[Liz Miller-Gershfeld](https://www.gershmiller.com/) is an Executive Art Producer in Chicago, IL. After two decades at advertising juggernaut Energy BBDO, she has branched out on her own — working freelance for agencies AND photographers. A few photographers she's worked with: David LaChapelle, Nadav Kander, Laurie Frankel, Robert Whitman, and many others. Past campaigns she's worked on: Jack Daniels, Wrigley gum, Ocean Spray, Pearle Vision, plus plenty of others. Listen as we discuss: Should Photographers Get Into AI Right Now, How She Finds Photographers to Hire, Dangers of Not Understanding Usage & Licensing, and lots more. This is Part 2 of our interview.

Check out [Liz’s tear sheets by iconic photographers on her portfolio site](https://www.gershmiller.com/). It’s a great blend of clients and approaches.

I’m your host, Neil Binkley, Photo Consultant and Graphic Designer. [Check out my website](https://www.neilbinkley.com) to see the design, photo editing, and consulting work that I do.

A sampling of the brands she’s worked on:

* Canadian Club

* SC Johnson

* Wrigley/Orbit gum

* Art Institute of Chicago

* Ocean Spray

* Pearle Vision

We discuss a bunch of artists, incl. Personal Projects and AI (click links to see their work — plus she's worked with more great photographers: [poke around her site!](https://www.gershmiller.com/)):

* [Simone Lueck](https://sl.xhbtr.com/glamper)

* [Danielle Gasparini's Neon Alleys](https://www.instagram.com/p/CXGf7G8IxSh/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)

* [Sue Barr](https://www.suebarr.com/PHOTO-JOURNAL/thumbs)

* [Stefan Falke](https://www.stefanfalke.com/Personal/LA-FRONTERA:-Artists-along-the-US-Mexican-Border/thumbs)

* [Eric Hameister](https://www.hameisterphoto.com/) (look under Exhibit / Sh#t)

Liz’s inspired [AI explorations on Instagram](https://www.instagram.com/gershmiller/).

Or connect with her [on LinkedIn](https://www.linkedin.com/in/liz-miller-gershfeld-7542562/).

FYI: some podcast apps — I'm looking at you, Apple — cut off these show notes before the end. You can see all of the show notes on apps like Spotify or Overcast. OR, [on our website](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

In our discussion today, Liz and I talk about many things. If your podcast app shows chapters — well check ‘em out, because I added them! Otherwise, here’s a list of topics discussed, plus you can click on the timestamp to jump to that part of the interview (but OF COURSE, you’re listening all the way through the episode…):

\[00:00:00\] About Our Guest: Liz Miller-Gershfeld

\[00:05:36\] Should Photographers Get Into AI Right Now?

\[00:12:27\] Can/Should AI Be Used Commercially?

\[00:15:25\] Companies Using AI, Visually

\[00:17:54\] Copyright Considerations for Using AI

\[00:21:11\] Adobe Firefly

\[00:27:46\] Her Own AI Work

\[00:34:39\] Not All AI Is Well Made

\[00:38:29\] How She Finds Photographers to Hire

\[00:45:00\] Why Photographers Should Approach Production Companies

\[00:46:51\] Integrated Producers vs. Producers Vs...?

\[00:49:20\] Should Photographers Approach Creative Directors and Art Directors?

\[00:54:39\] Motion, Plus Other Things Photographers Need to Stay On Top Of

\[00:58:18\] Dangers of Not Understanding Usage & Licensing

\[01:00:41\] Personal Photo Projects That Caught Her Eye

\[01:02:45\] Advice for Art Producers

\[01:04:12\] Advice for Photographers

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or [on our website](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

Also feel free to [drop me a line](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod) with questions and ideas for future interviews!

Are you a photographer and need help editing your work, getting perspective on your marketing, designing photo books, etc.? [Drop me a line!](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod)

Are you an art producer / photo editor who needs help finding the right photographer for your next shoot, or licensing difficult-to-find, one-of-a-kind images? [Drop me a line!](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod)

[Liz Miller-Gershfeld](https://www.gershmiller.com/) is an Executive Art Producer in Chicago, IL. After two decades at advertising juggernaut Energy BBDO, she has branched out on her own — working freelance for agencies AND photographers. A few photographers she's worked with: David LaChapelle, Nadav Kander, Laurie Frankel, Robert Whitman, and many others. Past campaigns she's worked on: Jack Daniels, Wrigley gum, Ocean Spray, Pearle Vision, plus plenty of others. Listen as we discuss: how she finds photographers to hire, treatments (their importance, plus who actually reads them!), advice to fellow art producers, who photographers should approach at ad agencies, the dangers of not understanding licensing, AI, and lots more. This is Part 1 of our interview.

Check out [Liz’s tear sheets by iconic photographers on her portfolio site](https://www.gershmiller.com/). It’s a great blend of clients and approaches.

I’m your host, [Neil Binkley, Photographer's Consultant and Graphic Designer](https://www.neilbinkley.com).

A sampling of the brands she’s worked on:

* Canadian Club

* SC Johnson

* Wrigley/Orbit gum

* Art Institute of Chicago

* Ocean Spray

* Pearle Vision

We discuss a bunch of talented photographers (click links to see their work — and she's worked with more great photographers: poke around her site!):

* [David LaChapelle](https://www.gershmiller.com/work-examples/project-one-f5w4d-99axc-h4d33)

* [Nadav Kander](https://www.gershmiller.com/work-examples/project-one-f5w4d-99axc-ypamt)

* [Laurie Frankel](https://www.gershmiller.com/work-examples/project-one-f5w4d-99axc-r6e7y)

* [Robert Whitman](https://www.gershmiller.com/work-examples/project-one-f5w4d-99axc-f5bet)

* [Robert Atkinson (birds and AI generative art)](https://robertdavidatkinson.com/)

Liz’s inspired [AI explorations on Instagram](https://www.instagram.com/gershmiller/).

Or connect with her [on LinkedIn](https://www.linkedin.com/in/liz-miller-gershfeld-7542562/).

[Heather Elder, photo agent](https://heatherelder.com/post/a-photo-editor-personal-projects) and host of the great photo biz podcast, [Dear Art Producer](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dear-art-producer/id1455527504). FYI: she also posts [an excellent discussion on AI](https://heatherelder.com/post/are-we-going-out-of-business-a-photography-reps-point-of-view-on-ai).

FYI: some podcast apps — I'm looking at you, Apple — cut off these show notes  before the end. You can see all of the shownotes on apps like Spotify or Overcast. OR, on our website:\_ [_**www.neilbinkley.com/photopod**_](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod)

In our discussion today, Liz and I talk about many things. If your podcast app shows chapters — well check ‘em out, because I added them! Otherwise, here’s a list of topics discussed, plus you can click on the timestamp to jump to that part of the interview (but OF COURSE, you’re listening all the way through the episode…):

\[00:00:00\] About Our Guest: Liz Miller-Gershfeld

\[00:03:43\] Audio Discussions vs. Video Burnout

\[00:05:46\] Welcoming Liz to the Podcast

\[00:06:28\] Executive Art Producer for Agencies, Plus Photographers

\[00:08:36\] She's Teaching a Class for Photographers

\[00:13:53\] She Consults Photographers

\[00:14:38\] Treatments for Ad Jobs

\[00:15:53\] Don't Miss the Show Notes!

\[00:16:30\] Which Treatments Win the Assignments?

\[00:22:50\] Does Everyone Read the Treatments?

\[00:25:22\] How She Became an Art Buyer for Energy BBDO

\[00:28:31\] What's the "Energy" in Energy BBDO?

\[00:30:57\] Difference Between BBDO Branches

\[00:32:42\] The Big Name Photographers She's Hired!

\[00:34:38\] Canadian Club Campaign: Recreating Vintage

\[00:40:04\] Working with Nadav Kander was an Absolute Joy

\[00:41:02\] Using AI in the Comp and Moodboard Phases

\[00:45:47\] Should Photographers Get Into AI Right Now?

\[00:46:13\] Outro To Part 1 of The Interview

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or at [www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

Also feel free to [drop me a line](mailto:[email protected]) with questions and ideas for future interviews!

[**Adam Long**](https://adamlong.xyz/), Creative Director at [_Industry_](https://www.industry.global/)_,_ (worked on Nike, Jordan, Facebook/Meta, Sony PlayStation, Yeti, The World Cup...).

Check out [Adam’s sweet creative direction and filmmaking work on his portfolio site](https://adamlong.xyz/). It’s a great blend of clients and approaches.

I’m your host, [Neil Binkley, Photographer's Consultant and Graphic Designer](https://www.neilbinkley.com).

A sampling of the different brands that he’s done work for, which can be seen on [Adam’s portfolio site](https://adamlong.xyz/):

* Nike

* Jordan

* Facebook (now Meta)

* Sony PlayStation

* Yeti

* The World Cup

* Travel Portland

We discuss a bunch of talented photographers (click links to see their work):

* [Peter Beard](https://peterbeard.com/)

* Kevin Fletcher’s photo book, [_Avenue of Roses_ (Lensculture article)](https://www.lensculture.com/articles/kevin-fletcher-avenue-of-roses)

* [Jeremy Cowart](https://cowart.io/):

* [Simone Lueck has a project about older ladies in Adidas](https://www.tppp.photo/photographers/simone-lueck)

* [Brian Hodges (soccer balls made of trash)](https://www.tppp.photo/photographers/brian-hodges)

* [Robert Atkinson (birds and AI generative art)](https://www.tppp.photo/photographers/robert-david-atkinson):

* [Daniele Gasparini](https://www.tppp.photo/photographers/daniele-gasparini)

Adam’s wonderful illustrations, that he posts to [Instagram](https://www.instagram.com/adamlong/):

* [Steadman-esque Illustration](https://www.instagram.com/p/Cbokga3rxrR/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==) 

* [Illustration that reminded me of a surreal Hitchcock](https://www.instagram.com/p/CSYaaPxLiCC/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)

Not to mention, [Adam’s award-winning, short films](https://adamlong.xyz/films).

\_\[FYI: some podcast apps — I'm looking at you, Apple — cut off these show notes  before the end. You can see all of the shownotes on apps like Spotify or Overcast. OR, on our website:\_ [_**www.neilbinkley.com/photopod**_](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod)\]

In our discussion today, Adam and I talk about many things. If your podcast app shows chapters — well check ‘em out, because I added them! Otherwise, here’s a list of topics discussed, plus you can click on the timestamp to jump to that part of the interview (but OF COURSE, you’re listening all the way through the episode…):

\[00:00:00\] Adam Long: Bio

\[00:04:18\] Is Portland Still Weird?

\[00:06:37\] Faking it before you're making it

\[00:07:19\] Shooting 16mm vs Video vs DSLR Motion 


\[00:08:58\] Larger vs. Smaller Agencies

\[00:10:08\] Filmmaker to Art Director to Creative Director

\[00:11:18\] Mentored by former Wieden + Kennedy creatives

\[00:12:19\] Advertising that's fake

\[00:14:39\] Making travel ads for a "controversial" city

\[00:17:12\] How Adam works with photography and photographers

\[00:23:47\] He values a photographer's personal work

\[00:26:18\] The value of personal work, for any creative field

\[00:30:03\] Are printed things still valuable?

\[00:32:11\] Finding photographers on Instagram

\[00:35:10\] Is Photography being used more, less, or about the same as 5 years ago?

\[00:36:30\] Photographers who direct or DP as well?

\[00:37:37\] His Portfolio

\[00:38:57\] This interview is a little different than talking with Art producers

\[00:42:36\] Anything that he wishes photographers would do more of?

\[00:43:50\] Does he look at photographers' portfolios anymore?

\[00:46:30\] The variety of work he's done

\[00:49:29\] How often does his work end up on social?

\[00:50:05\] The power of video

\[00:52:20\] Memorable things on social media

\[00:54:42\] Does he like being contacted by photographers?

\[00:55:18\] How often is he in an office these days?

\[00:56:49\] Projects that stood out to him on The Personal Photography Project

\[01:04:41\] AI in photography

\[01:08:19\] Creatives are artists, too

\[01:10:05\] What he'd do, if not a Creative Director

\[01:10:48\] He's also a talented illustrator and filmmaker

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or at [www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

Also feel free to [drop me a line](mailto:[email protected]) with questions and ideas for future interviews!

[**Amy Feitelberg**](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/), Photo Creative Lead at [_Square_](https://squareup.com/us/en)_,_ and formerly the former Photo Director of Outside and Los Angeles magazines, plus a founding Curator for Images For Humanity — a photo charity supporting Ukraine.

Check out her tasty tearsheets and background on [Amy’s portfolio site](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/). Seriously, she’s worked with everyone.

This is Part 2 of my interview with Amy. Start with Part 1, or you’ll be confused and miss out on lots of good stuff! The following notes include references to both parts, fyi. Don’t miss the links at the bottom, to follow along at home with visual aids.

I’m your host, [Neil Binkley, Photographer's Consultant and Graphic Designer](https://www.neilbinkley.com).

We touch on so many different brands and publications (many of which she’s worked at, or knows the creatives):

* Square (and The Reader, it’s in-house publication)

* Apple

* Outside magazine

* Los Angeles magazine

* The New York Times Magazine

* New York magazine

* INQUE magazine

* Aphotoeditor

My gosh, we bring up so many creatives, photo editors, photographers and artists — most of whom she’s hired or worked with):

* Mary Ellen Mark

* Carlos Serao

* Frank Ockenfels

* Laurie Kratochvil

* Kwaku Alston

* Herb Ritts

* Jill Greenberg

* Andy Anderson

* Rob Haggart

* Dan Winters

* Emily Shur

* Art Streiber

* Arem Duplessis

* Matt Willey

* Landon Nordeman

* [Daniele Gasparini](https://www.tppp.photo/personal-projects/neon-alleys)

In our discussion today, Amy and I talk about many things. If your podcast app shows chapters — well check ‘em out, because I added them! Otherwise, here’s a list of topics discussed, plus you can click on the timestamp to jump to that part of the interview (but OF COURSE, you’re listening all the way through the episode…):

\[00:00:00\] Amy Feitelberg Intro

\[00:03:26\] What is The Personal Photography Project?

\[00:04:38\] What Does Amy Do at Square?

\[00:11:37\] Licensing Photos (Trends)

\[00:16:18\] The Anonymous Nature of Her Work 


\[00:19:10\] Looking at Personal Work As A Hiring Consideration

\[00:24:05\] How NOT to Get Hired by Square

\[00:26:48\] Print and Email Promos

\[00:29:18\] Coming Up With Ideas For Personal Projects

\[00:32:36\] Where to Send A Print Promo These Days?

\[00:38:16\] Portfolio Reviews

\[00:40:07\] She's Founding Curator at Images for Humanity, which Supports Ukraine

\[00:45:41\] We Live in a Photo Community

\[00:48:54\] BONUS: Us talking about podcasts that we like

This and much, much more.  

Links to What We Discuss:

\_\[FYI: some podcast apps — I'm looking at you, Apple — cut off these show notes  before the end. You can see all of the shownotes on apps like Spotify or Overcast. OR, on our website:\_ [_**https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod**_](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod)\]

* [Amy’s portfolio site](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/), which includes great tearsheets and colorful work samples from Square, Outside mag, Los Angeles mag, and more

* [Square’s colorful branding](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/new-gallery-2)

* Square’s [_The Reader_](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/the-reader-magazine), an in-house magazine

* [The Personal Photography Project](https://www.tppp.photo), which I founded this year as a website for showcasing photographers’ personal work

* [Neon Alleys](https://www.tppp.photo/personal-projects/neon-alleys), the photorealist CG project, by Daniele Gasparini, that stood out to Amy on our site

* Rob Haggart and his influential [_Aphotoeditor_ photo blog](https://aphotoeditor.com/)

* [Jody Quon’s job listing](https://www.instagram.com/p/CfcmjTuFutX/) (she’s Photo Director for New York magazine)

* [Images for Humanity](https://www.imagesforhumanity.org/), the photo charity supporting Ukraine that involves an amazing list of photographers — and you can buy their prints! An actually meaningful, last-minute Holiday/Birthday gift idea?

* [_Print is Dead_](https://www.longliveprint.co/interviews), a podcast about the magazine industry. Interviews with Arem Duplessis, Dan Winters, and other editorial luminaries.

* [Matt Willey](https://mattwilley.co.uk/), former Art Director at The New York Times Magazine (look at all of [his amazing cover designs](https://mattwilley.co.uk/NYT-COVERS)!), Founder/Art Director for [_INQUE_](https://inquemag.com/), a boutique literary magazine, ,[typeface designer](https://mattwilley.co.uk/AType-Stencil), and [Pentagram](https://www.pentagram.com/) partner. Can you tell I’m a fan?

* [Smartless podcast](https://www.smartless.com/)

* [Heather Elder’s “Dear Art Producer” podcast](https://heatherelder.com/journal#podcast)

* [The Photo Banter podcast, by Alex Gagne](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-photo-banter/id1315846850)

* [Eyeball, a photo podcast by John Loomis](https://podcasts.apple.com/no/podcast/eyeball/id1479435814)

* [Workbook Radio podcast](https://workbookradio.libsyn.com/website)

* Bonus link: [_Entertainment Weekly_ letterhead post about Amy](https://www.instagram.com/p/Chlr8FpuUaO/), with lovely hand-drawn illustration by the always-entertaining, former Photo Editor, Michele Romero

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or at [https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

Also feel free to [drop me a line](mailto:[email protected]) with questions and ideas for future interviews!

[**Amy Feitelberg**](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/), Photo Creative Lead at [_Square_](https://squareup.com/us/en)_,_ former Photo Director of Outside and Los Angeles magazines, plus a founding Curator for Images For Humanity — a photo charity supporting Ukraine.

Check out her tasty tearsheets and background on [Amy’s portfolio site](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/). Seriously, she’s worked with everyone.

This is Part 1 of 2 episodes interviewing Amy. Start with this one! The following notes include references to both parts, fyi. Don’t miss the links at the bottom, to follow along at home with visual aids.

I’m your host, [Neil Binkley, Photographer's Consultant and Graphic Designer](https://www.neilbinkley.com).

We touch on so many different brands and publications (many of which she’s worked at, or knows the creatives):

* Square (and The Reader, it’s in-house publication)

* Apple

* Outside magazine

* Los Angeles magazine

* The New York Times Magazine

* New York magazine

* INQUE magazine

* Aphotoeditor

My gosh, we bring up so many creatives, photo editors, photographers and artists — most of whom she’s hired or worked with):

* Mary Ellen Mark

* Carlos Serao

* Frank Ockenfels

* Laurie Kratochvil

* Kwaku Alston

* Herb Ritts

* Jill Greenberg

* Andy Anderson

* Rob Haggart

* Dan Winters

* Emily Shur

* Art Streiber

* Arem Duplessis

* Matt Willey

* Landon Nordeman

* [Daniele Gasparini](https://www.tppp.photo/personal-projects/neon-alleys)

In our discussion today, Amy and I talk about many things. If your podcast app shows chapters — well check ‘em out, because I added them! Otherwise, here’s a list of topics discussed:

* She's My First Post-Pandemic Interview

* Taking Rob Haggart's Job

* Aphotoeditor blog

* How She Finds Photographers

* Authenticity in Branding and Advertising

* Photography Vs. Illustration Vs...

* CGI

* Branding Vs. Magazine World (and how she's navigated BOTH)

* The Value of Storytelling

* Why Are Magazines Failing?

* Leaving the Editorial World

* The Reader: A Magazine Built for a Brand

* Magazines Without Ads

* City and Regional Magazines

* Can You Swear On This Podcast?

* Copyright Issues

* This and much, much more.

Links to What We Discuss:

* [Amy’s portfolio site](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/), which includes great tearsheets and colorful work samples from Square, Outside mag, Los Angeles mag, and more

* [Square’s colorful branding](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/new-gallery-2)

* Square’s [_The Reader_](http://www.amyfeitelberg.com/the-reader-magazine), an in-house magazine

* [The Personal Photography Project](https://www.tppp.photo), which I founded this year as a website for showcasing photographers’ personal work

* [Neon Alleys](https://www.tppp.photo/personal-projects/neon-alleys), the photorealist CG project, by Daniele Gasparini, that stood out to Amy on our site

* Rob Haggart and his influential [_Aphotoeditor_ photo blog](https://aphotoeditor.com/)

* [Jody Quon’s job listing](https://www.instagram.com/p/CfcmjTuFutX/) (she’s Photo Director for New York magazine)

* [Images for Humanity](https://www.imagesforhumanity.org/), the photo charity supporting Ukraine that involves an amazing list of photographers — and you can buy their prints! An actually meaningful, last-minute Holiday/Birthday gift idea?

* [_Print is Dead_](https://www.longliveprint.co/interviews), a podcast about the magazine industry. Interviews with Arem Duplessis, Dan Winters, and other editorial luminaries.

* [Matt Willey](https://mattwilley.co.uk/), former Art Director at The New York Times Magazine (look at all of [his amazing cover designs](https://mattwilley.co.uk/NYT-COVERS)!), Founder/Art Director for [_INQUE_](https://inquemag.com/), a boutique literary magazine, ,[typeface designer](https://mattwilley.co.uk/AType-Stencil), and [Pentagram](https://www.pentagram.com/) partner. Can you tell I’m a fan?

* Bonus link: [_Entertainment Weekly_ letterhead post about Amy](https://www.instagram.com/p/Chlr8FpuUaO/), with lovely hand-drawn illustration by the always-entertaining, former Photo Editor, Michele Romero

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or at [https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod). Also feel free to drop me a line with questions and ideas for future interviews!

Mark Winer, Photographer’s Agent at [The Gren Group](http://thegrengroupinc.com), who work with premier brands and ad agencies.

You can view all of their photographers and directors at [The Gren Group’s website](http://thegrengroupinc.com).

I’m your host, [Neil Binkley, Photographer's Consultant and Graphic Designer](https://www.neilbinkley.com).

Here’s a sampling of their clients:

* Apple

* Budweiser

* Pepsi

* State Farm

* Volkswagen

* BBDO

* Crispin Porter Bogusky

* Wieden + Kennedy

In our discussion today, Mark and I talk about:

* What do photography agents do for their photographers, and vice versa?

* How does the Gren Group stay in touch with ad agencies?

* How art producers reacted to the Gren Group’s change in focus

* What happens when things don’t work out between a rep and a photographer on their roster

* How can you build relationships with clients, instead of blindly marketing to them?

* How should you negotiate licensing and budgets?

* How important is motion work to ad agencies and reps these days?

* Is “authenticity” a fleeting trend in Lifestyle photography?

* How should you approach an agent? (Mark also [wrote a blog post about it](http://thegrengroupinc.com/getting-commercial-agent))

* Where he invests his efforts in social media

* This and much, much more.

Links to What We Discuss:

* [The Gren Group’s website](http://thegrengroupinc.com)

* [Do’s And Don’ts For Finding A Commercial Photography Agent](http://thegrengroupinc.com/getting-commercial-agent)

* [Previous Photopod interview with Senior Art Producer, Wylie Moran](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod/2019/5/22/1-wylie-moran-senior-art-producer-and-freelance-producer-bbdo-jwt-the-martin-agency)

* [Jonathan Chapman’s obituary in PDN](https://www.pdnonline.com/features/photography-news/obituaries/obituary-jonathan-chapman-advertising-photographer-filmmaker-46/)

* [National Alliance on Mental lllness](https://nami.org)

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), what I use (iPhone recommended only): [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), etc.), or at [www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](https://www.neilbinkley.com/photopod).

Also feel free to [drop me a line](mailto:[email protected]) with questions and ideas for future interviews!

Jamie Leary, Design Director, Philadelphia Magazine (formerly of Magnet, Decibel and Grid magazines) designs for a magazine that is more popular in my city than National Geographic, Vanity Fair, Men’s Health and Forbes, according to [their circulation #’s](https://www.phillymag.com/media-kit/philadelphia-magazine/).

In our discussion today, Jamie and I (your host, [Neil Binkley](https://www.neilbinkley.com)) talk about:

* Magazine Art budgets

* My incredibly brief tenure as Director of Photography at my guest’s magazine

* How he hired someone to shoot a cover story, inspired by that photographer’s Instagram photos

* Hiring locals vs. hiring around the country

* Illustration vs. photography

* Photojournalism vs. Conceptual photography

* Photographers’ websites, and what he likes to see

* And we even investigate a mysterious heart attack…

* This and much, much more.

Links to What We Discuss:

Magazines & Related:

* [Philadelphia Magazine’s “Best of Philly” cover](https://www.phillymag.com/news/2018/07/21/philadelphia-magazine-august-2018-best-of-philly-sneak-peek/)

* [New York magazine](http://nymag.com)

* [The Curtis Building](https://www.associationforpublicart.org/artwork/the-dream-garden/)

* [Norman Rockwell cover for The Saturday Evening Post](https://www.pinterest.com/pin/130182245462568496/)

* [The New York Times Magazine](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/26/magazine/behind-the-cover-design.html)

* [Texas Monthly](https://www.texasmonthly.com)

* The New York Times Magazine’ “Infrastructure” covers [One](https://www.pinterest.com/pin/395190936028673576/) and [Two](https://arrestedmotion.com/2009/06/focus-thomas-doyle-x-new-york-times-magazine/), plus [a more recent Photoillustration](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/07/magazine/behind-the-cover-the-music-issue.html) on the cover

* [Philadelphia Magazine’s “The New Rich”](https://www.phillymag.com/news/2018/05/19/philadelphia-magazine-june-2018-sneak-peek/)

* [Neil’s Pinterest Page of Outstanding Magazine and Book Covers](https://www.pinterest.com/neilbinkley/magazine-book-covers/)

Photographers, Photo Editors & A Stylist:

* [Kathy Ryan, The New York Times Magazine’s Dir. of Photography, photography book](https://aperture.org/shop/office-romance/)

* [Jonathan Pushnik](http://www.pushnikphoto.com)

* [Claudia Gavin/Philadelphia Magazine’s Photo Editor](http://cgavinphotography.com/tears)

* [Bobby Doherty/New York Magazine’s former Director of Photography](https://bobbydoherty.net)

* [Justin James Muir](https://www.justinjamesmuir.com)

* [Jason Varney](http://varneyphoto.com)

* [Lindsey Foret, stylist](https://www.linkedin.com/in/lindsay-foret-7288499/)

* [Matt Stanley](https://www.mattstanleyphoto.com)

* [Gene Smirnov](https://www.genesmirnov.com)

* [Chris Crisman](https://www.crismanphoto.com)

* [Adam Voorhes](https://www.voorhes.com/TEARSHEETS/COVERS-&-EDITORIAL/55)

* [Dan Saelinger](https://www.dansaelinger.com)

* [Clint Blowers](https://www.clintblowers.com)

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), my favorite: [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), etc.), or at [www.photopodpod.com](http://www.photopodpod.com). Also feel free to drop me a line with questions and ideas for future interviews!

Wylie Moran, Senior Art Producer and Freelance Producer (formerly of BBDO, JWT, and The Martin Agency) comes on the first full episode of Photopod! She sits down with me (your host, [Neil Binkley](https://www.neilbinkley.com)) to discuss how advertising agency Art Producers find photographers, why they hire them, whether photographers need to have motion work in their portfolio, and much, much more.

See all Photopod episodes by subscribing on your podcast player of choice ([Apple](https://geo.itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id1439624114), [Google](https://www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3Muc2ltcGxlY2FzdC5jb20vcG9kY2FzdHMvODI1Mi9yc3M=), my favorite: [Overcast](https://overcast.fm/itunes1439624114/photopod), [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5SWQeeJoC9FUiy1GfiTRIh), etc.), or at [www.photopodpod.com](http://www.photopodpod.com). Also feel free to drop me a line with questions and ideas for future interviews!

Show Notes/Links:

* [Wylie's website](https://wyliemoran.wixsite.com/portfolio) has samples of her work. Check out the many excellent photographers she's worked with on [her bio page](https://wyliemoran.wixsite.com/portfolio/bio).

* Benjamin Moore campaigns she worked on, as mentioned in [Adweek magazine](https://www.adweek.com/creativity/new-ads-benjamin-moore-wonders-if-its-selling-paint-or-something-else-entirely-170414/). [The tv spots were nicely done](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-srrALix4o), as well (I know, this is a photo podcast – but I can still appreciate good work).

A few places that Wylie worked:

* [BBDO](https://www.bbdo.com)

* [JWT](https://www.jwt.com/en/newyork)

* [The Martin Agency](https://martinagency.com)

* [Tierney](http://hellotierney.com)

Creative industry podcast that I mentioned, plus a few more that I didn't but you might find relevant:

* [Don't Get Me Started](https://www.oneclub.org/podcasts/) (interviews with ad agency founders, Creative Directors, etc.)

* [NION Radio](https://nionlife.com/podcasts/) (photographer Nick Onken's interviews with great photographers and others about their paths to success)

* [The Observatory](https://designobserver.com/podcast-the-observatory.php) (Michael Bierut – of [Pentagram](https://www.pentagram.com) fame – and Jessica Helfand thoughtfully discuss design in all its manifestations)

Welcome to the preview episode of Photopod, hosted by Neil Binkley. Photopod is a new interview podcast about the photography industry. In this trailer, hear snippets of interviews with Nike's former Photography Director, a Senior Art Producer, plus a magazine's Design Director.

Send questions and ideas for future interviews by visiting [www.neilbinkley.com/photopod](http://www.photopodpod.com).