Julie King is a renowned parenting expert, author, and workshop leader who has dedicated her career to helping parents communicate more effectively with their children. She is the co-author of two bestselling books: "How to Talk So Little Kids Will Listen” and "How to Talk When Kids Won't Listen”.

Julie joined this episode to discuss:

• The trick to get kids to leave the park (and your users to retain)

• The secret framing solution for showing kids (and users) their progress

• The way to ask someone to do something that is foolproof

• How to set boundaries and still acknowledge feelings (employee management 101)

• The psychology behind getting your kids to go to bed (or users to engage)

This episode reveals why the same psychological principles that work with stubborn toddlers can transform your product strategy and team dynamics.

Whether you're designing user flows, managing stakeholder relationships, or creating engagement strategies, Julie's communication framework offers valuable techniques for influencing behavior without creating resistance—critical skills for anyone building a successful product.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast. Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠here⁠.

Mac Namara is an expert dog trainer who specializes in positive reinforcement techniques. She runs Puppy Prep, a company designed to help new dog owners set their puppies up for success from day one through science-based training methods. 

In our conversation, we explore:

• Why the speed of reinforcement (every 6 seconds!) is critical for behavior change

• How to train in short, focused bursts rather than lengthy sessions

• The importance of environment design over willpower or personality traits

• How to properly transition from consistent to variable reward schedules

• Why focusing on what TO do works better than punishing unwanted behaviors

• The problem with saying "no" without showing the alternative

• How these principles directly translate to product design and user onboarding

• Lessons from dog training that apply to workplace feedback and management

This episode offers practical insights on designing for behavior change through the science of positive reinforcement. A must-listen for product teams looking to create more engaging experiences and anyone interested in the psychology of meaningful habit formation!

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠⁠here⁠⁠.

Christine May helped spearhead behavioral science at Noom, shaping it into an engine for user segmentation and accountability. As their former Head of Behavioral Science, she championed Noom’s “big picture” motivation model—tying everyday habits to goals—and played a role in scaling one-on-one coaching into a digital system for millions. Now, Christine helps consumer tech startups build habit-forming experiences rooted in evidence-based psychology.

In our conversation, we explore:

• The book club principle: How to embed accountability in features customers actually want

• Why 90% of users reject direct accountability features (and how to solve this)

• How Noom's lengthy sign-up flow acts as a commitment filter

• The counterintuitive confidence level that predicts user success

• What makes fixed-length plans more effective than endless subscriptions

• How to design rewards around behaviors instead of outcomes

• The unexpected way social desirability drives product engagement

This episode is packed with practical insights on designing for sustainable behavior change, creating effective accountability systems that users actually want, and the surprising psychology behind what motivates people to stick with challenging goals.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠here⁠.

Marin Alsop is a world-renowned conductor and the first woman to lead major orchestras internationally. The subject of the Emmy-nominated documentary "The Conductor” and formerly Music Director of the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra, she’s Chief Conductor of the ORF Vienna Radio Symphony Orchestra and the Ravinia Festival, and Principal Guest Conductor of the Philharmonia Orchestra and the Philadelphia Orchestra. She has recorded 200+ titles and is the only conductor to receive a MacArthur Fellowship.

In this episode, we explore:

• How giving people max autonomy drives performance 

• How to balance elite talent with team cohesion

• Theories on talent selection to build top teams

• The "no shortcuts" practice philosophy 

This episode is great for anyone building teams. It offers powerful insights on creating excellence at scale, balancing autonomy with accountability, and fostering self-motivation. Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.

Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠here⁠.

David Gerard is one of Silicon Valley's most sought-after magicians and mentalists, performing over 90 shows annually for Fortune 500 companies and tech industry leaders. Before pursuing magic full-time, David spent 12 years in tech, starting at Google where he worked on flagship products including YouTube, AdWords, and Google Play, before leading growth and marketing initiatives at Discord and Aalto. Now, David combines his expertise in product growth with his mastery of psychological principles from magic, consulting with series A and B startups while maintaining a rigorous performance schedule that includes over 60 shows at Hollywood's prestigious Magic Castle. His unique background bridging tech and magic makes him a distinctive voice on user psychology, attention, and engagement.

In our conversation, we unpack:

• A magician's secret for creating engaging experiences

• How magic shows achieve retention (and what products can learn from it)

• The misdirection technique that can transform user experiences

• What magicians know about building trust that most companies miss

• The surprising way performers make experiences feel personalized at scale

From Google to the stage, David Gerard has mastered both tech product growth and performance magic. In this episode, he reveals the psychological principles behind great magic shows and how product teams can apply them to create experiences users can't look away from. A must-listen for growth, product and design leaders looking to add a touch of magic to their user experience.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.

Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Orson Scott Card is the author of Ender’s Game, one of the most influential science fiction novels ever written, and its sequel Speaker for the Dead, among other bestselling works. Ender’s Game is widely read in schools across the US and has been included in some educational curricula. In our conversation, we explore:

• His approach to creating page-turners: Why telling users what's coming beats clever "hooks" 

• His method of ensuring the reader understands his writing (great for design teams) 

• His unique perspective to character development that could help with customer interviews 

• The one trick Orson uses for getting real feedback

This episode teaches product teams how to apply storytelling principles to build more engaging, intuitive products. Whether you're working on marketing, user experience, or team leadership, Orson Scott Card's insights on crafting immersive narratives that respect both audience and reality offer valuable lessons for anyone building products people love (and pay for).

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Kristina Gibson most recently was the CPO at Dott, accelerating their growth to over 100M rides annually. She led the merger with TIER to form Europe’s largest e-bike and scooter operator.

She is a former Director of Product at Booking.com, where she pioneered user growth strategy across global markets. As an early product leader at Lyft, she architected the company's expansion into new cities and innovative verticals.

At Eventbrite, Kristina transformed the business from a US-only operation to a powerhouse platform across 20+ markets, founding and scaling teams throughout Europe and Latin America. 

Kristina began her career at Intuit, building international payments that transformed how small businesses pay vendors across borders. When Mint.com was acquired by Intuit, she drove their expansion into new markets. She holds five patents.

In this episode, we explore:

When to rely on A/B tests compared to taking bigger strategic bets

The hidden psychology behind last-minute purchase decisions

Why showing unavailable options can drive more conversions

The unexpected power of surfacing micro-details in product listings

How to balance user preferences with innovation risks

This episode is packed with insights from a trailblazing product leader who has run thousands of experiments at top product growth companies. It's essential listening for teams looking to shape user behavior through thoughtful product decisions.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠here⁠.

Dan Petroski is the founder and winemaker of Massican Wines. Massican was recently acquired by Gallo and is the only solely white wine producer in Napa Valley—a region famed for reds. Dan is known as a world-class marketer, combining storytelling, positioning and distribution insights to make Massican what it is today. In our conversation, we discuss:

• The theory of pricing (and the sweet spot in wine pricing)

• Why you should build your distribution channel before the product

• The key to building a premium brand experience

• Massican’s secret for reducing risk in a very risky market

• How to use language to build customer confidence 

This episode is packed with fresh insights onpricing psychology,brand storytelling, and the art (and behavioral science) of crafting memorablecustomer experiences.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠⁠here⁠⁠.

Joel Burgess, co-founder of Soft Rains, andDan Vader, Creative Director at Capybara Games, are the minds behind Grindstone, one of the most acclaimed indie puzzle games in recent years. Joel has worked on iconic titles like Watch Dogs: Legion and Skyrim. Dan, a long-time creative force at Capybara, has shaped the studio’s reputation with beloved games like Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery EP. Together, Joel and Dan bring a fresh perspective on game design, combining narrative depth with challenging gameplay mechanics to engage players at a deeper level.

In this episode, we explore:

• Which types of game mechanics drive retention

• What game designers know about onboarding users 

• What game designers have learned about leaderboards

• How pricing influences user behavior

• Tips on simplifying complex experiences (and when to make them more complex)

Loaded with actionable insights, this episode is a must-listen for growth and design teams looking to build lasting engagement through intrinsic motivation and thoughtfully designed user experiences.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Cal Thompson is the VP of Product Design & Research at Headspace, where they lead a team dedicated to creating user-centered designs that drive real-world impact. Their focus is to combine design practices with rigorous research to help users achieve their meditation goals. Before Headspace, Cal served as a Design Director at Fjord San Francisco. In this episode, we explore:

• What key metric Headspace measures for active use

• The small feature change that increased engagement

• The one trick they use for copy-editing

• What drives people to re-engage with Headspace

• How pricing (free vs. paid) impacts user engagement 

This episode is packed with practical takeaways for PMs and anyone interested in the psychology of habit creation.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.

Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labshere.

Trying something new is hard at the macro level. Yelp reviews reduce that uncertainty that comes with new things. But how do they help businesses achieve organic and meaningful reviews? In this episode, host Kristen Berman is joined by Akhil Kuduvalli Ramesh, VP of Consumer Product at Yelp. He explains why Yelp prefers quality over quantity when it comes to reviews and how your Yelp review creates community and helps new businesses. They also talk about high-frequency low-risk experience while taking a look at some studies and other companies’ strategies, like Spotify’s approximate nearest neighbor search. Stay tuned and learn the many features that are promoting human connection at Yelp!

Jump straight into:

(01:17) - Engineering behind a review: Reminders, thank you notes and opportune timing to enhance more reviews.

(07:42) - Why do people write reviews? The common denominators the most frequent Yelp contributors share.

(13:19) - Promoting human connection: The best hacks to make first reviews flow organically and be longer.

(16:57 - Understanding search processes’ verticals for different business categories in Yelp (and how they created the reorder button). 

(26:15) - The perks of being a responsive business owner (and how Yelp facilitates clever questions to be answered by more than one person).

(32:41) - Looking for something wildly different than ice cream: On Yelp’s target diversification and the appearance of new kinds of experiences.

Episode resources

Connect with Akhil through LinkedIn

Yelp

Thank you for listening to Science of Change podcast. Reach out to Kristen through LinkedIn and visit The Irrational Labs website for more information on behavioral science. 

This show is presented by SetSail and produced by Kristen Berman and Studio Pod Media. The executive producer is Rachael Roberts. All episodes are written by Kristen Berman and Ying Lin with experts, script editing by Jack viewer. Special thanks to Lydia Trupe for fact checking and citations. Music and editing provided by nodalab.