- 47 minutes 31 secondsThe Subtext: Aslan is a Woman…Should You Care?
Meryl Streep is the voice of Aslan in Greta Gerwig's Narnia adaptation. Is this a threat to Christian orthodoxy or another culture-war distraction?
This week on The Subtext, Savannah and Lee discuss the casting controversy and dive into bigger questions about gender and how we imagine God. From C.S. Lewis' POV to feminine depictions of God in Scripture and church history, they explore what Christian humility, artistic freedom, and a more faithful public witness might look like.
Things we mentioned in this episode:
NARNIA: THE MAGICIAN’S NEPHEW | Official Trailer
Hillbilly Thomists on No Small Endeavor
“Why You Should Care That Aslan is a Woman” by Liel Leibovitz
Priestesses in the Church? by C.S. Lewis
The Incomprehensibility of God and the Image of God Male and Female by Elizabeth A. Johnson
William Paul Young on No Small Endeavor
The Shack by William Paul Young
Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth R. Miller
The Crucifixion of the Warrior God by Gregory A. Boyd
Cross Vision: How the Crucifixion of Jesus Makes Sense of Old Testament Violence by Gregory A. Boyd
Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter
Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack
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21 October 2026, 9:00 am - 50 minutes 35 seconds284: Alister McGrath: Science and Faith Were Never at War (The Ache, Pt. 2)
Science can explain the world in an incredibly helpful way, but scientific facts alone can't tell us what our lives are for. In a world shaped by modernity, it can be wildly tempting to chuck religion altogether. But with science alone, we end up in what Max Weber called the iron cage: a world fully explained, but emptied of meaning.
Dr. Alister McGrath grew up in Belfast during the Troubles, amidst conflict across political and religious lines. He became an aggressive Marxist atheist, convinced that religion caused violence and science had made it obsolete. Then, as a chemistry student at Oxford, he met brilliant scientists who believed in God. He then wrestled with the fact that he couldn't prove there wasn't a God. He now holds three Oxford doctorates, in molecular biophysics, theology, and intellectual history, and is Emeritus Professor of Science and Religion at Oxford.
For McGrath, faith became a reason to value science even more. This is part two of The Ache: The Longing Modernity Couldn't Cure, a three-part No Small Endeavor series.
This project was made possible through the support of a grant from Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc funder DOI 501100011730) through grant https://doi.org/10.54224/35684. The opinions expressed in this publication are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Alister McGrath
Join No Small Endeavor on Patreon and get:
Ad-free listening for both No Small Endeavor and The Subtext
Monthly bonus content including our ongoing Cardinal Virtue Series and more
Weekly reflections on a good life
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Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable
Thank you to our sponsors:The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
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19 October 2026, 10:00 am - 1 hour 22 minutes283: Unabridged Interview: Belle Tindall-Riley
This is our unabridged interview with Belle Tindall-Riley.
Institutional religion is off the menu for many these days. But walk to the edge of the Glastonbury music festival, and you'll find a packed field people waiting an hour in line to buy crystals, get tarot readings, and have a sound bath from a healer with singing bowls. Our religious impulses didn’t go away. They just got transferred.
It seems, consumerism and individualism are so deeply ingrained that we now pay for membership in whatever community we subscribe to. We buy their trinkets, their supplements, and their merch as symbols of our belonging.
Dr. Belle Tindall-Riley takes the ache underneath all of that seriously. A biblical scholar who spent four years of her doctorate on a single passage, and who grew up in rural Wales lying to her classmates about going to church, she reads each practice like manifesting, tarot, crystals, WitchTok for the true longing beneath it. She examines the limits of a spirituality that always tells you you're doing just fine. You'll come away asking questions of your own spirituality: does it ever tell me no?
This is part one of The Ache: The Longing Modernity Couldn't Cure, a three-part No Small Endeavor series, recorded around the world from Oxford to the Isle of Skye, about the human ache that secularism can't explain and the new spiritualities that may not be able to fill it.
Join No Small Endeavor on Patreon and get:
Ad-free listening for both No Small Endeavor and The Subtext
Monthly bonus content including our ongoing Cardinal Virtue Series and more
Weekly reflections on a good life
Access to live show videos
Early access to live show tickets.
Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable
This project was made possible through the support of a grant from Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc funder DOI 501100011730) through grant https://doi.org/10.54224/35684. The opinions expressed in this publication are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Belle Tindall-Riley
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
16 October 2026, 10:00 am - 35 minutes 49 secondsThe Subtext: The Separation of Church & Business
Is a $4,500 networking trip to Mar-a-Lago okay if it's for the kingdom? This week on The Subtext, Lee and Savannah unpack problematic Christian wealth seminars promising financial success for “kingdom impact." They explore the power of proximity, the dangers of “kingdom washing,” and what the early church might have to say about business, debt, and the pursuit of influence. Is Christian language transforming business, or simply baptizing capitalism?
Things we mentioned in this episode:
Come see Ira Glass on No Small Endeavor Live at the Symphony!
Jesus and the Disinherited by Howard Thurman
The Cross and the Lynching Tree by James H. Cone
The Gospel of High Yields: Inside Tim Tebow’s Favorite Wealth Seminar
Poverty by America by Matthew Desmond
Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter
Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
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14 October 2026, 9:00 am - 51 minutes 6 seconds283: Belle Tindall-Riley: Spiritual but Not Religious (The Ache, Pt. 1)
Institutional religion is off the menu for many these days. But walk to the edge of the Glastonbury music festival, and you'll find a packed field people waiting an hour in line to buy crystals, get tarot readings, and have a sound bath from a healer with singing bowls. Our religious impulses didn’t go away. They just got transferred.
It seems, consumerism and individualism are so deeply ingrained that we now pay for membership in whatever community we subscribe to. We buy their trinkets, their supplements, and their merch as symbols of our belonging.
Dr. Belle Tindall-Riley takes the ache underneath all of that seriously. A biblical scholar who spent four years of her doctorate on a single passage, and who grew up in rural Wales lying to her classmates about going to church, she reads each practice like manifesting, tarot, crystals, WitchTok for the true longing beneath it. She examines the limits of a spirituality that always tells you you're doing just fine. You'll come away asking questions of your own spirituality: does it ever tell me no?
This is part one of The Ache: The Longing Modernity Couldn't Cure, a three-part No Small Endeavor series, recorded around the world from Oxford to the Isle of Skye, about the human ache that secularism can't explain and the new spiritualities that may not be able to fill it.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Belle Tindall-Riley
Join No Small Endeavor on Patreon and get:
Ad-free listening for both No Small Endeavor and The Subtext
Monthly bonus content including our ongoing Cardinal Virtue Series and more
Weekly reflections on a good life
Access to live show videos
Early access to live show tickets.
Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.
This project was made possible through the support of a grant from Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc funder DOI 501100011730) through grant https://doi.org/10.54224/35684. The opinions expressed in this publication are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of Templeton World Charity Foundation, Inc.
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
12 October 2026, 10:00 am - 1 hour 20 minutes282: Unabridged Interview: Kristin Kobes Du Mez
This is our unabridged interview with Kristin Kobes Du Mez.
That "Live, Laugh, Love" sign at Target isn't just decor. It's a theological statement, and it has a 150-year history most of us have never heard.
Historian Kristin Kobes Du Mez, author of the New York Times bestseller Jesus and John Wayne, argues that American Christian women have been formed more by the gift aisle than by the seminary. In her new book, Live, Laugh, Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made, she traces a 19th-century promise, that submission and a positive attitude will be rewarded with blessing, as it merges with the secular philosophy of positive thinking and spreads through Christian romance novels, radio, home decor, and multi-level marketing. Lee and Kristin explore why doubt came to be treated as sin, and how a theology championed by a suffragist ended up demanding women's submission to men.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Kristin Kobes Du Mez
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
Join No Small Endeavor on Patreon and get:
Ad-free listening for both No Small Endeavor and The Subtext
Monthly bonus content including our ongoing Cardinal Virtue Series and more
Weekly reflections on a good life
Access to live show videos
Early access to live show tickets.
Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
9 October 2026, 10:00 am - 55 minutes 56 secondsThe Subtext: Macklemore, Ed Sheeran, and Vanity Politics
This week on The Subtext: Macklemore, Ed Sheeran, free speech, and the billionaire power behind the music business. Lee and Savannah unpack the controversy, looking to Dolly Parton as a guide.
What happens when public outrage becomes a purity test? Is it all just “vanity politics,” or what are we actually doing about the things we say we care about?
Things we mentioned in this episode:
Olivia Fox Cabane (on the science of charisma) on Armchair Expert
The Charisma Myth by Olivia Fox Cabane
Christ in the Rubble by Munther Isaac
Munther Isaac on No Small Endeavor
Dr. Queenie Johnson’s Analysis on what she calls “Vanity Politics”
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
7 October 2026, 9:00 am - 50 minutes 28 seconds282: Kristin Kobes Du Mez: The Secret History of White Christian Women
That "Live, Laugh, Love" sign at Target isn't just decor. It's a theological statement, and it has a 150-year history most of us have never heard.
Historian Kristin Kobes Du Mez, author of the New York Times bestseller Jesus and John Wayne, argues that American Christian women have been formed more by the gift aisle than by the seminary. In her new book, Live, Laugh, Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made, she traces a 19th-century promise, that submission and a positive attitude will be rewarded with blessing, as it merges with the secular philosophy of positive thinking and spreads through Christian romance novels, radio, home decor, and multi-level marketing. Lee and Kristin explore why doubt came to be treated as sin, and how a theology championed by a suffragist ended up demanding women's submission to men.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Kristin Kobes Du Mez
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
5 October 2026, 10:00 am - 1 hour 6 minutes281: Unabridged Interview: Annie F. Downs
This is our unabridged interview with Annie F. Downs.
What's holding you back from your dreams? Annie F. Downs wants to help you diagnose and respond to that question. She says often what’s holding you back is rooted in something that was either stolen, killed, or destroyed.
In this conversation, the New York Times bestselling author and Lee talk about her new book, Don't Let That Hold You Back.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Annie F. Downs
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
2 October 2026, 10:00 am - 45 minutes 14 secondsThe Subtext: How to Leave Your Church - Ask Us Anything 2
It’s the first birthday of The Subtext! Savannah and Lee celebrate with an “Ask Us Everything” episode, answering listener questions about Bible translations, music, patriotism, how to leave your church community, and more.
Thank you to everyone who made year one of The Subtext special. We love you! Send your AMA questions anytime to us @thesubtextshow on Instagram or to [email protected]
Things we mentioned in this episode:
Join us for No Small Endeavor Live November 22 - The Schermerhorn Symphony Center
Méditation from the opera Thaïs by Jules Massenet
Adagio for Strings by Samuel Barber
Down There by the Train by Tom Waits
A Change is Going to Come by Sam Cooke
Little Girl Blue by Nina Simone
Kim Stanley Robinson on No Small Endeavor
Consumerist corner: Stanley cup, Apple AirTag, Exfoliating Lip Balm
Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok
Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter
Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack
Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
30 September 2026, 9:00 am - 51 minutes 16 seconds281: Annie F. Downs: What’s Holding You Back?
What's holding you back from your dreams? Annie F. Downs wants to help you diagnose and respond to that question. She says often what’s holding you back is rooted in something that was either stolen, killed, or destroyed.
In this conversation, the New York Times bestselling author and Lee talk about her new book, Don't Let That Hold You Back.
Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Annie F. Downs
Thank you to our sponsors:
The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more!
SEEDS: Download the free SEEDS app and take one small step today: plant your first seed and see what God can grow.
Tickets to Nov 22nd NSE Live in Nashville:https://www.nashvillesymphony.org/nosmallendeavor
Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.
No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor
Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
28 September 2026, 10:00 am - More Episodes? Get the App