B2B Revenue Vitals

B2B Refine Labs

Welcome to the new B2B Revenue Vitals podcast, formerly State of Demand Gen. On this podcast, you’ll learn how to build a high-growth company from Refine Labs' CEO, Chris Walker. From proving new revenue programs to identifying and scaling programs that work, to training your team to operate at scale, you will understand what it takes to create a predictable pipeline of revenue innovation that drives compounding gains. Through interviews, AMAs, and invite-only events, we give you a sneak peek into the data-backed insights we are executing for the fastest-growing SaaS companies in the world.

  • 8 minutes 25 seconds
    RV239 - The Bootstrap Advantage (My CEO Consulting Call)

    In this unique episode, Chris shares the unfiltered audio from a consulting call with an entrepreneur. Chris offers advice from his personal experience building multiple businesses to 7 and 8 figures in revenue.

    Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode:

    • Why raising VC money might be a sign that your business model needs rethinking

    • The advantages of bootstrapping a SaaS company to $5-10M ARR

    • How a SaaS + services model creates better financial outcomes and product development

    • Why "slow is fast" in building sustainable businesses

    • The dangers of rapid scaling and how it often leads to revenue regression

    • How to structure equity and compensation in early-stage companies

    • The math behind exit outcomes and why 100% ownership of a smaller company often beats partial ownership of a larger one

    • Building customer success into your model rather than outsourcing it

    • Why the feedback loop from direct customer service dramatically improves product development

    • Real numbers from Chris's journey growing his agency from $11M to $22M and back to $12M

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    4 March 2025, 3:54 pm
  • 52 minutes 24 seconds
    RV238 - How To Outcompete $100M Giants (Live Fireside Chat)

    Today’s episode is a live fireside chat recorded at Warmly’s office, where Chris covers why smaller software companies can move faster than larger ones, what customers actually want versus what they say they need, and practical ways to measure what matters in marketing. 

    Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode:

    • Why smaller companies have distinct advantages over $100M+ companies today 

    • The critical importance of making customers successful with your product (not just selling it) 

    • How AI is accelerating product development and changing business operations 

    • Why competitive differentiation now requires more than just features and messaging 

    • The shift from "giving away customer success" to charging for services that drive results

    • Rethinking traditional department structures like marketing, sales, and RevOps 

    • Why attribution models are fundamentally flawed and how to approach measurement differently

    • The problem with sales compensation models that don't align with today's buying journey

    • Creating defensibility through customer proximity, delivering results, and leveraging proprietary data 

    • How to consider pricing models based on deliverables instead of traditional subscriptions

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visitwww.hatch.fm to learn more.

    25 February 2025, 10:00 am
  • 51 minutes 37 seconds
    RV237 - Stop Overcomplicating Marketing Measurement | Go To Market Live Episode 44

    When Chris Walker looked at his bank account in 2019, he had $3,000 and student loan debt. In this week’s GTM Live episode, he shares an overview of the choices that led to building successful multi-million dollar companies over the next 6 years, and the personal cost of those decisions. 

    He then spends the majority of the episode examining why B2B companies struggle to measure marketing results effectively, and details the surprising pattern he has seen while helping over 50 companies solve this exact problem.

    Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode:

    • Some uncomfortable truths about building a business

    • The real reason most CMOs can't fix marketing measurement, even when they want to (hint: it's not about their skills or dedication)

    • How marketing leaders can be empowered to focus on their core strengths rather than ROI spreadsheets

    • Finding the right balance between over-complicating and over-simplifying marketing measurement approaches (and what to actually track)

    • How companies waste millions on marketing programs while scrutinizing much smaller expenses

    • Why most RevOps teams end up grading performance instead of guiding strategy (and how to fix this)

    • A straightforward way to look at marketing data that everyone in the company can understand and trust

    • How companies can avoid spending 18 months building the wrong solution to their marketing measurement problems

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    18 February 2025, 10:00 am
  • 1 hour 4 minutes
    RV236 - The Role of Finance Leaders in GTM Success

    In this episode, Chris joinsFP&A Tomorrow host Paul Barnhurst (a.k.a.The FP&A Guy) to talk about the intersection of finance and GTM. 

    Chris shares his perspective on why most B2B companies get GTM investments wrong, the inefficiencies in traditional marketing measurement, and how CFO's and finance teams can play an incredibly strategic role in driving revenue efficiency.

    Key topics from this episode:

    • The disconnect between finance and GTM teams—and how to fix it

    • Why most companies mis-allocate GTM investments

    • The problem with measuring marketing ROI through attribution models

    • How finance can take ownership of GTM efficiency

    • The four key stages of a revenue factory and why companies need to rethink pipeline creation

    • The impact of content strategy on brand awareness, demand generation, and revenue growth

    • Why finance leaders should actively participate in GTM strategy rather than just measuring its outcomes

    • How Chris is building Passetto and Refine Labs to solve the GTM efficiency problem

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producingRevenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    11 February 2025, 10:00 am
  • 1 hour 2 minutes
    RV235 - Create A High Performing GTM Engine | with Sangram Vajre

    How can CEOs, CMOs, and revenue leaders truly create a high-performance GTM engine? 

    This episode is a live event that Chris Walker did with Sangram Vajre (co-founder & CEO at GTM Partners) where they answer exactly that.

    Key topics from this episode:

    • Who should really own GTM?

    • Moving beyond “marketing vs. sales”

    • The 4 pillars of pipeline creation

    • Why marketing needs more of a business mindset

    • The importance of retention vs. acquisition

    • How to fix broken revenue metrics

    • Why “slow is fast” in GTM

    • How to build an agile GTM team

    • What the future of marketing leadership looks like

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    7 February 2025, 10:00 am
  • 45 minutes 32 seconds
    RV234 - The Pipeline Creation Framework | Go To Market Live Episode 43

    Why do so many companies struggle to generate pipeline efficiently? In this episode, Chris shares exactly why (and new and more effective GTM strategies). 

    Whether you're a CMO, CRO, CEO, or CFO, this episode will challenge your thinking and help you build a smarter GTM strategy with marketing investments that are actually delivering returns.

    Key topics from this episode:

    • The Fundamental Flaws in Pipeline Creation 

    • The 3 Phases of Pipeline Creation

    • Why "Marketing vs. SDRs" is a Broken Debate

    • How to Fix Attribution & Measurement 

    • Rethinking RevOps & Sales Productivity 

    • The Hidden Costs of Inefficiency 

    • How CMOs, CROs, and CFOs Can Align on GTM Efficiency 

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    4 February 2025, 10:00 am
  • 48 minutes 41 seconds
    RV233 - My Lessons From Scaling to $22 Million

    Chris joined Brad Zomick’s show (LinkedIn Famous), where he shared insights on personal growth as a founder, his learnings from executing on LinkedIn for 5 years, and the new playbook founders can use to build and grow their companies. 

    Key topics from this episode:

    The right way to approach LinkedIn (hint: vanity metrics don’t matter)

    Personal growth and intuition as a founder

    Learnings and mistakes from scaling Refine Labs & Passetto

    Live events as a compounding asset

    Why founders should re-think the VC-funded model

    The future of social media in B2B

    Why the most important thing as a founder is to take action

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    28 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 50 minutes 52 seconds
    RV232 - The 3 Pillars of GTM Success | Go To Market Live Episode 42

    This is the first GTM Live episode of 2025, and Chris shares his most recent GTM strategies to help you win. These lessons are especially crucial for companies who want to scale past $10 million ARR.

    Key topics from this episode:

    • The 3 Pillars of GTM Success: GTM Strategy, GTM Optimization, and GTM Operations.

    • Cost of Growth: Reframing GTM efficiency as "cost of growth" to measure true ROI and organizational health.

    • AI and Copycat Products: How AI is accelerating product cloning and forcing companies to change how they differentiate.

    • Challenges of PLG Integration: The pitfalls of mixing product-led and sales-led growth motions together in established companies.

    • Smaller, Agile Teams: The shift towards AI-enabled, lean marketing and sales teams for efficiency and flexibility.

    • Flawed Metrics: Why reliance on outdated KPIs like MQLs and traditional attribution models is a mistake.

    • Siloed Departments: The need to remove organizational silos to create a Unified Revenue Factory.

    • Future-Proofing Sales and Marketing: Strategies to align compensation, integrate data, and streamline processes for sustainable pipeline creation.

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    21 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 48 minutes 28 seconds
    RV231 - Chris Walker & Dave Gerhardt Talk B2B Marketing

    This is a must-listen episode where Chris Walker joined Dave Gerhardt (Founder & CEO of Exit Five) on the B2B Marketing with Dave Gerhardt podcast. 

    Key topics from this episode:

    • Why being “early” in seeing how marketing is changing is often misunderstood as being wrong

    • How to manage negativity on social media while staying focused on your goals

    • Using podcasts, live events, and social media to gather actionable customer insights in real time

    • Breaking down marketing into Strategy vs. Pipeline Creation for clarity and efficiency

    • Why AI is an accelerant for creativity and execution, not a replacement for strategic thinking

    • How smaller and more agile marketing teams are outperforming larger ones

    • Calculating true marketing ROI by accounting for headcount, tools, and overall efficiency

    • How senior marketing leaders can improve outcomes by staying hands-on and closer to the execution process

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    14 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 41 minutes 16 seconds
    RV230 - MUST LISTEN: 2025 GTM Predictions (and Beyond)

    In this episode, Chris Walker talks with hosts Mikkel Kiærulf Plæhn and Toni Hohlbein about the GTM challenges B2B companies face. He shares common mistakes companies are making, how to better use data for decision-making, and predictions for what the future of GTM looks like.

    Key topics from this episode:

    • Why unit economics at the top of the funnel are the root of most GTM inefficiencies

    • The CEO’s pivotal role in aligning the entire GTM function

    • Why current data structures fail executives and how to fix them

    • Predictions for 2025: Centralized decision-making, smaller teams, and AI-native organizations

    • The pitfalls of relying on outdated KPIs like MQLs and demo requests

    • Why traditional attribution models hinder strategic decision-making

    • How AI will reshape GTM strategies and why data architecture is critical

    • The shift from RevOps to a more streamlined approach to operations

    • Chris’s vision for post-sale functions: Aligning customer success with measurable outcomes

    • Strategies for improving per-rep productivity and scaling efficiently

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    7 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 52 minutes 46 seconds
    RV229 - The 2025 B2B Content Playbook

    In this episode, Chris Walker joins a live event by Finn Thormeier to share his current approach to content, and what it takes to create a B2B content strategy in 2025 that actually works. 

    Topics covered in this episode:

    • Chris’s current content approach and strategy while building Passetto

    • The problem with sharing your IP too freely in your content

    • Lead gen vs. audience building

    • Invite-only events as a secret weapon

    • When to focus on niche vs. broad content

    • How to develop your content POV’s

    • The most effective way to source weekly content topics

    • Who should be the face of your content brand

    • Why distribution won’t save bad strategy

    • How to measure results from content

    • The future of content creation roles

    Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris’s short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

    31 December 2024, 4:34 pm
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