In Edible-Alpha® podcast #121, Brad talks with Idella Yamben, Ph.D., director of the Center for Technology Commercialization (CTC), which, like FFI, is part of the University of Wisconsin System’s Institute for Business & Entrepreneurship. CTC offers a variety of programs and resources to help early-stage technology businesses—including those in the food or agriculture space—develop and conduct research to inform commercialization strategies and access funding to support the work.  

Idella insists that research and technology aren’t only about next-gen gadgets, machine learning, or university lab studies. CTC mainly works with inventors who have a novel approach to addressing a critical problem. For instance, maybe a farmer thinks of a way to boost crop yields, or a food entrepreneur wants to assess a new manufacturing process. CTC could help them determine how to test their hypotheses, business models, and market viability.

“You might not think what you’re doing could use technology, be innovation, or require research,” Idella says. “But my team’s job is to see if those opportunities are there and help you go after federal funding.”

One of CTC’s offerings is Ideadvance, which provides companies with seed money to test their business models through the Lean Startup framework. It helps them hone in on their target consumer, path to market, positioning, etc., to give the product, service, or solution the best chance of success.

CTC also prepares entrepreneurs to apply for Small Business Innovation Research (SBIR) and Small Business Technology Transfer (STTR) programs, aka America’s Seed Fund. Through this highly competitive program, 11 government agencies, including USDA, offer grants for early-stage R&D.

Through all of its programs, CTC helps startups test assumptions, which Idella says is basically the scientific method: “You make a hypothesis, develop an experiment, run it, then iterate.” But to ensure the best outcomes, she says it’s important to take a very disciplined approach to determine what that assumption and experiments should be. CTC helps entrepreneurs do that, often in partnership with industry-specific resources such as FFI.

A key piece of the Lean Startup model is customer discovery, which involves both listening to potential customers and then running experiments to validate what an entrepreneur thinks they heard. Ideally, the results can provide answers around cost, revenue, or value proposition.

Idella says those findings should then be balanced against the team’s goals and unique capabilities, which will help differentiate the business proposition. Through this process, entrepreneurs learn to synthesize information and become storytellers, both important skills for seeking any kind of financing.

Also through this work, entrepreneurs typically meet a lot of people and learn a ton. By listening well, Idella says they could identify a new angle, a different problem, or an opportunity to pivot. And pivoting early could save a lot of headaches—and money—later on, potentially even preventing a failed business.

Brad and Idella cover a whole lot more in this engaging podcast, including the many free tools, resources, and funding sources available to food and farm entrepreneurs.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #120, Andy sits down with Cliff McConville, founder of All Grass Farms northwest of Chicago. The diversified ag operation provides raw A2 milk, 100% grass-fed beef, pastured pork, organic vegetables, and free-range turkeys, broiler chickens, and eggs, all sold at the onsite farm store or online.

After working in the insurance business in Chicago for 25 years, Cliff’s last job allowed him to work from home. Now with more free time, he and his partner Anna purchased a suburban horse farm. Soon the documentary Food Inc., Michael Pollan’s The Omnivore’s Dilemma, and Joel Salatin’s You Can Farm sparked his intrigue in small-scale regenerative farming, so in 2011, he gave it a go on their 8.5 acres.

Cliff loved the work and realized it could become a small business, so in 2012, they started selling grass-fed and pastured proteins out of their house. Customers asked for raw A2 milk, which was not on Cliff’s radar, but once he researched its benefits, he became a devotee. They bought two Guernsey cows, got licensed to sell raw milk, secured liability insurance, and added the in-demand product to their mix.

With business booming, Cliff and Anna needed to increase production, so they leased 20 acres of pastureland near their home. Needing even more pastureland and ideally a dairy barn, they found exactly what they were looking for in the Brunner Family Forest Preserve, a picturesque property along a busy suburban highway.

After 18 months of negotiations, they worked out a unique 25-year lease. The forest preserve invested $200,000 to restore the historic dairy barn’s roof and foundation while Cliff and Anna foot the bill for septic, electricity, fencing, and other upgrades. They lease 160 acres for $150 per acre and pay the preserve 5% of all farm store sales. Cliff calls this a wonderful partnership, and the property’s high visibility has supercharged sales.  

Next, Andy and Cliff dig into the financials, as Cliff meticulously tracks production costs, sales, and profits of each enterprise. The largest and fastest growing animal enterprise is beef, while raw milk, which requires a ton of labor and time, isn’t nearly as profitable, so Cliff caps production. His data also informs when and where to raise prices to ensure profitability.  

Uniquely, All Grass Farms has equity investors, longtime friends who were eager to provide patient capital. Later on, they took out an operating line of credit to help with infrastructure improvements.

Most recently, Cliff and Anna began leasing organic pastureland in Elkhorn, Wisconsin, owned by the Yggdrasil Land Foundation. With a triple-net lease, they maintain the buildings, property, and infrastructure and pay insurance, property taxes, and a stewardship fee as rent. Cliff and Anna now live at this property and are looking for a full-time farm manager for the Brunner property, although finding and keeping workers is challenging.

Cliff is a great role model for managing farm finances, so tune in to learn more!

In Edible-Alpha podcast #119, Andy talks to Will Glazik of Cow Creek Organic Farm and Silver Tree Beer & Spirits in Paxton, Illinois. The fifth-generation farmer is building upon his family legacy with his own organic grain operation and vertically integrated distillery business.

Will’s parents transitioned Cow Creek Farm to organic in 2002, an anomaly in an area dominated by conventional row-crop agriculture. He went off to college, got an agronomy degree, and entered ag retail while still helping his father farm on the side. But selling chemical fertilizers and pesticides didn’t really jive with Will’s values. Instead, he enjoyed teaching area farmers how to save money and be more sustainable through cover-cropping, reduced tillage, integrative pest management, and eventually transitioning to organic.

Though he was a sought-after consultant, Will wanted to farm. But with ground costing up to $14,000 per acre in his county, purchasing land wasn’t the best option. Instead, by chance encounter, he met landowner Jackie Davis, who wanted to transition her ground to organic. The two hit it off, forged a 50/50 share crop agreement, and Will got to work, using $20,000 he’d saved up.

Going in, he thought he had all the answers, but he soon learned he did not. There were some tough years, but Jackie remained supportive. After working out the kinks, Will says they went “hog wild,” expanding their rotation to 14 crops, bringing in hogs and cattle, and dabbling in distilling. Combined with raising a young family, this was a recipe for burnout.

All along, Will just assumed that his specialty crop variety made him more profitable. But once he hired an accountant, he learned that wasn’t the case. In reality, the extra work required to grow some of those crops canceled out the profits. So he streamlined his operations, narrowed his crop assortment to six, and created a better work-life balance. Now, rather than acquiring more acreage, he’s trying to coax more profitability out of each acre—a smart move since growing grains isn’t Will’s only endeavor.

Already hobby brewers, he and his brothers founded Silver Tree Beer & Spirits in 2017 to turn their grains into beer, vodka and whiskey. They partnered with an established distiller to produce the vodka, then the Glaziks “busted their tails” trying to secure distribution. Will says the marketing part is tough, but they’ve learned a lot and built solid relationships. Meanwhile, they began aging their whiskey, ready for release this fall.

When their distiller decided to scale up, he sold his equipment to the Glaziks. Then last year they bought a fixer-upper in Paxton, gutted it, moved in the equipment, are now almost ready to start distilling. By owning every step from farm to bottle, their margins will balloon. Eventually, they’ll open tasting room and tour experience, which the town is thrilled about.

Tune into the full podcast to get the full story, including how Will and his brothers have financed their endeavors.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #118, Andy has a fascinating discussion with Belinda Kelly and Venise Cunningham, co-founders of Simple Goodness Sisters. The two started with a retail line of small-batch simple syrups and have since diversified with a subscription box club and the Simple Goodness Soda Shop in Wilkeson, Washington.

Growing up with a family business, Belinda and Venise knew they wanted to be entrepreneurs someday. Both worked in tech in Seattle, but after becoming moms, they craved careers more aligned with their passions and lifestyles. Venise loved working on Simple Goodness Farm, which she and her husband bought in 2010, while Belinda enjoyed cooking.

In 2016, Belinda quit her corporate job and launched a mobile bar business that became an instant hit. The secret to her success were her handcrafted simple syrups featuring herbs, fruits, and edible flowers from Venise’s farm and other locally sourced ingredients. Serving craft cocktails at events ginned up demand for the syrups, and Venise eventually convinced Belinda that they should launch a retail product.

So, they set to work on Simple Goodness Sisters, with Belinda developing recipes and Venise researching potential co-packers. They finally found a co-packer six hours away that would take their very small, self-financed run, capped at 1,000 bottles to test demand. Though that partnership was ultimately unsustainable, they learned a ton about producing at scale. Launching their first flavors in 2018, they received rave reviews and decided to ramp up production.

As their business grew, Belinda sold the mobile bar company and Venise expanded production on her farm. While still using a co-packer, they wanted to get certified to produce small batches themselves, which leads to their brick-and-mortar endeavor.

They’d purchased a historic building in touristy Wilkeson, envisioning it as a seasonal off-farm agritourism destination for sampling cocktails, sodas, and other items featuring their syrups. Also, having learned from an FFI boot camp that they needed a steadier cash flow, they began plotting a subscription box featuring special-release syrups that they’d produce onsite.  

When the liquor board demanded that they also sell food, Belinda and Venise pivoted concepts to include a farm-to-table sandwich menu. The pandemic forced even more pivots, first delaying the Simple Goodness Soda Shop’s opening from May to October 2020 and then turning it into a to-go joint. Still, the shop gained a following in the 10 weeks it was open before closing for the season.

In early 2021, they launched Cocktail Farm Club, which has grown significantly, aided by the sisters’ active social media presence and key PR opportunities. They also reopened the Soda Shop in May and had a great first full season, followed by a bustling 2022 so far.

With their retail, wholesale, and e-commerce business growing as well, Simple Goodness Sisters has outgrown its co-packer. So now Belinda and Venise want to invest in their own production facility, which will require more financing. Having mostly self-financed and invested in real estate thus far, along with receiving a USDA marketing grant, this will be an exciting next phase for this inspiring business.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #117, Brad chats with Sylvie Charles, M.D., who traded a stable career as a physician for the wild ride of entrepreneurship when launching organic real-food sweetener company Just Date in 2018. She shares the mission behind her endeavor, along with her business arc and growth strategy.

As a practicing physician at the University of California, San Francisco, Sylvie was alarmed by the rise in obesity, type 2 diabetes and other chronic illnesses. She knew that refined sugar in the diet was a key culprit, yet her patients often struggled to cut back. Realizing that there really wasn’t a healthy, great-tasting alternative to cane sugar, she thought about nutrient-rich dates, which her Indian family used to sweeten chutneys.

Sylvie got to work developing a low-glycemic organic date syrup that has less sugar than maple syrup, honey, or agave and delivers fiber, vitamins, and minerals. Her family, friends, and patients loved it, so she took it to Bay Area natural foods retailers, where it flew off the shelves. About two months in, Just Date broke into Whole Foods Market nationwide, prompting Sylvie to quit practicing medicine to be a full-time entrepreneur.

The move paid off. After three years of proving the concept with three flagship SKUs and several other products, Just Date is now in about 2,000 natural retail doors. The brand also does a robust e-commerce business and has a small but growing foodservice arm.

Sylvie has mainly bootstrapped the company with her own money, loans, credit, and reinvested revenue, which limited growth and kept it mostly a one-woman show. Recognizing that raising funds and building a team could turbocharge the next phase of growth, she recruited a business partner from the tech world last year. Together, they raised a successful seed round and put together a sales and marketing team. Though bootstrapping made for some lean years, Sylvie is grateful she is only receiving investor money now that she knows exactly how to spend it.

In less than a year, the company has made tremendous progress, including by optimizing its supply chain, enhancing sustainability, and refining its messaging and branding. Acknowledging that sugar science is complex and the array of alternative sweeteners is confusing, Just Date has opted to message more around its simple, clean ingredients and low-sugar proposition.

What’s next for this growing company? While it has done wonderfully in the natural channel, Sylvie says there is still room for growth there. She also aims to make more inroads in conventional to reach a broader audience. More opportunities are opening up in the foodservice space too, and as an ingredient play, with other CPG brands swapping sugar for Just Date sweeteners. Though the exact path ahead isn’t carved out yet, Sylvie hopes to grow the company to about $20 million and exit in about five years.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #116, Sarah sits down with Chris Wojtowicz, international trade consultant with the Wisconsin Small Business Development Center (SBDC). With 30 years of experience in trade development and trade compliance, he helps small businesses statewide plan and execute their global strategies.  

According to Chris, less than 1% of U.S. companies export, yet more than 95% of the world’s market lies outside the U.S. Therefore, selling excess capacity overseas or simply expanding internationally could be a smart play for food and farm businesses. Many entrepreneurs assume it’ll be too complicated, expensive, or scary, but Chris insists it doesn’t have to be. It just requires research, planning, and tapping into the right resources.

Chris tells clients to first evaluate their product, its benefits, and the reason consumers want to buy it. Then explore various international markets to learn whether they are importing similar products and/or would have a desire for theirs. To help, the International Trade Administration has a database at export.gov that suggests market opportunities for specific products. Next, zero in on the nations with the most potential and develop a strategic market entry. Entrepreneurs should decide how they want to sell, such as direct to the end user or through a distributor, and what each path would entail.

Overall, this process is very similar to planning a regional or national expansion, except it also requires consideration of foreign regulations around food safety, packaging, labeling, licensure, taxes, etc. Entrepreneurs must also look at costs and logistics, and if working with a distributor, hammer out terms such as who covers freight, insurance, and loss. Clear documentation and good relationships are key.

On the surface, this all might seem daunting to a small business owner. But there are plenty of resources to help, including SBDC and the Wisconsin Economic Development Corporation (WEDC) and similar organizations in other states, as well as the U.S. Commercial Service and industry trade associations. Domestic resources such as these can then connect entrepreneurs to foreign-equivalent organizations.  

With the right guidance, Chris says even very small companies can successfully go global—in some cases, even before they expand domestically. It all boils down to finding the white space and executing on the right opportunities—and budgeting time and money carefully, of course.  

There’s a lot more valuable info packed into this podcast, so definitely tune in!

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #115, Andy talks with Ron Henningfeld, founder and cheesemaker at Hill Valley Dairy in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. Sourcing milk from his family’s small dairy farm nearby, the company sells a wide variety of artisan cheeses at local shops, farmers markets, and restaurants and recently opened its own downtown storefront.

Ron loved growing up on Romari Farms and wanted to stay involved in some capacity. He studied ag education and biology at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, where he began dabbling in cheesemaking, but only as a hobby. After teaching high school for a few years, he decided to pursue his passion, hoping cheesemaking would someday lead him back to the family farm, now owned by his oldest brother.

But first Ron had to hone his craft. He apprenticed at UW’s Babcock Hall, then took a job at a creamery, and then helped open Clock Shadow Creamery in Milwaukee in 2012. These experiences taught him the art, science, and nuances of cheesemaking and helped him broaden his skillset.

Eventually, Ron felt ready to strike out on his own. In 2016, he and wife Josie launched Hill Valley Dairy, with Ron as the cheesemaker and Josie in charge of marketing. By renting production space from Clock Shadow, their operating costs were quite low, allowing them to self-finance the business. They also started small, making 50 to 100 pounds of cheese every few weeks to sell at two farmers markets.

Hill Valley Dairy stayed hyperlocal for the first few years, building a following with delicious staples like cheddar, gouda, and cheese curds. But as they gained more traction and demand, they added more wholesale accounts and launched unique artisan varieties, including two prizewinning cave-aged hard cheeses, Luna and Alina.

Today, Ron produces 500 pounds of cheese a week, using almost 20% of the milk his family’s farm produces. Still renting space from Clock Shadow, he takes a truckload of milk to the creamery each week, makes cheese, then hauls it back to the farm to age, cut, package, and distribute. The couple’s two young daughters love helping out, making Hill Valley Dairy a true family business.

Earlier this year, Ron and Josie opened Hill Valley Cheese Shop in downtown Lake Geneva, a bustling tourist town between Madison, Milwaukee, and Chicago. They sell their own products, of course, plus cheeses from other local artisans, and soon they’ll add a cheese bar to make it more experiential.

Now with more overhead and infrastructure, Ron and Josie have brought in outside capital and financing. They received a value-added producer grant (VAPG) in 2018, which they qualified for because his farmer brother owns a small part of Hill Valley Dairy. This past winter, they scored a Wisconsin Department of Agriculture grant to do a feasibility study on building their own creamery. Most recently, they opened a line of credit with a local bank to help buy equipment and build up their brick-and-mortar space.  

Tune in to get the full scoop on this growing Wisconsin food business’s inspiring trajectory!

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #114, Andy chats with Chaz Self, owner of Grassway Organics in southeastern Wisconsin. This regenerative, certified-organic farm raises 100% grass-based dairy, beef, and poultry; operates a farm store; and hosts Pizza on the Farm.    

California-born Chaz grew up passionate about animal welfare but had never set foot on a farm. Then, after moving to Wisconsin as a teen, he became curious about ag and enrolled in a farm management program at a local technical college. Through that, he got a job milking cows at a CAFO and loved it. “It was not the way I chose to farm, but it taught me everything I didn’t want to do,” Chaz says. “It opened my eyes to how big the ag world really is.”

From there, Chaz and his wife, Megan, worked at a few smaller farms, including in Norway. There, as part of the Worldwide Opportunities for Organic Farms (WWOOF) program, they milked 14 grass-fed cows at a biodynamic farm and fell in love with the sustainable, community-focused agricultural principles.

Back in Wisconsin in 2016, they met a ready-to-retire farming couple in New Holstein who wanted to pass on their land and business. Excited about mentorship and succession, Chaz began working for the couple full-time. With an FSA loan, the Selfs bought the business, cows, equipment, store, and inventory—everything but the land and buildings. They also purchased a food truck to make and sell pizzas for extra revenue.

After a year in business, the Selfs made an offer on the land but were outbid, forcing them to find a new location. Chaz called up the Yggdrasil Land Foundation, which buys up organic and biodynamic farmland to lease to young farmers. In “a serendipitous moment,” there was land available near East Troy. Fifty-eight semi loads later, Grassway Organics had a new home.

With a 30-year contract, the Selfs rent 390 acres, plus 150 acres for forage, from Yggdrasil. They raise Jerseys that produce A2/A2 milk, which has health benefits over conventional A1/A1 milk. And because their milk is raw, their farm store sells only to co-op members in accordance with Wisconsin law. The store also features their grass-fed beef and pastured chicken, turkey, and eggs, as well as local producers’ pastured pork and bulk goods. Grassway Organics also operates an e-commerce store and delivers to drop points around the state.  

With live music and a casual vibe, Pizza on the Farm is a huge success, accounting for about half of the business’s revenue. The weekend events enable the community to gather and learn about regenerative ag while allowing Grassway Organics to support other local producers. They now have 15 employees for pizza nights and used a value-added producer grant (VAPG) to hire marketing help.

On the financial side, Andy and Chaz discuss the pros and cons of renting versus owning land, how VAPGs can transform a farm business, and how family farms can benefit local economies and uplift entire communities.  

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #113, Brad connects with Mark Cottone, founder of Clean Beam, and Jim Rush, the company’s marketing director. Clean Beam’s revolutionary footwear sanitizer powered by DryZap!, its patented pulsed ultraviolet (PUV) light technology, helps processing facilities enhance food safety and security.

After Mark’s other company, Cougar Packaging Concepts, began using PUV to sanitize and extend the shelf life of food, the idea arose to apply DryZap! to footwear in food processing facilities. He started Clean Beam about five years ago to develop a dry, fast, chemical-free sanitation solution to replace boot washers and other existing systems, which are notoriously problematic.

The initial goal was simply to protect plant employees from slipping. But then, through rigorous testing, the team realized DryZap’s superior speed, efficacy, and consistency in eliminating a wide range of contaminants. PUV kills bacteria, molds, yeasts, and other pathogens in six seconds or less and delivers the kill value of heat without changing a product’s temperature.

Plus, as an electronic system, the Clean Beam sanitizer tracks every user and feeds data into the cloud. This enables plants to track movement patterns and pinpoint the source of problems should they occur. Overall, DryZap! has the potential to prevent security breaches while providing total traceability, monitoring, and predictive analytics.

Clean Beam’s innovation is especially timely, as all food manufacturers must now comply with Food Safety Modernization Act (FSMA) rules. Through FSMA, FDA requires companies to implement preventative controls, to be proactive about food safety rather than reactive.

Although DryZap! would be a stellar solution for most any production facility, there is still a steep education curve for many food companies. In their industry conversations, Mark and Jim explain that FSMA compliance is about more than checking a box. Yes, a standard boot washer might make them compliant, and no, they may not foresee any safety issues now, but the costs of weathering a recall are astronomical. As Jim points out, “this is a cost-avoidance play as much as a cost-savings play.”

Along with educating potential customers, Clean Beam also listens to their pain points and needs. This consultative selling approach may be slower than hard-selling, but Brad says it is ultimately more effective. It helps entrepreneurs engender trust in the industry and hone their solutions to better suit the companies they want to help. This has definitely been the case for Clean Beam, which has been evolving its offerings in response to these conversations—and they are definitely not done innovating yet!

Tune in to hear the full story of Clean Beam’s inception, development, launch, sales strategy, and goals for growth. This podcast offers great guidance and inspiration for food technology entrepreneurs, as well as food manufacturers looking to safeguard their operations.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #112, Andy sits down with Stephanie Schneider of Together Farms in Mondovi, Wisconsin, at the edge of the Driftless Area. This diversified farm business sells 100% grass-fed beef and lamb, pastured heritage pork, and meal kits direct-to-consumer, delivering locally and shipping regionally. Together Farms also hosts farm tours and Burger Night onsite.

Stephanie and husband Andy purchased the “dilapidated old dairy farm” and small farmhouse in 2009, wanting to raise their daughters in the country and produce their own food. Neither had ag experience, so they had to learn it all—and build most of the infrastructure—as they went. Committed to raising animals 100% on grass, they made mistakes along the way but gained knowledge and experience too.

Around 2012, adjacent acreage came up for sale, so the Schneiders seized the fortuitous opportunity, bought the land, and tried to turn farming into a real business. They planned to sell their meats at farmers markets, but when that fell through last minute, they pivoted to online sales—long before most farms were doing it. Figuring out e-commerce was tricky, as neither Stephanie nor Andy had marketing backgrounds either, but they got it dialed in.

Then a few years ago, Stephanie was “drowning in lard” and wanted to figure out a way to use it. She also hoped to branch into agritourism. To accomplish both, plus feature Together Farms’ grass-fed beef, she came up with Burger Night. The Schneiders didn’t have restaurant experience, but folks from farm-to-table restaurants they supplied meat to helped them get it off the ground.

After a successful test-run in 2017, bolstered by a feature on Wisconsin Foodie, the Schneiders invested in the infrastructure to host Burger Night every weekend May through October. The event really took off during the height of the pandemic and now draws some 500 people per weekend.

Although Stephanie quit her day job two years ago, the family still relies on Andy’s off-farm income. He plans to join her full-time within two years, which will help them “get our heads above water from the daily grind,” get a better handle on their businesses, and boost efficiencies across the board.

In the meantime, the Schneiders secured loans to construct a building for hay storage and pig housing, plus a multipurpose facility for shipping and receiving and a farm store. They aim to finish both buildings this year. Ultimately, the store will feature Together Farms’ meats alongside other local producers’ goods.

Smartly, the Schneiders have incorporated their multiple enterprises as separate businesses. And while Stephanie says they still have a lot to learn about finances, they’ve done a good job of keeping expenses in line with cash flow, receiving help from FSA, EIDL money, and Buy Local, Buy Wisconsin grants. Once the new buildings are complete and Andy becomes full-time, they’ll streamline operations further and hopefully drive more revenue.

In Edible-Alpha® podcast #111, Brad talks with Steve Mehmert, managing partner at T4 Solutions, a Pewaukee, Wisconsin-based consulting firm that helps grocers and other food distributors map out profitable e-commerce programs, from ordering platforms through delivery. Brad and Steve have a fascinating conversation about key challenges, opportunities, and innovations in the rapidly evolving grocery landscape. Steve started T4 Solutions in 2019, shortly after selling his first company, Mehmert Store Services. He’d spent 30 years designing and developing grocery stores, focusing primarily on independents. Through his new venture, he could leverage his expertise and connections to continue serving that market. Prior to the pandemic, independent grocers were increasingly—but reluctantly—launching e-commerce just to stay competitive. Typically, their systems were inefficient and incapable of much volume. They’d lose money on every order, but since e-commerce represented a tiny percentage of total sales, they’d shrug it off. Anticipating where the market was heading, Steve knew, as did most of these retailers, that these systems weren’t sustainable long-term. But nobody foresaw COVID-19 or its impact on the food industry. With millions of Americans suddenly wanting to buy groceries online, brick-and-mortars had to up their e-commerce game STAT. Now Steve’s services were in even hotter demand. T4 Solutions helps identify, develop, and deliver the best technology, tools, and systems to make each client’s e-commerce program run smoothly and cost-effectively. For example, the firm offers technology-managed, temperature-controlled lockers that hold online orders for customer pickup, as well as temperature-controlled delivery vehicles to replace crowdsourced drivers. T4 also helps clients set up micro-fulfillment centers, onsite order storage, and other e-commerce infrastructure. Brad and Steve discuss how the food landscape has shaken out over the last two years. Today, grocers’ sales remain well above pre-pandemic levels, and many continue to do robust online business. Though most retailers have streamlined e-commerce, there are still kinks to work out and improvements to be made, especially amidst the challenging labor market. Next, they dig into Amazon’s grocery strategy and how corporate grocers are expanding e-commerce services. Steve says even the big guys don’t have everything figured out. He firmly believes independents can and should compete, and those willing to evolve and embrace technology can thrive. He envisions grocery stores big and small moving to more micro-fulfillment models, finding them more efficient and able to serve even more customers. T4 isn’t done devising solutions either. Steve loves a challenge, and in today’s food industry, new ones arise constantly. He details the latest projects he’s working on, including figuring out a merchandiser for impulse purchases to accompany the lockers. And while most of his clients are grocers, he’s also working with food banks and organizations serving rural and urban food deserts. This podcast is packed with many more insights, so be sure to tune in!