Back in 2013 Christopher O'Donnell and I were told to bring HubSpot CRM to market. Now we’re reuniting to discuss the future of sales and what jobs will survive the AI era. Think your team's ready to ditch the SDR/AE/CSM split? Get our free guide to the full-cycle seller model: 🔗 https://clickhubspot.com/n59s Christopher is now the founder of Day AI, and he's spent years thinking about the same questions I have: what actually happens to sales roles, CRM, and go-to-market design once AI in sales can do 2-10x the work of a human. In this conversation, we get into why the SDR/AE/CSM specialization era is ending and the "full-cycle athlete" seller is coming back, and what jobs survive an AI-native world. -Mark

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

Every founder needs to sell. If you're not comfortable selling, then get comfortable.

I see too many founders think that once they've secured the first revenue & gotten Series A they can hire a professional sales team. Wrong.

Today's guest Frederic Kerrest (Co-Founder, Okta) tells us why it's so important for founders to be salespeople, and the when & how to start building your team.

Use referral code: SOS to request your spot at this year's  ⁠⁠HubSpot AiSummit 2025⁠⁠ in San Francisco on June 11.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Media podcast in partnership with Hubspot for Startups// ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more about HubSpot for Startups⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling⁠⁠⁠⁠

When budgets are tight and every rep needs to perform, you need force multipliers, not more headcount.

Sometimes you need Rule of 40 -- a private equity orientation that can still lead to great success for the founders, the executives, and the investors.

Mark Wayland (CRO, Box) talk about how only a few months into his grow at all costs company he found himself with an activist investor and a pivot to Rule of 40.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

You've navigated your company to unicorn status. Crack the champagne, ring the bell, and hang the banner. Only, months later the macro changes.

Now, you need to pivot the model, pivot the playbook, and pivot the team.

Today I'm joined by Carina Brockl, (fmr. CRO, Aurora Solar) who faced these challenging shifts and tells us how she navigated them.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

There's tremendous conviction that AI is eating the software ecosystem.

Well, today we speak with Andy Shorkey (CRO, Writer).

Not only is he navigating all the complexities of bringing native AI products to market, he's also reinventing the way that go-to market is done internally in a far more efficient way in the post AI world.

LINKS

Exclusive ICP Expansion Guide: https://clickhubspot.com/ahk

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

Send me your cold calls! Email us at [email protected].

I'll help you set more meetings &. we'll use your call in an upcoming video.

So Producer Matthew fails at cold calling. But he learns the framework that actually works.

*Stop freezing up on sales calls, get a script!* 🔗 https://clickhubspot.com/29868f

I roped in Producer Matthew to actually try selling me a pizza. It was terrifying. But even if you're good at this, you get hung up on 90% of the time.

I break down what makes effective cold calls work - from the opening line that gets you past those crucial first seconds, to handling objections without needing people to like you (apparently my people-pleasing instincts are a sales career killer). You'll learn Sam Nelson's proven framework that even Harvard Business School students use, why sounding like a "nervous 14-year-old" is actually better than sounding polished, and how to stay in the objection "flywheel" until you get that meeting. If you're still reading this, go ahead and drop a cold calling story in the comments. I'll be waiting!! Follow us on YouTube at The Science of Scaling: 🔗 www.youtube.com/@ScienceofScaling

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

Perplexity is attempting something no one thought possible: Challenging Google for search dominance.

 Dmitri Shevelenko was advising five different orgs, before fully signing on to Perplexity. What energy and pull he found from this vision?

And he unpacks how Perplexity successfully transitioned from founder selling to professional sales.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

Imagine passing $5 million with three customers. That is whale hunting.

Going after big customers with big deals from day one isn't advisable. But sometimes it's the only path.

Today, Ed Calnan (Co-Founder and Fmr. CRO, Seismic) walks us through how to get big account's attention, get through procurement, get through security, all solve for all the things that kill the startups that try this path.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling

Companies with a very tightly defined ICP that is operationalized on the frontline spend 50% less on sales and marketing.

They have CAC payback periods that are 24% shorter than the mean, and those ICP customers have a 425% higher expansion rate in the first 12 months compared to those that are not.

Today Dan Sperring (Founder, AlignICP) explores how product success is often determined by specific use cases rather than customer demographics, and challenges the common startup approach of targeting broad markets too early.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.

Grab our guide to transform your sales approach: ⁠https://clickhubspot.com/zrjp

The amount of personalization is off the charts. The amount of time and money you're willing to invest is enormous. Because it's a million dollar deal.

I'll walk you through how to navigate complex Decision Making Units, adapt your entire sales playbook for enterprise deals, and implement advanced qualification frameworks that go way beyond the basics.

I'll also reveal what the best enterprise sellers consistently tell me is their number one reason for winning deals.

Whether you're trying to move upmarket or sharpen your enterprise sales approach, these frameworks will help you transform your business. Happy scaling, everyone!

Check out The Science of Scaling YouTube channel: www.youtube.com/@ScienceofScaling

Get the Science of Scaling Database! Real Playbooks from Billion-Dollar Companies: ⁠⁠https://clickhubspot.com/scienceofscaling 

What if I told you to build the sales team that doesn't talk about price or packaging? That doesn't even do discovery or qualification on budget or authority on the first call?

You'd think I'm crazy.

Chris Merritt (Founding CRO, Cloudflare) built a sales team that's a peer to its very technical buyer, whose first and only objective is to answer the buyer's questions.

He actually looked at the company's blog as inspiration on the type of salespeople he would hire and the type of sales culture he will build.

The Science of Scaling is a HubSpot Original Podcast // Brought to you by HubSpot Media in collaboration with ⁠HubSpot For Startups⁠ // Produced by Matthew Brown.