting out there. When you do that, you’re already positioned better and differently. So when you think about the idea of what you say about what you do, you’re doing it in a way that is actually appealing to people rather than repellent.”

David: Hi, and welcome back. In today’s episode, co host Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the topic “what you say about what you do.” What it is, Jay?

Jay: Hey, David, how’s it going? Once again, it’s a pleasure to be here. I think, how we view ourselves, how we talk to ourselves, what is that inner monologue?

Those types of things, they matter a lot, and they’re probably things that we never think about.

David: Yeah. And it’s interesting you should bring that up. Because when we talk about what we say about what we do, yeah, there’s what you just mentioned, what we’re telling ourselves in our own heads. And then there’s also the idea of what we’re saying to prospects and clients about what we will potentially do for them.

Essentially the communication, the messaging that we are putting out into the world, that will allow someone to decide whether or not they want to do business with us.

Jay: Yeah. And this is so important because if you over promise, you’re setting up for failure from the beginning, right? If you under promise, then they may find a competitor who promises something faster or better. So there is a strike zone there somewhere that you have to find.

David: Exactly. And our messaging is very likely either going to attract the person we’re talking to, or it’s going to repel them. Probably the worst case scenario is if it does neither. It’s just totally boring and they’re not even paying attention to what you have to say.

But when we recognize that, particularly in the early stages, what we tell them about what we do or what we’re planning to do for them is going to determine the nature of the relationship.

If we communicate something that sounds appealing to them, It’s like they’ll be interested. If we communicate something that does not sound appealing to them, then it’s likely they are not going to be interested.

So we don’t want to go into these situations and wing it, particularly when we’re going from prospect to prospect.

We want to make sure that we’re creating a consistent experience so that each person we talk to is getting the best of what we have to offer, up front, so they can make an intelligent decision.

Jay: Yeah, we’ve really started using, I learned it from being in the media, process language. Like, if you are out doing a news report somewhere, you didn’t just say, well, I’m standing on the street corner and this is what I’m seeing. You instead say, “well, we got here about 20 minutes ago when we rolled up, this is what we saw. This is what we’re seeing, right? You bring them with you to wherever you’re at. And so we kind of do this process language, not just about how we got here.

And process questions. Like I want to know what drove you to call me. So that’s the first thing I want to know, “what drove you to call me?” The second thing I want to know is, what is your expectation from this call? Like what are you hoping to gain from it? And then we can get to where we’re at.

And then we’ll start talking a little bit. If you use our services, this will be the process moving forward. By the time we’ve shaped this whole thing, it’s like we’ve been friends for years, you know what I mean? So, it’s something that I love doing and it makes the potential client very comfortable.

David: It makes a whole lot of sense and it’s really about being present in that moment with the prospect or client, and having them be there with you at that point as well. Where one person is not talking, another person is totally tuned out.

It really is about creating that level of communication where you are interacting the way that you need to in any relationship.

And when you think about it, every sales relationship, just like any personal relationship, they involve, they require, that sort of level of communication. And I think they also require a great deal of clarity.

Jay: Yeah. And again, we have to be honest, my services that we offer, tax services for a very specific clientele, it’s much easier for me to say, okay, why did you call and what has your experience been?

It’s been easy to define that. I don’t want to give people the impression that that’s always simple. A lot of times you cold called them. And so you can’t say, well, why did you call me? Do you know what I mean? You can’t…

David: Right yeah.

Jay: You can’t…

David: They can say that to you…

Jay: That’s right. So it really does depend upon the type of business you have to create this story on your own.

But I think if you call it a story and you’re making them, what the main character of the story? i’ve heard that before. And you’re progressing them through that story, even on the first call, I think that’s going to make a difference

David: Yeah, I completely agree. When you’re in that situation where you’re having these conversations, particularly if you’re reaching out to them, if you’re cold calling somebody you don’t even want them to get to the point where they’re asking you, why are you calling me, right?

That means the thing you say up front needs to be compelling enough to grab their attention and get them interested enough in the conversation that they don’t even think to ask that.

Jay: Yeah, exactly. So, if I could get them asking questions or if I’m, you’ve heard this before, and I think it’s become cliche. Get them talking, right?

But it’s not just getting them talking. it’s what are they talking about? If you can get them talking about the thing that you’re offering. Or their negative experience with the thing that you’re offering, or if it’s promotional material, what is impeding their sales or things like that, then you’re obviously way ahead of the game at that point.

David: Yeah. And it’s the classic, you know, what’s in it for them. If I’m talking about them, their needs, what they’re looking to accomplish, they’re going to be a lot more interested in that than if I’m talking about what I do and how I do it and why they should give me money. Right?

When you are taking one approach, you’re talking about what you do. That’s essentially more of a sales approach. When you take the other approach of how what you do solves their problem, then it’s about them, and they’re going to be a lot more receptive to it.

Jay: Yeah, and a lot of times, depending upon your industry, they may not know they have the problem, right?

That’s something that we do a lot on our consultations, is help people understand they’re setting themselves up for a world of hurt. Now, tax wise, you can really be in a world of hurt, right?

And so just helping them understand where they’re at before we ever talk about being a salesperson or offering services. By the time they get to that point, they’re saying, “okay, I understand now that I’ve I’ve got a potential problem, can you solve it for me? And how much would that cost?” Right?

So again, I’m not a salesperson at that time. I’m a savior at that point. So, you know, if you can lead people in that direction, you can win.

David: Yeah. It’s such a great point, particularly when you think in terms of the whole idea of coming across as the authority, right?

You used the word savior, but even just an authority, if they recognize that you know what you’re talking about in this particular realm, better than they do, more than they do, and you’re able to help them, they’re going to be a lot more responsive to that.

And one of the challenges for a lot of people is how do you sound like an authority, without coming across as arrogant or conceited or positioning yourself as if you’re better than they are.

That’s not what you’re looking to do. You need to be able to convey the fact that you’re the expert through your knowledge, through your expertise, through your language. But you have to do that in a way that still allows you to be accessible.

And so all of that, when we talk about the idea of what it is that we’re saying to people about what we do, there’s a lot of balance that has to come into play there.

Jay: Yeah, I love that you brought a couple of things up here because we have some experience with our competitors. We kind of track them. I’m sure they track us and we get a lot of calls from people who are doing their research. And they’ve called them and now they call us and I’m never afraid when they say, “well, I talked to some of your competitors.”

I’m like, oh, this is going to be perfect. This is going to be great. Because I know how our competitors act. They do something completely different than us. Or they want the customer or the potential client to feel dumb. Maybe they want them to feel like there’s no way they could understand any of this stuff.

And so you need an expert, and then they start scaring them. They are using scare tactics about how they might get in trouble. And people get off the phone and they’re panicked, right? And that’s their sales model. That’s what they want. They want to scare you into believing that you’re the only one.

And then they hit us. And by the time they’re off the phone, they have a pretty good understanding of how things work. We don’t tell them how to solve their problems, but we let them know what those problems are and what they could mean.

And oftentimes you can hear them exhale. You just hear it.

They go, oh. Thank you so much. I hear all the time. Thank you so much for taking the time to speak to my situation. So I’m like thankful to our competitors. Bring it on. Call them. Because I know you’ll call me back.

David: It’s such a great example of what we were just talking about. It’s such a great example of being able to demonstrate that you are the authority without coming across as arrogant.

You’re also accessible. So when you’ve got an authority who is also accessible, that is a definite combination for success.

Jay: Yeah, when I have people at the end of a sales call, if you can have people thanking you for your time, thanking you for the information they receive, my goodness, that is a great place to be. Again, not always easy with different types of products, but it can be done.

David: And if they’re not thanking you, what does that say about the quality of information you conveyed? Right? I mean, what you’re pointing out is unusual, right? Most people don’t end up thanking a salesperson for their time, right? Because it comes across as a sales presentation.

But when you’re doing what you just described, and you are creating value in the communication, which is something that we pound into our clients, the idea that you have to create value in the sales process, create value in all the communication that you’re putting out there.

When you do that, you’re already positioned better and differently. And so when you think about the idea of what you say about what you do, you’re doing it in a way that is actually appealing to people rather than repellent.

Jay: Yeah, repellent that, I mean, that’s such a great word. I will tell you this. I can’t tell you how often, we have people when we get to our pricing page, our package page, they feel cause we’re a premium service, right? They feel bad because they maybe can’t afford us. So that’s, it’s not the issue.

Am I going to spend money on these people? I don’t know. It’s, oh man, can I afford these people that I’ve decided to go with already? Do you know what I mean? It’s like that’s the only letdown in the process sometimes.

David: Yeah. once again, it’s a very good problem to have when people want to do business with you and they’re trying to figure out how they’re going to be able to do it.

Jay: Yeah, absolutely. All right. How do people find out more?

David: Well, you can go to TopSecrets.com/call. Schedule a call with myself or my team. We love to have conversations with people who are looking for ways to improve their communication, improve their ability to create authority with clients without alienating them.

And just to be able to create an environment in which you’re able to attract the type of clients you want, without having to position yourself as an unruly salesperson.

Jay: As a nuisance, right?

David: Exactly.

Jay: All right. It’s always a pleasure.

David: Thank you so much, Jay.

Ready to Adapt What You Say to Generate More Sales and Profits?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

Reimagining the essentials is different for everyone. And I hear both sides of that from people. I hear people who are like, ” oh yeah, you know, I’ve been doing this forever. I know exactly what I’m doing and all that sort of thing.”

And then I have people on the other side who are like, “Hey, I’m doing all the things that I’ve done before. I’m doing it more aggressively. I’m doing much more of it. I’m doing it with more people and it’s not working.”

And so for the people who are struggling with that… again, it’s not really a matter of saying, “well, now instead of prospecting, we need to do something different.”

No, you’re still going to need to do prospecting. The question is, “can we now do it in a way that is going to reach the people that you need to reach, communicate the things that we need to communicate and allow us to advance our communications and close the sales?”

David: Hi and welcome to the podcast. Today, co-host Jay McFarland and I will be discussing reimagining the essentials. Welcome, Jay. Good to have you here.

Jay: It’s so good to be here once again. I’m very excited about today’s topic.

What’s the Point of Reimagining the Essentials?

David: Yeah. I mean the whole idea of the essentials to some people it’s like, “oh, essentials, that’s boring.”

Right? But it seems to me that in current times we really need to look at the essentials and say, “okay, how can we tweak them or fine tune them or change them around so that they’re going to be more effective in a 21st century post-COVID economy?”

Jay: Yeah. When I think about essentials, I think about foundational type things. And once you take away the foundation, other things that you have in play don’t work as well.

So what type of essentials specifically are we talking about that we want to, that we might look at in one when everybody looks at it that way, but we’re going to reimagine or rethink about them in a different way?

David: Well, I guess when I think of the fundamentals or the essentials, I tend to think of the real basics, prospecting, presenting, following up when it comes to sales. And sometimes you start talking about those things and people’s eyes glaze over like, “oh, I know all that stuff.” And yeah, we all know we need to do it.

Knowing and Doing are Two Different Things

We all know we need to do prospecting. We need to make presentations. We need to follow up with prospects and clients. But knowing it, knowing what to do, is really not the issue at all. It’s how are we doing it? How well are we doing it? How much better are we doing it than our competitors? How frequently are we doing it?

How consistently are we doing it? There are all these different nuanced aspects of it that completely change the results. And when we look at things like prospecting now versus five years ago, 10 years ago, it’s completely different. Same thing with presenting, same thing with following up. In the past, it was basically phone and in person.

Well now phone and in person are a lot less popular than other methods of communication. So that’s really what I’m talking about here.

Jay: Yeah, I think again, it’s so important, you know, it’s so easy to just fall into that trap of I’ve, you know, we’ve done it this way forever and it’s always worked. I think it’s hard for people to break free from those things, because it’s hard to know what type of impact you really can have.

And I think part of that is even understanding what your baseline is before you can make changes to understand if you’re making any progress, right?

What Happens When Everything Changes?

David: Yeah, absolutely. And I hear both sides of that from people. I hear people who are like, ” oh yeah, you know, I’ve been doing this forever. I know exactly what I’m doing and all that sort of thing.”

And then I have people on the other side who are like, “Hey, I’m doing all the things that I’ve done before. I’m doing it more aggressively. I’m doing much more of it. I’m doing it with more people and it’s not working.”

And so for the people who are struggling with that… again, it’s not really a matter of saying, “well, now instead of prospecting, we need to do something different.”

No, you’re still going to need to do prospecting. The question is, “can we now do it in a way that is going to reach the people that you need to reach, communicate the things that we need to communicate and allow us to advance our communications and close the sales?”

Reimagining the Essentials Post-COVID

Jay: Yeah, I have to think that COVID has had a huge impact on reimagining the essentials. Before, in-person experiences were the norm. That was the expectation in so many ways. Now people are standoffish about that. We’ve become much more interested in doing something online or over the phone.

That’s not nearly as personal. It’s hard to connect and build those relationships.

David: Yeah, that’s absolutely the case. And so I think for a lot of people, the idea of becoming comfortable with other methods of communication, just like what we’re doing now… some people are like, “Hey, Zoom is great. I don’t have to go anywhere. I don’t have to get in my car and I can be face-to-face with someone. It’s awesome.”

Other people are like, “oh, I can’t stand that. I don’t like looking at myself on camera. I don’t like hearing what my voice sounds like when I’m on a speaker.” And you either need to get over some of that, or you need to figure out ways to engage only with prospects who are still willing to do business, just the way that you want to do it.

That really limits your audience.

Jay: I think that’s interesting to sometimes say that there is a customer base out there that I could probably have access to, but it doesn’t really match my skillset or my comfort level. My close rate is going to be lower with them. Do I even want to spend that time?

I think in my mind, I’m like, “I want to reach everybody. I want to talk to everybody I can because that’s going to improve my odds.” Maybe it’s just the opposite.

You’re Never Too Old for Reimagining the Essentials

David: It could be. And for some people it is. I think when I was much younger, and there are certainly younger salespeople and younger people in the business who are really good at doing a lot of this stuff online. It really is about the person.

Because there are people my age who are like, “yeah, let’s do it.” Like myself. I’m all in favor of new technology, trying to figure out how to use it to best advance results for our clients and for ourselves. But then there are people far younger than myself who are like, “oh, well I’m too old to learn that stuff.”

It’s like, “well, I don’t know if that’s such a great position to take.”

Jay: Yeah, old dog new tricks. I think especially in the sales world, you know, is something that I see that is very common. What would you say to those people that are like, “I don’t need to reimagine anything. I have a certain close rate. I know what I’m doing. I’m comfortable in this process.”

What If You’re “Comfortable?”

David: People who are comfortable. I have no recommendations other than “keep up the great work.” If you’re comfortable with what you’re doing, if you’re able to do it, that’s awesome.

What I have seen, however, particularly over the last six to 12 months is I’ve seen a lot of people who have been established in sales for a long time, who have basically said, “okay, that’s it. COVID came, everything’s changing. All the rules are changing. The way that I have to interact with people is changing. I’m not comfortable with that anymore.”

And as a result, they just basically said, “okay, I’m not doing it.”

There are other people who are like, “okay, I have to continue to plow ahead.” Maybe I can’t afford to retire or whatever. In those situations, there are people who are trying to do it, but they’re not comfortable with it. And that can cause a lot of problems.

Reimagining the Essentials of Communication

A lot of the people that I work with in our Total Market Domination course are pivoting in terms of the communication. In fact, when we originally came out with the course, it was pre COVID. Then as soon as COVID arrived, all of the questions inside the portal changed.

All of our approaches in terms of the prospecting, the presenting, the following up, those things all changed.

And, It was actually exciting for us, as participants in the program, and for me, leading the program, to be able to say, “okay, look, this isn’t working for you anymore? What can we get to work?” And not just, “what can we get to work,” but “what will you be comfortable with?”

So it’s not just a matter of saying, “okay, well now, instead of seeing people in person, Zoom with them.” Right? Because that is a lot easier said than done. But what else can we do to initiate first contact? In a future podcast, I know we’re going to be talking about alternatives to cold calling and things like that.

The Essentials Haven’t Changed. Just the Methods.

But for now, if we think in terms of what the essentials are, it still involves establishing relationships, introducing ourselves to people, creating an impression. All of those things haven’t changed. It’s now just the method that has really changed.

Jay: Yeah. I’m just curious. Do you think it’s harder now, because of COVID and because of how things have changed? Or does that just depend upon the individual and their particular skillset?

David: I think it depends a lot on the individual and their skillset. Because there are some people who are happy not to have to jump in a car and drive places. They’re able to see a lot more people, a lot more quickly. People who are comfortable with the technology can leverage themselves like you’ve never been able to leverage yourself in the past.

Creating Leverage

You can literally shoot a three-minute video and get it out to, you know, a hundred people and get 300 minutes of face-time in what will take you three minutes to shoot and a few more minutes to send out a link. So there is a lot of leverage there for the people who are willing to use it. And also to get over any of the hangups that they might have with things like video.

It’s like, “oh, my hair is out of place.” Well, your hair might be out of place when your visit somebody in person, too. “I don’t like the way I look on camera.” Well, guess what? The camera captures what we look like. So, this is it. You know? This is as good as it gets.

If you recognize that the technology can actually help you to leverage yourself and accomplish more in less time, then it becomes a lot more advantageous than not.

It’s Not About Perfection

Jay: Yeah, I have to tell you my experience is that people are much less concerned now about video quality, audio quality you know what you’re wearing in a video conference. I think we’ve all lowered our standards so much. Cause we’ve had to deal with this so much that they’re just not thinking about those things.

And I can see people being caught up in their mind. “I just have to get everything perfect or I can’t do it.” I don’t think anybody’s holding you to that standard.

David: No, I don’t think so either. And actually, I got three of these shirts. These are going to be my official podcast shirts going forward. Because one of the things that I found is potentially problematic, is if people are expecting you to be in a different outfit every time. But if people are watching for that, then they’re really not paying attention to whatever your message is.

Consistency Can Help

But I thought that from a consistency standpoint, It’s good to be able to… and like when we shoot these podcasts, you know, we’ll do more than one in a day. Well, I don’t want to be changing shirts between recordings and things like that. I don’t want people to say, “oh, you had the same shirt on last time.”

Yeah. This is my podcast shirt. I’m going to be wearing these shirts when you, generally, when you see me on video. So you can make decisions like that. Somebody else might be, “I’m going to have to have 16 different outfits because I will not be seen in the same thing twice.” But that’s a personal decision.

Jay: Yeah, and there are so many things you can get caught up in that don’t matter. Like, what does the background look like? Just so many different things, I think just, you know, be presentable, but more important than anything that you look like, it’s still about relationships, right? I mean, ultimately that’s where it’s all going to live and breathe.

We’re Reimagining the Essentials This Week

David: It is. And all this week inside the Top Secrets Inner Circle, we are going to be discussing this topic of reimagining the essentials. And what does that look like? And how do we do it? There’s a lot of nuance to this. And particularly for our members who are concerned about “how do I do some of this stuff?”

Or “how can I get comfortable doing some of this stuff?” And I think that’s where what we’re going to be diving into this week is really going to be helpful. So for Inner Circle members, who are already members, be sure to log into the portal and dive into this conversation.

For those who are watching who are not Inner Circle members, if you’d like to sign up, you can go to TopSecrets.com/ic (for Inner Circle.) Join us in the conversation.

The Need for Change

Because if you understand the importance of being able to do the things that need to happen in a different manner, in a 21st century manner, even if you are an old dog, like myself who needs to learn new tricks. And I’m probably a good example of this. My, you know, my natural inclination would be to say, well, what do I need with that, but…

Well, that’s really not my natural inclination. My natural inclination is, “ooh, cool. What’s this? What’s this new thing? How can we use this?” And so that’s really what I’m looking to help our clients with. Is to say, “all right, which aspects of this are you comfortable with? Which aspects of this could you become comfortable with? And how can we help you to put together a sequence of communications or a way to communicate with people that will help you get the results?

Jay: Yeah, I love that. Identify the things that you are very good at, but then let’s take a look at areas that you can reimagine, right? And, look at it from a different perspective. Who knows how it can affect your overall success rate?

Leveraging Technology

David: Yeah. And if you’re great at something, how can we take that thing that you’re great at, and utilize the new technology and all the new tools that you have available, to essentially broadcast that. To be able to leverage yourself, get yourself out there to a lot more people and actually create far better results than you would have been able to create on your own.

Jay: Yeah, that’s fantastic. One more time. If people are interested, how do they find out more?

David: Okay. Yeah. Just go to TopSecrets.com/ic, for Inner Circle, and you can join up there. And of course members can just go right into the portal and they know where that is. Since it’s Top Secrets, I can actually reveal that…

Jay: (Laughs) That’s right. Well, fantastic. Everybody go check it out and get started on reimagining those essentials, David, thank you so much for your time today.

David: Thank you, Jay.

Are You Ready to Reimagine the Essentials and Grow Your Sales?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.
5. Ready to Dominate Your Market? If you’re serious about creating top-of-mind-awareness with the very best prospects in your market, schedule a one-on-one Strategy Session here.

Don’t be invisible to your target market. Do they even know you’re alive? This goes back to the idea of money versus time. Because one of the advantages of social media is that if you have more time than you have money, you can spend more time posting and contacting people directly on social media.

If you have more money than you have time, then you can run ads and you can get your ads in front of people without having to sit in front of the computer all day. So there are definitely different ways to accomplish this.

If you want to become visible though, you have to have one or the other. You have to have time or money. You can’t be out of both.

Well, I have no money and I have no time to do this. Well, at that point, you’re out of business.

David: Hi, and welcome to the podcast. In today’s episode, cohost Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the topic of, Are You Invisible to Your Target Market? Welcome back, Jay.

Jay: Thank you so much, David. This one is tough for me because when you know you have a product that people want, you just know it. And you know if they could just learn about you, that you would be able to sell this product and you just know they don’t see you. It’s a frustration. It really is.

David: Yeah, we’ve talked about this topic before. I’ve talked about this topic in live presentations and probably in previous podcasts, and one of the reasons that I keep coming back to it is that it really resonates with a lot of people in business, a lot of sales people, a lot of business owners, because it is so important.

The idea of being visible or invisible to your target market is going to directly impact your ability to make things happen. And what I find kind of fun about this topic, to the extent that it can be fun, is that a lot of times in the movies or in television, invisibility is generally viewed as a big advantage.

It’s an asset, you know, Ooh, wouldn’t it be cool if I’m Harry Potter and I’ve got my invisibility cloak, and I can do all sorts of things that are cool and fun. But in business invisibility is just deadly. Because, as you indicated, if the people who could benefit from what you’re offering don’t see you, don’t hear you, don’t know you’re there, don’t know you are alive, then you have absolutely zero possibility of selling to them.

So in evaluating that question for yourself, are you invisible to your target market? It’s probably a good idea to really think it through, and don’t assume that you are more visible than you might actually be.

Jay: Yeah, we know about assumptions, right? But I think this is also important because a lot of people will only focus on advertising that gets them leads or some type of returns.

There’s a whole nother level of advertising where it’s just brand awareness. You’re probably not going to generate clicks, but if you can be one of the options in their mind, you know, if you’re a plumber and you’re not necessarily getting a lead every time you send out a postcard or something, but when that toilet finally goes down, if you’re one of the three that they think about, then you’re so much closer. And so that’s a part of advertising that I think a lot of people miss.

David: Yeah, I completely agree. I think another problem that people run into sometimes with this is that they’re trying to be everywhere at all times with everyone. And unless you have an unlimited budget, that just doesn’t work. So you can get in front of a whole lot of people who have absolutely no capacity to buy from you.

I’ve worked with businesses in the past that were running radio ads and they were business to business businesses. And they’re running on music stations, and I’m like, okay, well, it’s possible that there are some business owners or some people who could buy from you who are listening to that station, but the majority of people listening to that ad don’t own businesses.

They can’t use what it is that you’re selling. So you’re paying 100% of the purchase price of an ad on that radio station, but maybe only one to 2% of that audience is someone who could benefit from what you’re doing. So in that case, they have the opposite problem. They’re visible to lots of people, very few of whom can actually purchase.

So recognizing that we need to be visible primarily to the people who have the ability to spend money with us is going to be key.

Jay: Yeah, absolutely. And that takes research and time and tracking. But you work a lot with promotional products, and I used to think, what good is somebody giving out pens or mouse pads or things like that.

This is one of those things, you’ve been holding that pen and using it for weeks and it’s got somebody’s name on it. I didn’t need ’em before, and now suddenly I do. And here’s this pen or this mousepad that I’ve been using, and the phone number’s right there. So it’s kind of like a preemptive strike.

You’re trying to be in their mind at the right time when they actually need you.

David: Yeah, and when is the right time? It’s whenever they’re ready for it. So when you have something like that that is in front of people on an ongoing basis, the likelihood of getting that result is better. If you’re running a radio ad or a TV ad, you see it for 30 seconds and then it goes away.

Or you hear it for 30 seconds and then it goes away. So things like promotional products can be very effective like that. Especially because it’s also extremely targeted. You can send those out physically, just to the people that you want to reach and impact. So you’re not going to have the waste that’s associated with a lot of other media.

So, just sort of circling back, for those who know they need to be more visible to their target market and aren’t. You know, one of the first things that I would suggest is to evaluate who exactly is my target market? Who are the people that I need to reach? Where are they located? What companies do they work in?

Or if it’s b2c, who are they? What neighborhoods do they live in? And are there ways that I can reach them so that I can start to become visible? And then create that level of awareness they’re going to need. I refer to that as entry level awareness. In other words, they don’t know you too well yet.

They recognize that you’re alive. They recognize that you’re taking in air on the planet, but they don’t love you. They don’t hate you. They’re just aware that you exist. That sort of entry level awareness, and it’s a start, but that’s not where the sales happen. So we have to sort of move through these different levels.

We go from entry level awareness to comfort level. I get to the point where I’ve seen you enough, or I’ve seen your information, or I’ve seen your ads, or maybe I’ve met you at a networking function or two, and now I’m comfortable enough with you that I’m willing to place that first time order. And so it’s moving people through these different layers.

Starting out with moving from invisible to visible and then moving through the layers that’s going to ultimately generate the sales.

Jay: Yeah. I love the concept of entry level and we’ve heard the statistic, I don’t know what it is now, but that a customer has to see you or see your brand, you know, three, seven, whatever times…

David: Right.

Jay: Before they get to that comfort level.

David: Right.

Jay: And that can be done in a lot of ways. We talk about social media a lot in this podcast, but the beauty of social media is that you can do a lot of things that do not cost a lot of money. But you can get in front of people. And if you can do things that people will share that can be worth a lot of money. Especially for that entry level awareness that you’re talking about.

David: Yeah, and sort of going back to what we talked about in our last podcast, what does it cost to acquire a customer? This goes back to the idea of money versus time. Because one of the advantages of social media is that if you have more time than you have money, you can spend more time posting and contacting people directly on social media.

If you have more money than you have time, then you can run ads and you can get your ads in front of people without having to sit in front of the computer all day. So there are definitely different ways to accomplish this.

If you want to become visible though, you have to have one or the other. You have to have time or money. You can’t be out of both.

Well, I have no money and I have no time to do this. Well, at that point, you’re out of business. And it’s really kind of sad. But there are business owners and salespeople that I’ve talked to who kind of say that, well, I don’t have time to do that, and I don’t have money to do the ads.

It’s like, well, what are you doing all day? Because if the work that you’re doing during the day is not producing revenue that you could then use to acquire new customers, you’ve got to change those activities. Or if you’re spending time doing things that are not generating the customers to begin with, you need to change the activities that you’re engaged in in order to be able to get customers from it.

So lots of different aspects to that, but starting out with the understanding of, okay, who exactly is my target market? Where are they? What percentage are you reaching now of the people that you could and should be reaching in your market? How many of them actually know you’re alive?

There’s a definitive answer to that. You might not know the exact answer, but you’ll have a reasonably good idea.

Jay: Yeah. And I also like the idea, for entry level awareness. If you have a system that encourages people to give referrals, I don’t think that there’s a better source for entry level. You know, somebody’s at home and they’re talking to their friend and they’re like, “I’ve got a problem with my car.” And their friend says, oh, I use so and so mechanic down the street all the time. If there’s some way to encourage your customers, whether it’s some type of a gift card or something like that, to encourage them to do that, I think that’s a very strong play to get that entry level awareness.

David: Yeah, absolutely. And that really gets to the point of creating value in your communications.

It’s not just about getting something in front of them. What can I get in front of them that is going to create a positive impression that has them go, “oh wow, that’s actually valuable to me.” One of the things that we talk about in our Total Market Domination course is this idea of creating value in your communications.

It’s not enough to create value for people when they’re clients of yours. That’s expected.

If you want them to become clients, you have to create value ahead of time. Create value in advance so that they see that you actually have things that are worth saying, things that could be valuable to them, so that they’ll choose to do business with you rather than someone else.

Jay: Yeah, such a great point. If you’re running a newsletter, if you’re, you know, a blog, if you’re running online videos or something, and you’re trying to entice people to come to you, but you never give them anything of substance ahead of time, it’s going to be much more difficult.

But if they’re like, wow, I can’t believe they’re just offering that up for free, that is really an encouraging factor. because you told them to do something and they tried it and it worked. And so now you’ve created a relationship with somebody.

You’ve never even met them. But you’ve established trust, and you’ve established expertise.

David: Right. They view you as the authority in the market, which is awesome. So as you think about this and you decide, okay, how am I reaching these people? How will I reach these people? How could I reach these people, if I’m not currently reaching the way that I need to?

Then also, how often are they seeing me? Are they seeing me in their inbox? Are they getting emails? Are they getting texts? Are they seeing me on social media? Are they seeing me in the community? Where are they seeing me? How often is that happening? Getting back to your point, do they need to see you more than once?

I remember in the book Guerrilla Marketing, I think he talked about the fact that someone needs to see your message a minimum of nine times before they’re going to be ready to make a purchasing decision. And I remember when I read that the first time I read it, I thought that sounds like a lot. And then I also thought about the fact that most people aren’t even going to see your message most of the times you put it out there.

So if I post something on social media, what are the odds that you’ll even see it? Right? So I did the math and basically said, okay, I’m going to multiply that by three, each one by three. And assume that you’re not going to see two out of my three messages. That means I’ve got to get myself out there 27 times, in order for you to see me nine times so that you might be ready to place an order with me.

And these days, with so many distractions and so many different ways to reach people, that number might even be conservative. So, If you ask yourself, how often are they seeing you? What are you communicating to them? That, of course, is key.

And is your messaging consistent? Is what you’re saying valuable to them? And is it consistent? Are you jumping around a lot and saying lots of different things so they don’t know really who you are or what you’re all about? Because that just confuses people and that hinders the buying process more than it helps it.

Jay: Yeah, I totally agree. And you brought up a point about social media and will they actually see you. And this may be the subject for a completely different podcast, but I’ve learned it’s important to not rely on social media.

It may be a good lead source for you. But they could change their algorithm in one day. And what was working for you, you know, for the last year, now you’re getting nothing. You can’t rely on their system. So that’s why, you know, I think it’s important. Yes, get their attention on social media, but get them onto your property as quickly as you can.

Collect an email, collect contact information so that you can make sure, because when you start sending them an email, now you know they’re going to get it and probably see it. And so, you’ve got to be careful with those social media vehicles as well. Because I’ve seen that happen. Things were going fantastic and all of a sudden, one day you’re like, wait, what happened?

Well, they changed their algorithm and now you’re left out of the game.

David: Yes, and a lot of people do exactly what you said. They figure they’re marketing on social media. That’s all they have to do. And what they’re failing to do, in a lot of cases, they’re failing to do lead generation. Which is the purpose of being on there, to get them from that platform into your own platform as you just described.

Getting you from their customer base into my customer base. Right? They’re already a customer. Well, they’re not really a customer of Facebook. They’re the product. I remember reading that somewhere and I’m like, oh, that’s so true. We don’t pay Facebook to have a Facebook account. And the reason we don’t pay them is because we are not the customer. We are the product. We’re being sold to advertisers.

And so when you realize that, you say, okay, the goal here is to get someone from wherever I’m impacting them, and this could be a billboard, it could be anything to get them from there into my circle, into my world, so that I can then reach out to them as I want to when I’m ready to.

Jay: Absolutely. All right. How do people find out more?

David: Well, you can go to TopSecrets.com/call, schedule a call with myself or my team. Again, that’s TopSecrets.com/call. Love to have a conversation, see if we can help you to accomplish your goals and become more visible to the people who matter in your market.

Jay: All right, I love it. David, thank you so much for your time today.

David: Thank you, Jay.

Are You Ready to Become Visible to Your Target Audience?

If so, check out the five primary ways we help promotional product distributors grow:

1. 1. Just Getting Started? If you (or someone on your team) is just getting started in promotional products sales, learn how we can help.
   2. Need Clients Now? If you’re already grounded in the essentials of promotional product sales and just need to get clients now, click here.
   3. Want EQP/Preferential Pricing? Are you an established industry veteran doing a significant volume of sales? If so, click here to get End Quantity Pricing from many of the top supplier lines in the promo industry.
   4. Time to Hire Salespeople? If you want to hire others to grow your promo sales, click here.

When we're doing business-to-business or business-to-consumer outbound calls, the truth about call reluctance is that it can seem very real. Those fears can be founded. They might very well say no. Or they might be rude, obnoxious, belligerent. It's possible they say all kinds of things that you don't want to hear. So that's all true. That could happen. One of the things that helped me a lot though, is recognizing that we are not doing it for them. We are not doing this for the people who react like that. We are doing it for the people that we are ultimately going to help. And we can't get to the people that we are going to ultimately help without having to go through some of these people sometimes in between. David: Hi, and welcome to the podcast. In today's episode, co-host Jay McFarland and I will be discussing the topic, Is Call Reluctance Real? Jay: Listen, it's a pleasure to be here, David, and let me tell you, this is one of my biggest issues. I know it's real because I have a job where I spend a lot of time on the phone and man, there are days where I just do not want to do it. And what's funny is it's actually something that I enjoy, but it requires a certain level of energy. It requires that you are prepared and there is the occasional call that turns in a direction that I don't want to go. And so this is me to a T. I experience this on a regular weekly basis. David: Yeah, and the title is kind of provocative and I guess I sort of did that on purpose. Because anyone who has experienced this, that feeling of, "oh, I just don't feel like picking up the phone," is going to look at this and say, "well, yes, of course, it's real." And I think that when we just look at it as call reluctance, then it's easy to say, yes, it's real. What do we do about it? But the reason that I wanted to raise the topic is that I don't believe that call reluctance is actually the issue. if you boil it down, what does it mean? When I did this for myself and for other people who were struggling with it, it all really just boils down to fear, right? It's some type of fear. It's not that we're really afraid of picking up the phone. That's the easy part. It's not that we're afraid of dialing. The issue is what's going to happen next. It's about that unknown. And I think that's what people struggle with, without even realizing that that's what they're struggling with. Jay: Yeah. So I mean, for me, fear of rejection, fear of the no, and I mentioned fear of the negative experience. You know, the guy who's asking the questions that I can't answer or wants to spend two hours on the phone and I only have 20 minutes for him or those kinds of things. You're right, it's all born out of fear. David: And what's interesting, too, is that today, if you have to pick up the phone and call somebody and you don't have an appointment with that person, the likelihood that they're actually even going to answer, that you're going to get to a live human being is probably what? 30%? 20%, right? 10%. I mean, most of them are going to go to voicemail. And so voicemails are kind of easy as long as you know what you're going to say when you get a voicemail message. So a lot of it, I mean, at least 80% of it, it's like, well, there shouldn't be any fear here because they're probably not going to answer. Right? But as you indicated, it's the fear of rejection. In some cases, it's the fear of success. And some people are like, "I've never had fear of success. I love success." Well, we all love success, but sometimes getting to that success can be a little frightening. It can be a little bit of a struggle. And sometimes it's just, hesitation is born out of fears that just haven't even manifested yet. Jay: Yeah. They're not real. And, for me, it's asking the question, "what if?" And this is again, something that my parents taught me. I would tell them that I didn't want to do something or I was afraid of doing something and ...