Ben Yeoh Chats

Benjamin Yeoh

Ben Yeoh chats to a variety of thinkers and doers about their curiosities, ideas and passions. If you are curious about the world this show is for you. I have extended conversations across humanities and science with artists, philosophers, writers, theatre makers, activists, economists and all walks of life.

  • 52 minutes 30 seconds
    Salima Saxton: Cancer, Estrangement, and “Bad Patient” Honesty

    Salima Saxton on cancer, honesty, estrangement, and creative work in real life. Salima is Ben’s longtime friend, and they talk about her cancer diagnosis and what she calls an unexpected new “year of undoing”, a return to herself rather than a neat reinvention story.

    “Be the sky, not the weather. The weather passes through.”

    They discuss why the language of “brave” can feel wrong, why “What can I do?” often misses the mark, and what Salima means by being a “bad patient”.

    The conversation turns to Salima’s Substack essay “Builder Dad” on estrangement and what outsiders routinely misunderstand.

    “‘Blood is thicker than water’ is not advice I believe in.”

    Salima also shares the hardest things to write in memoir: telling the whole truth, including the parts that do not flatter you.

    The chat then touches on anti-heroine storytelling, friendship breakups, social media’s double edge, and what creative work looks like without romantic routines: write where you can, start small, “plod”, find mentors, and build community.

    “There’s never a perfect moment. Start with something tiny and plod.”

    A lighter finish includes an overrated/underrated game (champagne, dressing up, height, hustle culture, social media, coconut oil), Salima’s plan to audition again, and why dark humour matters when things get rough.

    “A sense of humour is absolutely vital. You either laugh or you crack.”

    Transcript and video: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2026/2/24/salima-saxton-cancer-bad-patient-honesty-estrangement-and-writing-without-waiting


    Contents:

    00:00 30-year friendship,  Himalayas, coconut oil
    01:23 Cancer diagnosis and a new “year of undoing”
    03:41 Returning to the 18-year-old self
    05:07 Illness clarifies relationships, energy is finite
    07:29 Why “brave” and “What can I do?” can land badly
    09:02 “Bad patient”: performing “good” on an overstretched NHS ward
    13:05 Honest female voices, dissonance, anti-heroine truth
    15:28 “Builder Dad”, estrangement, and searching for father figures
    17:57 What people get wrong about estrangement and friendship breakups
    21:29 Hypervigilance and the hidden inner life
    23:31 The hardest memoir scene: dad’s death and anger at mum
    26:15 Writing about mum: respect, friction, truth
    29:44 Childhood contradictions: hippie roots, no heating, love of glamour
    30:37 No perfect routine: writing around kids, work, real life
    33:09 Ditch the artist romance: money, time, and the true cost
    35:00 Tiny wins: one sentence still counts
    36:49 Bed writing, socks, and self-trickery
    38:06 Overrated/underrated game
    41:31 Social media love/hate and quiet communities
    43:59 2026 as the “year of saying yes”, auditions, dark humour
    46:37 Advice to creatives: start small, “plod”, mentors, community
    50:15 Long friendships and gratitude

    26 February 2026, 11:15 am
  • 1 hour 10 minutes
    Simon Kane: Disneyland, Punchdrunk, Shunt; What “Immersive” Really Means

    Is walking around a fake bathroom really “immersive” theatre, or is a theme park the more honest art form?


    Ben sits down with Simon Kane, writer and performer whose work spans Shunt’s devised theatre, BBC radio comedy (John Finnemore’s Souvenir Programme), and a lockdown project performing Shakespeare chronologically on YouTube. Simon unpacks what “immersive” should actually mean, why a seated audience isn’t a passive audience, and why “fun” is a serious artistic standard.


    “If you’re making a space from scratch, why make a space that already exists?”


    We also riff on Richard II as a story of celebrity collapse, the strange distance of voice work compared to stage acting, and how to stay creatively intentional when algorithms would rather you just hit Next.


    Transcript: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2026/2/14/simon-kane-performing-shakespeare-on-youtube-immersive-theatre-and-why-fun-matters


    We cover:

    • Story-first acting: unlocking Richard II by changing the character

    • Devised vs scripted: how Shunt builds worlds, and what audio comedy demands instead

    • The “immersive” fallacy: when you’re just walking around a set

    • Clowning, refusal, and the myth you must always say yes

    • Escaping autoplay: consuming culture on purpose



    14 February 2026, 5:30 pm
  • 1 hour 31 seconds
    Deena Mousa: How Much Is A Life Worth? Effective Philanthropy, AI For Good & Global Health

    How do you put a price tag on a human life?

    It sounds like a cold question, but for grant makers, it is the necessary calculus of doing good. In this episode, Ben sits down with Deena Mousa (Open Philanthropy, Coefficient Giving) to discuss the difficult frameworks used to allocate finite resources.

    "Every time you choose whether to take a more dangerous job at a higher wage... you are implicitly putting a price on how much you value a year of your life."

    We dive into the "Coefficient Dollar," the complexities of measuring pain, and why government procurement might be the world's most underrated problem.


    WE COVER:

    • The Calculus of Altruism: Using "revealed preference" to value a year of life

    • The Pain Paradox: Why health models struggle to measure suffering

    • AI for Good: "AI washing" vs. actual capacity building

    • Systemic Bottlenecks: Why boring process fixes beat flashy policies

    • Life Advice: Why you should ignore advice that resonates too much

    "Often, the people listening to a piece of general advice are exactly the group of people that should be doing the opposite."


    Contents:

    • 00:00 Introduction
    • 01:17 Valuing Life and Health
    • 05:46 Challenges in Measuring Pain and Health Outcomes
    • 13:32 Creative Process and Research Methodology
    • 18:38 Journey and Early Experiences
    • 22:23 Debate on International Aid and USAID
    • 29:20 Impact of AI in Global Health and Development
    • 36:25 Overrated or Underrated
    • 44:59 Exciting Projects and AI for Good
    • 46:14 Balancing Cause Areas and Funding Decisions
    • 58:31 Advice for Aspiring Philanthropists and Innovators





    2 January 2026, 2:49 pm
  • 1 hour 15 minutes
    Hannah Ritchie On Climate Honesty, Hope, And The Future. Discussing her book Clearing The Air.

    Hannah Ritchie — one of the most lucid and data-driven voices in climate and sustainability — returns to talk about her new book Clearing the Air: 50 Questions and Answers about Climate.

    Ben and Hannah explore why honesty builds trust in climate science, why the 1.5 °C target is likely out of reach (and why that’s not the end of hope), and China’s paradoxical role as both the world’s largest emitter and clean-tech powerhouse.

    They dig into how abundance, not austerity, could define the next phase of climate progress; how to manage renewable energy variability and mineral demand; and why “net zero” may need a more realistic framing.

    Hannah also shares personal reflections — what she’d tell her 16-year-old self, how she balances optimism with realism, and the daily coastal runs that keep her creative and grounded. The conversation closes with a look at smart philanthropy, innovative climate projects, and the habits that sustain hope and curiosity.

    An hour of evidence, insight, and grounded optimism — a conversation about how to think clearly, act practically, and stay inspired in a warming world.


    Transcript and notes: www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/10/25/clearing-the-air-hannah-ritchie-on-climate-honesty-hope-and-the-future




    26 October 2025, 4:54 pm
  • 1 hour 5 minutes
    Robert Beckley: Lessons from 40 Years in Policing, Hillsborough & Civic Service

    Retired police officer Robert Beckley reflects on 40 years of service — from Brixton to Hillsborough and beyond. We discuss crisis response, institutional change, community policing, and why public service and volunteering still matter today.


    We explore:

    • The misunderstood role of policing“Policing is about being there in a crisis — when someone needs action, and needs it now.”

    • Rob’s early career in Brixton and how his experiences in Sudan shaped his views on culture and policing.

    • Honest reflections on institutional racism and sexism“Institutional racism isn’t about bad people — it’s about systems and processes that have disproportionate impacts.”

    • Hillsborough: what really went wrong, the persistence of false narratives, and why “we can never afford complacency in disaster preparedness.”

    • The evolution of crime, the importance of community policing“Community policing works because people trust officers who know their area and take ownership of local problems.”

    • Rob’s year as High Sheriff of Somerset, his advocacy for volunteering, and the civic glue that holds communities together.

    • Advice for aspiring public servants“In public service, you may never know the lives you’ve touched — but the impact is real.”

    This episode provides deep insights into policing, society, and civic responsibility — offering lessons not only for those in public service but for anyone interested in how communities can thrive.


    Find more episodes, transcripts, and writing at https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/9/14/rob-beckley-insights-from-a-policing-career-hillsborough-amp-civic-service-lessons-podcast


    Episode highlights:
    00:32 – Misunderstandings in Policing
    01:57 – Early Career in Brixton
    05:18 – Sudan and Cultural Insights
    08:51 – Institutional Racism and Sexism
    18:14 – Hillsborough Disaster
    33:30 – The Evolution of Crime
    37:20 – Community Policing
    51:05 – The Role of High Sheriff
    54:06 – Volunteering and Civic Society
    58:16 – Advice for Aspiring Public Servants

    14 September 2025, 3:54 pm
  • 1 hour 11 minutes
    Do We Still Build Beautiful? Samuel Hughes on Architecture & Cities

    Samuel Hughes, editor at Works in Progress, joins me to talk architecture, planning, and how we think about beauty in our cities.

    “Most buildings in Tokyo are ugly, but the streets are beautiful—urban form matters more than facades.”

    In this episode we explore:

    • Can we still mass-produce beautiful buildings?

    • Japanese urban design and zoning lessons

    • How long buildings should last: UK vs Japan

    • Rent control and housing history in Berlin

    • Rethinking the greenbelt in Britain

    • Dresden’s reconstruction and underrated cities

    • Future solutions for housing supply

    –––

    Full Contents
    01:02 Mass Producing Beautiful Buildings
    01:43 The Decline of Ornament in Architecture
    04:37 Tokyo’s Urban Design and Zoning
    10:05 How Long Should Buildings Last? UK vs Japan
    16:13 Philosophy, Beauty, and Emotions
    25:53 Public Policy Trade-offs in Practice
    31:41 Berlin: Rent Control and Urban Planning
    36:32 Housing in Europe: A Historical Context
    38:02 Modern Housing Markets and Trends
    41:50 Rethinking the Greenbelt
    44:40 Planning Authorities and Their Role
    50:40 Overrated and Underrated Urban Ideas
    1:02:03 Dresden: Lessons in Urban Reconstruction
    1:05:03 The Future of Britain’s Housing Supply
    1:08:40 Career Advice on Policy and Design


    Full transcript, video and links here: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/8/20/samuel-hughes-architecture-beauty-and-the-future-of-cities-podcast


    20 August 2025, 12:33 pm
  • 47 minutes 34 seconds
    Tim Mak: War Reporting in Ukraine

    Tim Mak moved to Ukraine in 2022, a day before war broke out. Tim, a former US investigative correspondent, decided to stay and start up his own reporting at Counter Offensive. He now reports from Kyiv. 

     

    On the podcast, Tim discusses the day-to-day life in war-torn Kyiv, focusing on the chronic stress rather than immediate physical danger residents face. He recounts his critical role in documenting human stories from the war front and shares his personal journey, having moved to Ukraine right as the war began. We  touch on the operational challenges and ethical considerations in war reporting, the importance of human interest stories, and how new technology like AI affects journalism. Tim talks about the broader geopolitical implications of the conflict and his hopes for the future of independent journalism.


    Transcript and link to site: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/7/31/tim-mak-war-reporting-journey-in-ukraine-podcast


    Contents

    • 00:25 Life in Kiev During Wartime
    • 03:10 Tim's Arrival and Early Experiences in Ukraine
    • 04:57 Launching The Counter Offensive
    • 05:24 Human Interest Stories and Subscriber Growth
    • 09:50 Challenges and Ethics in War Reporting
    • 14:14 The Power of Individual Narratives
    • 25:42 Independent Journalism and Future Prospects
    • 34:55 Geopolitical Reflections and Ukraine's Needs
    • 44:34 Final Thoughts and Advice


    31 July 2025, 11:06 am
  • 57 minutes 21 seconds
    Françoise Girard: Feminism, Activism, and the Power of Storytelling

    Françoise Girard is an activist and founder of Feminism Makes Us Smarter. We discuss Francois' journey from studying law in Montreal to becoming a feminist activist in New York. Francois shares experiences from her work with the Open Society Institute and the International Women's Health Coalition, elaborating on the critical role of grassroots feminist movements in effecting societal change. 

    “Taking a feminist, intersectional lens helps us understand the world better. You can see trends before the regular commentators do.”

    The conversation touches on misconceptions about feminism, the interconnected nature of various justice movements, and the importance of long-term, flexible support from philanthropists. 

    “If you want to track the health of a democracy, look at what’s happening to women’s rights. They’re the early warning system.”

    Francois also highlights the power of storytelling in activism and reveals her creative process behind her writing. 

    “When we walk out of a play, we’re more in touch with our feelings. That’s how movements grow — through stories and emotion, not just policy.”

    “Each of us won’t solve it all, but if we all do something — even something small — that’s how things move. That’s what gives me hope.”

    The discussion concludes with insights into successful campaigns, including the decriminalization of abortion in Ireland, and practical advice for individual contributions to social change.

    Links and


    • 00:18 Francois' Journey to Activism
    • 01:50 Working with International Organizations
    • 03:39 Founding Feminism Makes Us Smarter
    • 04:54 Understanding Modern Feminism
    • 05:41 Intersectionality and Feminism
    • 10:35 Theories of Change in Activism
    • 22:54 Challenges and Learnings in Feminist Movements
    • 31:45 The Role of Art and Opera in Life
    • 32:17 The Power of Storytelling
    • 36:14 Creative Processes and Writing
    • 41:51 Successful Movements and Campaigns
    • 49:41 Current Projects and Future Plans
    • 54:38 Final Thoughts and Advice


    13 July 2025, 12:50 pm
  • 49 minutes 26 seconds
    Sumit Paul-Choudhury: Optimism, Navigating Life's Challenges And Uncertainties

    Sumit discusses how his wife dying  reshaped his views on optimism, differentiating between pragmatic optimism and blind faith. He explores how having an optimistic outlook, although seemingly against his scientific training, aligns with good mental health. 

    "Believing in a better tomorrow is not the same as saying that today is great."

    We touch on the evolutionary logic behind optimism, the impact of agency on perception, and how alternate histories can inform future thinking. Sumit also reflects on the role of optimism during personal grief and provides insights into his writing process and the broader importance of the arts and humanities. The conversation closes with advice for optimism in younger generations and an emphasis on appreciating everyday human interactions.


    "Postcards from your future self can be more helpful than New Year’s resolutions."


    Transcript and links: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/5/30/sumit-paul-choudhury-optimism-navigating-lifes-challenges-and-uncertainties-podcast


    Contents:

    • 00:19 The Moment That Changed Everything

    • 01:08 Embracing Optimism

    • 02:58 The Psychology of Optimism

    • 04:42 Rational Optimism vs. Pessimism

    • 09:39 Alternate Histories and Humility

    • 13:20 Leadership and Optimism

    • 16:03 Techniques for Optimism

    • 20:45 Optimism in the Face of Grief

    • 23:40 Teaching Optimism to the Younger Generation

    • 26:03 Understanding the Climate Problem

    • 28:41 Victorian Sewer Systems: An Underrated Marvel

    • 29:41 Debating De-growth Ideas

    • 32:07 The Importance of Arts and Humanities

    • 34:36 Moonshot Ideas

    • 38:33 Existential Risks

    • 40:21 Personal Creativity and Writing Process

    • 45:58 Current Projects and Life Advice

    30 May 2025, 11:22 am
  • 1 hour 26 minutes
    Samir Varma: Free Will, Physics, Traffic, Bees, Emotions, Chaos Theory, Cricket, Finance

    Samir Varma is a physicist, investor, and author of the book: The Science of Free Will, How Determinism Affects Everything from the Future of AI to Traffic to God to Bees.' We discuss AI consciousness, the theoretical versus practical aspects of free will, and how determinism informs our understanding of human behaviour, moral philosophy, and even financial markets. 

    “Even though there is no free will in theory, because the laws of physics are deterministic… we don’t know what we’re going to do until we’ve done it.” 

    “The only way to find out how your life will end is to live it.”

    Varma delves into the physics of free will, his insights on the applicability of chaos theory, and why certain financial and societal structures might need reevaluation. 

    The conversation touches on the evolution and mechanics of intellectual property, the intricacies of cricket, and the profound layers that make Pink Floyd's music a unique listening experience. Varma also shares his varied projects, including innovations in solar energy and traffic management. 


    The discussion culminates with practical life advice focused on pursuing meaningful and passionate work.


    Transcript: https://www.thendobetter.com/investing/2025/4/11/samir-varma-free-will-physics-traffic-bees-emotions-chaos-theory-cricket-finance-podcast


    Contents

    • 00:23 Will AI Gain Consciousness?

    • 02:11 The Concept of Free Will in Theory and Practice

    • 04:19 Quantum Theory and Determinism

    • 18:58 Chaos Theory and Free Will

    • 23:20 Death and the Reorganization of Atoms

    • 25:37 Animal Consciousness and Communication

    • 30:23 Implications for Society and Justice

    • 37:48 Emotions and Rationality

    • 41:08 Misunderstandings in Finance

    • 44:39 Debunking Market Value Myths

    • 47:43 The Momentum Factor Explained

    • 57:14 The Unique Appeal of Pink Floyd

    • 01:02:40 Understanding Cricket's Complexity

    • 01:09:58 Overrated or Underrated?

    • 01:19:28 Insights on Writing and Creativity

    • 01:23:11 Final Thoughts and Life Advice

    11 April 2025, 11:54 am
  • 1 hour 15 minutes
    Mary-Ann Ochota: Adventure, Resilience, Unveiling Hidden Histories, Archeology And The Ancient World

    Mary-Ann Ochota is a broadcaster, anthropologist, and writer known for her work on Time Team and books on archaeology and the British landscape. 

    Archaeology is ultimately about people – the stories of people in the past and how they lived their lives.

    Mary-Ann discusses her visits to Chernobyl, British henges and the Australian Simpson Desert; exploring themes of resilience and environmental recovery. 

    One of the big misconceptions is that archaeology is just about digging things up.

    She shares insights on ancient British sites and the broader implications of sustainable development and access to nature. We discuss her role as president of the Countryside Charity and her thoughts on the future of rural development are highlighted, along with her creative writing process and advice for connecting with nature.

    “We’re all living on top of layers of history, whether we realise it or not.”


    Transcript and links: https://www.thendobetter.com/arts/2025/4/4/mary-ann-ochota-adventure-resilience-unveiling-hidden-histories-archeology-and-the-ancient-world-podcast


    Summary Contents:


    • 00:31 Exploring Chernobyl's Impact

    • 04:59 The Resilience of Nature

    • 05:55 Adventures in the Simpson Desert

    • 13:56 Ancient Sites in the UK

    • 17:10 Access to Nature and Social Barriers

    • 31:56 The Ridgeway National Trail

    • 38:33 Exploring the Purpose of Henges

    • 39:29 Ancient Feasts and Food Waste

    • 40:15 Reevaluating Ancient Civilizations

    • 44:32 Imagination and Environmental Crisis

    • 47:53 Balancing Hope and Realism

    • 50:06 Writing Process and Creative Challenges

    • 01:04:24 Sustainable Development and Land Use

    • 01:11:32  Life Advice 

    4 April 2025, 12:55 pm
  • More Episodes? Get the App