How much has our understanding of choice evolved throughout history? And what has that invention meant to how we experience and acknowledge freedom?
Sophia Rosenfeld is a professor of history at the University of Pennsylvania and an expert on the history of things taken for granted. Her books, Common Sense: A Political History, Democracy and Truth: A Short History, and most recently The Age of Choice: A History of Freedom in Modern Life, examine the origins of ideas that have become so commonplace in our modern world, they can often go overlooked.
Sophia and Greg discuss the historical role of choice in consumerism, politics, and personal relationships, how choice initially got a reputation for being a feminine phenomenon, what choice has meant for concepts like freedom, and the political evolution of common sense in today’s world.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
Has choice become the ultimate measure of freedom?
47:24: Choice once had this kind of very moral apparatus around it. And, as I mentioned, over time, choice became more, I would call, value-neutral. It meant pick what you like. I don't have to like your choices; it's just what you prefer. But the strange third twist in this story is that just having the choices itself started to become a moral good. Just saying choice itself was the good, and I think that's not always right because there are certainly moments in which choice is freeing, but there are also choices that are not freeing—there are choices that are contrary to our well-being, there are places where choice is not a benefit. This choice of any weapon to buy, for instance, is a different kind of decision than saying choice in profession. Your choice in profession has little bearing on me. Your choice in weapon might have a large bearing on me or the other guy down the street. So I do question the assumption that more choice, more opportunities, more options is always preferable.
How choice became the definition of freedom
37:22: In the face of the threat of communism on the one hand and the threat of fascism on the other, one thing that starts to emerge most strongly in the U.S., but also in other parts of the sort of allied world, is a convergence around political choice and commercial choice, saying that what freedom is, is having choice in these two different domains. And from that point forward, I think you might say that democracy and capitalism get wedded together around the notion that choice is freedom.
Is having more choices always a good thing?
42:42: We've now seen policies emerge on the right and on the left framed around choice. School choice is usually more appealing on the right, reproductive choice more appealing on the left. So, I would have said that choice is one of those things that we are so used to that it's a kind of unquestioned value across the political spectrum. We might fight about what should be and by whom, but we don't fight about the value of choice itself. And to this day, things are marketed all the time around choice. You look at billboards or look at advertising anywhere you are, and you'll see choice is still a really common term—whether it's banking, house cleaning, or anything else. That may be ending in some spheres on the right.
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How important is it for business leaders to not only identify talent within their organization, but to take meaningful action to actually develop that talent? On the flip side, how handicapping can it be for an organization to keep employees who are holding the company back from success?
Bill Conaty is a top former HR executive at GE and co-author of The Talent Masters: Why Smart Leaders Put People Before Numbers. His 40 years at GE and his time as an advisory partner for Clayton, Dubilier & Rice has made him an expert in identifying and developing raw talent at an organization.
Bill joins Greg to share insights from his time at GE, emphasizing the necessity of integrating HR with other business functions and the importance of having a seat at the table. They also discuss GE's unique HR practices, such as talent development programs, the role of corporate audit staff, and the evolution of HR through different business eras, including the impact of COVID-19 and the DEI movement.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
Candor comes first trust comes later
41:55: Candor comes first; trust comes later. In other words, we always—through our leadership development in session C, we had to say, "We always had the list of development need, one or two." And it wasn't that I needed to go to the next course at Crotonville or that I'm too tough on myself. It had to do with legitimate development needs, and you had to be able to trust the company before you could cite, you know, "I don't have great listening skills," or—and you had to feel like, "Whatever you stipulate, we're going to work with you on that." And we said: a development need is not a fatal flaw. A development need is only a development need as long as you address it. If you don't, it can become a fatal flaw.
HR Success Starts with the CEO
05:41: No matter how good of an HR leader you are, if the CEO doesn't have high expectations for what he wants out of that function, you're in for a long day.
What do we look for in leaders?
34:50: What do we look for in leaders? We started out with three E's—energy, energize, and edge—and so that's a green light, red light, yellow light. We'd go out to all the businesses, and we came away from one, and the leader had dynamite energy, could energize others, more than enough edge, and his numbers sucked. So, I said to Jack, "We assume this, but we need a fourth E, and that's called execution."
Do you need a different kind of talent master to evaluate the talent versus the values?
53:26: I think the values piece is—I think it's fairly easy to identify, but it's fairly easy to identify. If you have a real intimacy in the organization. If you don't, if you're just standing off in the distance and applauding the numbers that are coming in, you can have a real kick-ass leader that people really don't enjoy working for and probably won't work for that long.
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Contrary to popular belief, global migration levels have remained relatively stable. So why has it become such a hot button issue on the political world stage?
Hein de Haas is a professor of sociology at the University of Amsterdam and an expert in migration. His book, How Migration Really Works: The Facts About the Most Divisive Issue in Politics delves into migration as a historical and ongoing phenomenon, comparing past and present migration patterns.
Hein and Greg discuss common misconceptions about migration, why people migrate in the first place, and what the actual impact of migration is on the economy, culture, and climate.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
Political showmanship won’t solve migration
26:24: There are no easy solutions for complex migration problems. So that migration can cause problems in places where migrants concentrate, and not everybody is happy about it, particularly because employers reap the biggest benefits of their cheap labor—I can fully understand that. But the kind of solutions that politicians sell to us have more to do with bold acts of political showmanship than any really serious effort to control and manage migration.
Migration is part of development
15:07: We need a new paradigm, a new theory on migration—that migration is part of development. This is not about liking migration or not or denying that migration can also lead to tensions and problems. But if you deny that fundamental reality, you also see it in middle-income countries, where many governments have tried to stop or curb rural-to-urban migration. It has all failed.
Are politicians in denial about the realities of migration?
02:53: Both in the U.S., but also across the Atlantic in Europe, politicians have been basically in denial for over the last four to five decades about the realities of migration. That's the reason why these policies always fail. It’s a lack of fundamental understanding of migration as a social and economic process that needs to be the foundation of any policy. The migration issue has been completely hijacked by politicians, with pro- and anti-migration debates that don't really engage with the realities of migration. That huge gap is really the problem.
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As conversation swirls around how the U.S. is going to pay back its $30 trillion debt, old concerns about public debt have been raised once again.
Barry Eichengreen is a professor of economics at UC Berkeley and one of the leading experts on international currency markets and their history. His books include Globalizing Capital: A History of the International Monetary System, The Populist Temptation: Economic Grievance and Political Reaction in the Modern Era, and most recently, In Defense of Public Debt.
Barry and Greg delve into the pros and cons of public debt, the mechanisms ensuring sovereign debt repayment, and the potential risks of inflation, and put modern debt levels into perspective by looking back at other major financial events in history. They also discuss the impact of political polarization on long-term financial decisions.
**This episode was recorded in 2021.**
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
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The political capacity to issue public debt goes hand in hand with financial development
31:25: If you go back and look at the history, you see the value to financial markets of sovereign debt—that as sovereigns’ and states’ debts begin to be recognized as safe and liquid with political checks and balances, they become safe. With the development of markets in them, they become more liquid. They're then used as collateral for other borrowing and lending, and you accelerate the development of private financial markets. So, I think the political capacity to issue public debt goes hand in hand with financial development, and financial development, historically, is an important component of economic development.
Public debt as a lifeline in times of crisis
02:58: Public debt has been critically important in history. To enable states to meet emergencies—so, if you look at the history, it has been issued typically in wartime to defend the realm. Admittedly, states and rulers have issued it to fight offensive as well as defensive wars, but also to meet threats, pandemics, natural disasters, and other national emergencies.
Why public debt levels depend on politics and time
34:50: I don't think economic science is advanced to the point where we can identify an optimal or uniquely sustainable level of public debt. I think politics impinges on this as well. So, if you ask a German politician and an American politician what an appropriate or optimal level of public debt is, they'll give you very different answers. Economic circumstances change over time as well. So, public U.S. public debt in the hands of the public has basically tripled since the turn of the century. Debt service—interest paid on that debt as a share of GDP—hasn't budged. Interest rates have come down, and they've been trending downward for the better part of 30 or 40 years. That has made it easier to sustain a heavier level of public debt.
What are the ramifications of holding a fixed mindset over a growth mindset? How does it alter the mechanics of the people within a company and what can be done to shift an entrenched culture mindset?
Mary C. Murphy is a Professor of Psychology and Brain Science at the University of Indiana, and the author of the book Cultures of Growth: How the New Science of Mindset Can Transform Individuals, Teams, and Organizations.
Greg and Mary discuss the differences between growth and fixed mindsets, the significant impact of environmental factors on a given mindset, and the concept of mindset culture. Mary shares insights from her research and personal experiences, including her collaboration with Carol Dweck on the external factors influencing mindset. Their conversation covers the practical applications of growth mindset principles in education and corporate settings, how to implement effective learning systems, the role of leadership in fostering a culture of growth, and the importance of reframing effort in relation to ability.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
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Reframing effort and ability through growth mindset
41:55: So, what the growth mindset culture does—and what we do when we are creating growth mindset learning environments or working environments in companies—is that we're really trying to reframe that relationship between effort and ability. Pointing out, telling stories, showing people, having them do self-reflection on where they made the most progress, right? Where do you actually see the best outcomes coming? Is it always effortless, or have there been challenges that have been overcome, strategies that had to be pivoted, and teams that had to come together, right? So, illuminating the process of success helps people understand whether or not effort is what's required for ability, required for high success, right? And strong success and excellence.
Why growth cultures are more diverse and inclusive
49:36: In a culture of growth, it's much more diverse naturally. Why? Because it's not about matching to some narrow prototype of success that looks or feels a certain way. Instead, it's about who can grow the most, who can develop the most, who can pivot, who's overcome challenges. And when we look at our society and look at who has overcome challenges, who has actually had to pivot, try new things, and overcome these structural barriers, we see that that's a much more diverse group of people. And it's not just focused on any one identity. And so, we see that in these cultures of growth, they attract, retain, promote, and positively evaluate a much wider variety of people.
How do we mirror growth to inspire workplace success?
34:50: As adults in the workplace setting, if we can create relationships where we actually show employees and our direct reports—individual contributors—where we have seen their growth and development, appreciate that, and mirror it for them, it puts them in that growth mindset. This makes them willing to try something new, to continue to push, and to continue to develop either in that area or in a new area that's required in the moment. And so, I think that's one thing that we can do pretty easily—to just be that mirror for process, growth, and development for people and help them reflect on that for themselves.
What are the problems facing academic journals today? What changes to the system could be made to address them? How could being more open about studies that aren’t successful actually be a success strategy overall?
Faye Flam is a science and medical journalist, a columnist for Bloomberg, host of the podcast Follow the Science, and the author of The Score: The Science of the Male Sex Drive.
Greg and Faye discuss the importance and challenges of science journalism. Their conversation touches on the role of science journalists in translating and evaluating scientific data, the replication crisis, the influence of fraudulent research, the dynamics of public trust in science, and the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on public health communication. They also examine the issue with the growing proliferation of deepfakes, ‘fake news,’ and the importance of maintaining journalistic integrity in an increasingly digital age.
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Science journalism and the challenge of neutrality
38:23: I think that it's harder these days to sell the kind of story that I used to think was, that I still think is, kind of the heart and soul of science journalism, which is to try to separate the science from the values, try to understand why people are disagreeing, try to understand where the science has evolved, where the science might have been wrong in the past. So even something as fraught as whether sex is binary, I think at least in the past, that's something you could tackle as a journalist without taking sides, but just adding clarity and adding context and saying, you know, these people disagree because they have different values and they want to use different language. They're interpreting things differently. But there are certain aspects of biology that everybody agrees on.
Rethinking failure in science
10:08: People have to rethink the meaning of failure. If you have a hypothesis that's kind of a long shot, and you test it, and you do a really good experiment, and you find out the hypothesis didn't hold up, well, you've tested that. Maybe that's something you can rule out. That should be an acceptable, perfectly normal part of science. It's not a failure per se. It's just that sometimes you have to rule something out that's a long shot.
On the confidence trap of AI
49:01: One of the hazards of AI is that people—it's so confident—it answers questions with so much confidence, and it sounds so smart that people just assume it's right. And it's often not right. People call them hallucinations, but it can just be, with some subtle thing in your prompt, right? I think there is going to be a period where people are seduced into believing AI because it can be so incredibly smart, and it makes these statements with so much confidence. But a lot of it—there is this kind of chaos to it. Little changes in the prompt will completely change the answer.
When did humans learn to communicate through language? Did it coincide with the invention of fire? Or was it more a gradual process that involved much more than just making sounds with our mouths?
Steven Mithen is a professor of prehistory at the University of Reading and the author of numerous books on human evolution including, The Singing Neanderthals: The Origins of Music, Language, Mind, and Body, Thirst: Water and Power in the Ancient World, and most recently, The Language Puzzle: Piecing Together the Six-Million-Year Story of How Words Evolved. His work weaves together disciplines like psychology, linguistics, and genetics to chart the history and evolution of the ways our minds make sense of the world.
Greg and Steven discuss the integrative nature of language evolution, the role of social and physical environments in shaping language, and the interconnectedness of music and language in bonding and communication. Steven also shares how studying ancient civilizations’ water management strategies unveils lessons for today’s global water crisis.
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Gesture evolved with language but never drove it forward
17:43: Gesture has always accompanied language but never driven it forward. Music's maybe a little bit different, really. It seems to me musical sounds we make are almost more like gestures. And I think that time of moving to full bipedalism at about two million years ago, did really make bodies hugely more expressive. And it was a time when not only body language became important, but I think dance and singing, stamping feet, slapping thighs—all of that acting as a really important way of building social bonds, of doing some sort of communication, pushed forward that social interaction communication.
Language shapes perception
51:14: Different languages have different concepts of how the world is and should be seen, and that does influence how you perceive and think about it.
Language shapes culture and complex thought
25:01: I think we're mistaken if we think social bonding is the only role of language or necessarily the most important. There are at least two other things that it really does. Just a transmission of information from generation to generation. What we don't see in our human ancestors, like Homo erectus, and then our relatives like the Neanderthals, is only accumulation of culture; it doesn't seem to build from one generation to the next. And I suspect that's because there is a limitation on the way they're using language and the ability to gradually construct more complex ideas. But the other way we use language, and the other important one, is for thinking about complex ideas that I think we just can't do without it. And that's where a metaphor comes in—I think it's hugely important.
How can Legacy companies transform themselves to compete with Startups? What lessons can be learned from the different ways legacy companies Microsoft and IBM navigated the new business landscape. What can we expect from the new tech hubs popping up around the world that aim to be a recreation of what makes Silicon Valley work?
Vivek Wadhwa is an academic, entrepreneur, and author of five best-selling books: From Incremental to Exponential, Your Happiness Was Hacked, The Driver in the Driverless Car, Innovating Women, and The Immigrant Exodus.
Greg and Vivek discuss Vivek’s journey from tech entrepreneur to academic and prolific author. They discuss Vivek’s different books focusing on innovation, legacy companies, and the impact of technology on society. Vivek highlights the failures of traditional innovation methods, the cultural transformations necessary for company revitalization, and the broader societal impacts of technology addiction. Additionally, Vivek shares his personal strategies for managing tech distractions in his own life and emphasizes the necessity of face-to-face interactions for true innovation in business.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
**This episode was recorded in 2021.**
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The reason silicon valley can't be replicated
14:19: Silicon Valley can't be replicated because you need much more than a few people. It's all about culture, the fact that we interact with each other. I mean, you go to parties over here. I mean, I remember coming to Silicon Valley 12 years ago and bumping into Mark Zuckerberg. I said, "Oh my God, Mark Zuckerberg is here." And then you bump into Mitch Kapor, you know, all of these people, and you just go up to them, and they talk to you like normal people. So it's informal; you go to any coffee shop over here, and you ask someone, "You know, what are you doing?" First of all, they'll start telling you about all the things that they failed in. They'll show off about their failure, and then they'll openly tell you what they're doing. Try doing that anywhere else in the world.
On how are the people being addicted to technologies
47:41:The fact is that all of us are addicted. We're checking email. We wake up in the morning, and we check email. We go to bed late at night; we're checking email. We're traveling home from work; we're checking email. Right? We're now exchanging texts, you know, 24/7. When we have any free time, we'll start watching some TikTok videos. I mean, the kids, from the time they're like six months old now, seem to be on their iPads and so on. And the result is that teen suicide rates are high. We're not aware. All the studies about happiness show that we are less happy than we ever were. So everything good that should have happened hasn't happened. Instead, we've become addicted, and it's become a big problem for us.
Disruption can come from anywhere
08:38: You have to be aware that disruption would come from everywhere, and you need to have all hands on deck. It's no longer R&D departments that specialize in developing some specific technology—it's everyone in your company, right? Marketing, customer support, sales, your engineers, of course, finance—everyone now has a role in disruption, helping you reinvent yourself.
Is it time to drastically change the way we think about failure? What if failure is the key to success?
John Danner is a faculty member at UC Berkeley and Princeton University and the author of Built for Growth and The Other “F” Word. His research focuses on leadership, strategy, and innovation. He regularly consults with Fortune 500 companies, offering actionable strategies to help them adapt to ever-changing landscapes and grow.
John and Greg discuss the paradox of Silicon Valley’s celebration of failure and the reality behind it, turning regrets into strategic resources, the importance of self-knowledge, both for individuals and organizations, and how understanding your personality can influence successful entrepreneurship.
*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*
**This episode was recorded in 2021.**
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Embracing failure leads to growth
03:33: There's something quintessentially human about failure that connects all of us because we are all experts at it. We do it all the time in very unexpected ways, yet we tend too often to walk away from it, to ignore it, to not talk about it. And it's become, I think, a taboo unto itself, but also, from a leadership point of view, in my experience, both in teaching, consulting, and running organizations, starting organizations, it is a huge barrier in most organizations that I'm familiar with. If you can't talk about failure, if you can't genuinely, honestly, openly discuss it and understand what's behind it, you're never going to be in a position to actually leverage and benefit from it.
Failure is like gravity
12:11: Failure is like gravity. It is a force and fact of nature. It is inexorable and unavoidable, and it's not a strong force of nature. It's a weak force of nature, but it is the kind of phenomenon that I think we're dealing with.
The value of failure
02:41: What failure almost always is: reality's way of telling you that you weren't as smart as you thought you were, you were conducting an experiment all along, and it's reality that's telling you what you didn't know but thought you did. So, it's got some value for sure.
How can we embrace failure without being overwhelmed by it and use it to improve the odds of success
25:21: How can you both accommodate the likelihood of failure but not be overwhelmed by it, not ignore it, but manage through it and, more importantly, perhaps manage with it because failure is a little bit like the coal that holds the diamond; there's insight in every failure. There is something of value that is there to be mined if you have the humility to acknowledge it and the tenacity to go after it. And to that extent, I like this notion of thinking of initiative and action as chances to improve your odds that the experiments you're conducting are more likely than otherwise to prove successful.
What are the ways founders are using AI to experiment and optimize their start-ups faster than ever before? How does this shift affect the various makeups of different companies and industries, and who will be the winners and losers in the new age of AI?
Jeff Bussgang is the GP and Founder of Flybridge Capital, a senior lecturer at Harvard Business School, and also the author of the new book The Experimentation Machine: Finding Product-Market Fit in the Age of AI.
Greg and Jeff discuss timeless methods and timely tools for startups. Jeff elaborates on the scientific approach to entrepreneurship and the importance of combining timeless principles with modern AI tools. He shares insights on how generative AI can enhance every aspect of a startup, from ideation to customer engagement, and discusses the evolving roles of founders, venture capitalists, and even employees in this new landscape. Their conversation includes practical advice for founders on prioritizing experiments, scaling, building customer value propositions, and leveraging AI to become more efficient and effective.
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The startup path is unpredictable but patterns exist
03:08: Startups are highly nondeterministic, and so there's really no single playbook or single formula. And yet, there are timeless methods that you can apply to improve your odds of success. Now, you're never going to guarantee success. It's not an engineering formula where certain inputs result in certain outputs. There's just too much randomness. And as I said, nondeterminism is out there, and every age, era, context, startup, and individual are so radically different. So it's highly unpredictable. Yet, as I said, timeless methods. And then, as you noted—and I write in the book—timely tools. I mean, the tools, they're not just getting better every year, every month, every week, every day.
Strategy in startups is all about test selection
10:36: This question of test selection being strategy is the essence of what founders need to think through because, anytime you have an organization with limited bandwidth and a limited envelope of resources and capital, you need to make prioritization decisions. You need to focus, and so what I advise founders, both that I teach and also through my Flybridge investment activities, is that they should select the tests that are going to uncover the most controversial part of their business model and have the highest likelihood of leading to a valuation inflection point if the test is successful.
Why judgment, strategy, and creativity are timeless values for founders
51:26: The notion that founders need to leverage their strategic thinking, creativity, and human judgment—and apply that again and again to prioritize these scarce resources—even if the resources can be stretched more fully—is still a competitive market, and everybody is stretching the resources and being more productive. I still think that that judgment is going to be very valuable.
AI won't replace founders—but founders who don't use AI will be replaced
47:41: AI is not going to replace founders anytime soon; but founders who don't use AI are going to replace founders who don't. I also believe that joiners who use AI are going to replace joiners who don't, that our portfolio companies are looking for AI-native employees, and that we may see a world where employees and candidates come to companies instead of with a team of engineers, marketers, or salespeople, as we have seen in the past—as the HubSpot mafia travels from company to company. [48:32] So I think there's going to be just a really rich set of opportunities for native joiners, and there's going to be a high bar that will be tested by employers about whether their individuals are native and facile with the AI tools.
Given the advancements in technology and AI, how have humans learned to navigate the ever-shifting boundaries of morality in an increasingly complex world?
Webb Keane is a professor of anthropology at the University of Michigan. Through his books like, Ethical Life: Its Natural and Social Histories and most recently Animals, Robots, Gods: Adventures in the Moral Imagination, Webb offers insights into the nuances of moral life and human interaction.
Webb joins Greg to discuss how different cultures navigate ethical boundaries, the complexities of human-animal relationships, the growing phenomenon of anthropomorphizing AI, and the challenges of understanding what it means to be human.
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How anthropologists immerse themselves in other ways of life
53:09: Anthropologists just do what everyone does—they just do it more intensely and with more intentionality. As I said, our most valuable tool is just knowing how to be a person and how to get along with other people. And that, I mean, in principle, anyone can learn a new language. You're never going to learn it as well as you learn your first language, but it's something that's available to you. And so, in some sense, that goes for learning to eat differently, to walk differently, to wear different kinds of [clothes], to interact with people differently, even to imagine yourself into a different kind of metaphysical system. Like, hang out with shamans long enough, and you're going to start to think that, yes, they do turn into jaguars and roam the forest at night.
Key difference between anthropologists and other social scientists
05:52: One of the key differences between what we do and what other social scientists do is we actually live with them and take part in their lives. And so, that way, you catch not just what people say, but what they do—and not just what they put into words, but what they hint at and imply.
Moral propositions must be livable to matter
15:28: If you're looking for inhabitable, feasible, ethical worlds—moral ways of living—you can't just sit back and think, "Well, how should this be?"... Moral propositions are great, but to be livable, they have to exist in a world that makes them possible and sustains them.
The boundaries between human and non-human are not universal
32:26: In many situations that look like we have dramatically different moral or ethical intuitions, the difference is less in what our moral intuitions are, but rather where we draw the line between us and them—between something to which it applies and something to which it doesn't. We may, in fact, share moral intuitions with people who seem utterly strange to us, but we just don't think we agree on where they apply properly.