In this conversation, Jason Ballard sits down with Cass Langton, pastor, worship leader, and longtime creative leader, to talk about church planting, healing after ministry transition, and why creativity and beauty matter deeply in the life of the church.

Cass reflects on the surprising journey that led her and her family from 26 years at Hillsong into planting The Local Church in Sydney. She shares honestly about the slow and painful work of healing after ministry transition, the importance of resisting reactionary leadership, and the grace of learning to recognize God’s presence in the quiet, ordinary moments of life.

Jason and Cass also explore the unique calling of creatives in the church. Together, they discuss how pastors can better understand, value, and disciple creatives, why beauty is a primary matter in the Kingdom of God, and how the church can become a place where artists, musicians, writers, and makers are spiritually and creatively nurtured. 

This is a rich conversation for pastors, church planters, worship leaders, and anyone longing to see the church become more beautiful, imaginative, and alive to the presence of God.

Jason and Cass discuss:

• Cass’s journey from Hillsong to planting The Local Church Sydney,
• How healing, rest, and recalibration shaped the season before launching something new,
• Learning to see the “miracles in the mundane” in pastoral ministry,
• The role of beauty and creativity in the mission of God,
• How churches can cultivate and pastor creatives well,
• Why creatives need community, formation, and care, not just opportunities to serve,
• Practical ways pastors can bless and release artists in their churches.

Show Notes

• The Local Church Sydney
• The Hopeful Rhino
• Instagram
  
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Partners

We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠give⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church.

Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church.

Today on the podcast, Jason is joined by Dr. Henry Cloud. Henry is a clinical psychologist, leadership consultant, and bestselling author whose work has helped shape the leadership of countless pastors and ministry leaders over the past several decades. Many will know him through books like Boundaries, Integrity, and Necessary Endings, where he brings together insights from psychology, relationships, and leadership to help people grow in health and effectiveness.

In this conversation, Henry reflects on his unlikely path from pursuing a career in golf to studying theology, psychology, and eventually working with leaders across both ministry and organizational contexts. Along the way, he developed a deep care and concern for pastors, those who carry enormous responsibility while often receiving very little care themselves.

Together, Henry and Jason explore the pressures of pastoral leadership and the unique challenges faced by pastors. Henry shares insights from decades of working with leaders, offering a framework for leadership that moves beyond personality or charisma and toward a set of functions that can be learned and practiced over time.

Together, Henry and Jason discuss:

• Why pastors often find themselves pouring out for others with very few places to be cared for themselves,
• Why leadership is not merely instinct or gifting, but a craft that must be learned and practiced,
• The importance of humility and discernment in navigating complex leadership decisions,
• Why pastors must pursue healing and self-awareness as part of their leadership formation,
• And the crucial role of trusted relationships outside the ministry system for growth and accountability.

Throughout the conversation, Henry speaks with deep respect for pastors. His encouragement is both honest and hopeful: sustainable leadership requires humility, intentional support, and a commitment to becoming whole as we lead others.

Show Notes

• ⁠Dr. Henry Cloud Website
• Books by Dr. Henry Cloud
• Boundaries.me – Dr. Cloud’s platform for personal growth, mental health, and relationships
• City Meetups
• The Emerging Leaders Lab

Partners

Special thanks to the Canadian Bible Society for making this episode possible. We invite you to explore their ⁠Bible Course⁠ to help your church grow in Scripture engagement.

The work of strengthening pastors across Canada is only possible because of generous partners like you. As we look to the future, would you consider joining us in prayer, sharing this episode, or ⁠making a gift to invest in a vibrant, Jesus-centered church in every community⁠?

In today’s episode Jason sits down with Finu Iype, Co-Senior Pastor of Village Church in Surrey, British Columbia, to trace his story from an Indian family line marked by conversion and adoption into the family of God, to his early years preaching in small towns across Ontario, to eventually stepping into senior leadership at Village Church in Surrey. Along the way, Finu shares what he’s learned about evangelism, the cost of calling, and the ways God builds His church beyond the influence of any one leader.

Together, Finu and Jason explore:

• Finu’s family story, his grandfather’s conversion, the societal cost of following Jesus, and the gift of being “adopted” into a new spiritual family,
• How suffering formed his spirituality through personal illness and the loss of his younger brother,
• His early ministry years preaching in small-town Ontario and gathering churches to pray, disciple, and reach their communities,
• The Village Church story, including a prophetic word, a lunch invitation with Mark Clark, and a long discernment process,
• Leadership transition and resilience: what Village’s continued growth says about the faithfulness of God, 
• and the evangelistic opportunities provided by immigration to Canada. 

Finu’s story invites us to live with courage, to hold loosely to our own visions for our lives, and to trust that God is often writing a better story than the one we would choose for ourselves.

Show Notes

• Village Church
• City Meetups
• The Emerging Leaders Lab

Partners

• Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church.
• We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠give⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church.

John Ortberg is a pastor, author, and spiritual formation teacher known for helping people experience life with God in their everyday lives. In today’s conversation, John shares his journey into pastoral ministry, the unexpected role that decision-making played in discovering his calling, and how God uses the work of pastoring to shape the soul of the pastor. John shares the heart of the gospel as life with God in the present, not just the future, and he discusses how to form people into that reality through clear pathways of discipleship, honest self-examination, and practices that lead to transformation.

John and Jason also talk about the hidden pressures of ministry, the slow drift toward cynicism, and why joy is not optional for long-term faithfulness. John offers hard-won wisdom on sustaining integrity, building a real “program” of discipleship, and arranging one’s life around deep contentment, joy, and confidence in everyday life with God.

Together, John and Jason explore:

• Why God’s will for us often comes down to our freedom to choose, and how decision-making forms our character,
• The pastorate as a crucible for character formation,
• The Bible’s central invitation as life with God, here and now, not just “getting into heaven,”
• Why discipleship needs both a fellowship and a program (and what we can learn from 12-step communities)
• How pastors can arrange their days for deep contentment, joy, and confidence with God.

John’s wisdom is both tender and bracing as he reminds us that joy isn’t a luxury for pastors but that it often serves as the strength that keeps a life faithful, sustainable, and rightly oriented towards God.

Show Notes

• Become New
• Steps: A Guide to Transforming Your Life When Willpower Isn’t Enough
• A Guide to Flourishing Study
• The Emerging Leaders Lab
• Pastors Retreat Scholarships
• Pastors Retreat Details

Partners

Special thanks to the Canadian Bible Society for making this episode possible. We invite you to explore their ⁠Bible Course⁠ to help your church grow in Scripture engagement.

The work of strengthening pastors across Canada is only possible because of generous partners like you. As we look to the future, would you consider joining us in prayer, sharing this episode, or ⁠making a gift to invest in a vibrant, Jesus-centered church in every community⁠?

In today’s episode, Phil Reinders invites us into a pastoral journey shaped by a deep conviction: Canada is his mission field. Drawing from decades of ministry across Vancouver, Calgary, and Toronto, Phil reflects on what evangelism and discipleship look like in a culture that has rapidly shed its Christian memory.

We explore why many people today are drawn not to novelty, but to the ancient paths of Christian formation, and how historic practices, when lived communally, can form resilient disciples in a fragmented age. At the heart of the conversation is Habitus Community, a shared rule of life community designed to strengthen local churches by helping ordinary Christians practice a coherent way of life with God.

This conversation is an invitation to pastors and leaders who are longing for deeper formation, sustainable rhythms, and a renewed love for the local church.

In this conversation, Jason and Phil explore:

• Why Phil understands his calling as being a missionary to Canada, and what that means in a post-Christian culture,
• The hunger for ancient Christian practices in a world that promises freedom but delivers fragmentation,
• How a shared rule of life can form ordinary disciples through daily, weekly, and communal rhythms,
• The origin and vision of Habitus, and why community is essential for spiritual practices to endure,
• Rediscovering love for the local church, not as an ideal, but as a gift God uses to form us.

Phil speaks with clarity, humility, and a deep love for the Church. His reflections invite pastors to slow down and believe that faithfulness, lived together, still bears worthwhile fruit in our time.

Show Notes

• ⁠Habitus Community
• Phil’s Book: Seeking God’s Face: Praying with the Bible through the Year

Partners

• We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠give⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church.
• Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church.

In today’s episode, Father Justin Huang invites us into his journey of faith, vocation, and pastoral ministry. From a teenage conversion to a long and costly discernment of priesthood, Father Justin reflects on the ways that God leads us through surrender, suffering, and trust into deeper freedom and joy.

Father Justin and Jason talk about the heart of Christian discipleship by exploring encounter with Jesus, dying to self in order to receive more of God, and the slow, patient formation of a life rooted in prayer. Father Justin shares honestly about exhaustion, panic attacks and the interior battles of ministry, while offering a hopeful vision for pastors who long to remain alive in Christ despite the weight of care, responsibility, and expectation. 

Together, Father Justin and Jason explore:

• Father Justin’s teenage conversion and his journey toward a lifelong call to priesthood, shaped by fear, surrender, and learning to trust God,
• The difference between surface-level happiness and the deeper peace that comes through obedience, encounter with Jesus, and costly discipleship,
• Why encounter with Jesus must come before asking people to embrace costly discipleship,
• Leading parish renewal by centering ministry on God’s mercy, presence, and love,
• The unseen toll of ministry: exhaustion, panic, burnout, and learning to recognize early warning signs with honesty and humility,
• How patterns of prayer, rule of life, retreat, and silence help pastors create space to receive God’s love without striving or proving.

Father Justin offers a generous window into the interior life of a pastor who has learned, often painfully, that holiness is not found in doing more for God, but in making space to receive more of Him. Whether you’re navigating ministry fatigue, discerning a call, or longing for deeper intimacy with Jesus, this conversation invites you to slow down, listen, and trust the Father’s patient work in your life.

Show Notes:

• St. Anthony of Padua Parish — South Vancouver
• Father Justin's Blog
• Catholic Christian Outreach
• The Liturgy of the Hours
• The Examen Prayer (St. Ignatius of Loyola)

Partners

Special thanks to the Canadian Bible Society for making this episode possible. We invite you to explore their ⁠Bible Course⁠ to help your church grow in Scripture engagement.

In today’s episode, Jason sits down with Chris Dias of Hope Bible Church in Oakville, Ontario to discuss Chris’ journey from the corporate world into vocational ministry. Chris reflects on Hope Bible Church’s unique co-lead model, grounded in long-term friendship and clear “highest and best use” roles, and shares honestly about the joy and struggle of being a church committed to equipping and sending out ministers and church planters. Along the way, he highlights the importance of prayerful discernment and the courageous work of calling and forming leaders for the good of the local church.

Chris and Jason explore:

• The story of Hope Bible Church and what God has done in the past 20 years,
• Chris’ journey from bank executive and church elder to full-time vocational ministry, and what that discernment looked like over time,
• Why Hope Bible Church shifted from a senior pastor model to a co-lead model, and the ingredients that make it work,
• The burden of Matthew 9:38, praying earnestly for labourers, and how leadership development requires both prayer and courageous invitation,
• The worthwhile cost of being a sending church: money, bandwidth, change, and the grief of releasing friends,
• A framework for multiplication: conviction, culture, constructs, and why the Church needs all three.

Chris offers a grounded, hope-filled vision for pastors who feel the weight of leadership shortages, who long to develop future leaders with depth, and who want to build churches that both grow and send. If you’re trying to steward what God is doing without drifting into self-reliance, may this conversation renew your dependence on Jesus, expand your imagination for multiplication, and strengthen your courage to call leaders forward.

Show Notes

• Hope Bible Church Oakville
• Give to The Pastorate’s Year End Campaign
• Emerging Leaders Lab Application
• Spring Pastors Retreat

Partners

• Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church. 
• We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠⁠give⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church⁠.

Five years into planting The Way Church in Vancouver and five years into The Pastorate, Jason steps into the guest chair to reflect on what he’s seeing in the Canadian church and what gives him real hope for pastors today. In this role-reversal episode, Jordan interviews Jason about his life as a local pastor, the story behind The Pastorate, and why he still wants to serve pastors as a practitioner, not a commentator.

Jordan and Jason talk about:

• How Jason’s pastoral curiosity shapes the way he hosts the podcast and listens to guests,
• Planting The Way Church during the pandemic and how that journey has run alongside The Pastorate’s first five years,
• A concrete story of church revitalization through The Way’s “marriage” with Sutherland Church in North Vancouver, and what it meant for legacy, humility, and hope,
• The current pastoral landscape in Canada: a shortage of pastors, but a deep hunger, especially among younger leaders, for character, depth, and a real life with God,
• The power of small pastoral cohorts and friendships: sharing burdens, praying together, rejoicing and mourning with one another, as a key to staying in ministry for the long haul,
• What’s next for The Pastorate: retreats, cohorts, city meetups, and the dream of a national gathering that centres on Jesus and the renewal of the church in Canada.

The episode ends with Jason speaking directly to pastors, a reminder that God’s kingdom is at hand, that shepherding a local church is costly and precious work, and that one day in the new creation, the unseen faithfulness of ordinary pastors and congregations will matter more than we can even begin to imagine.

Show Notes

• Alex and Caleb’s Story | a film by The Pastorate
• Aaron’s Story | a film by The Pastorate
• The Way Church
• The Way College
• Give to The Pastorate’s Year End Campaign
• Emerging Leaders Lab Application

Partners

We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠give⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church.

Special thanks to the Canadian Bible Society for making this episode possible. We invite you to explore their ⁠Bible Course⁠ to help your church grow in Scripture engagement.

Nestor Abdon is a Filipino-Canadian pastor serving as Global & Local Outreach Pastor at Bramalea Baptist Church in Brampton, Ontario. Having ministered among newcomers, refugees, and diaspora churches across Canada, Nestor carries a deep passion for hospitality, multicultural mission, and the vital contribution of diaspora communities to the life and future of the church in Canada.

In this conversation, Nestor traces his journey from growing up in the Philippines to arriving in Canada in 2010, pastoring within a Filipino church, serving at a refugee centre, and eventually leading newcomers and diaspora ministries at large churches in the Toronto area. His life and ministry have been shaped by the conviction that migration is not just a social reality but a biblical lens, that God is gathering the nations in Canadian cities, and that welcoming newcomers is central to the church’s participation in the gospel today.

Together, Nestor and Jason explore:

• How Nestor’s own experience as a newcomer to Canada shaped his pastoral calling among immigrants, refugees, and international students,
• Practical ways churches can embody hospitality, through ESL programs, settlement partnerships, shared meals, and newcomer fellowships,
• The importance of a listening posture and intercultural competence in majority-culture churches, rather than rushing to fix problems without hearing people’s actual needs,
• The unique role and strengths of diaspora and ethnic monocultural churches within the wider “gospel ecology” of Canadian cities,
• How majority-culture churches can move diaspora leaders from the margins to the centre, offering real voice, leadership, and shared decision-making,
• The tensions and possibilities of first and second generation dynamics, and why second-generation immigrants can serve as “cultural bridges” for the church,
• What it means to contextualize the gospel across cultures and why diaspora Christians give Nestor deep hope for the future of the church in Canada.

Nestor speaks with warmth and a reflective wisdom formed in the overlap of the academy and local church. His story invites pastors to see their city as a global mission field, to make room for diaspora leaders at the table, and to embrace the beautiful, diverse foretaste of Revelation 7 that God is already bringing to life in Canada.

Show Notes

• Nestor’s Book: Marginality of Visible Minorities in Canada
• Jason Georges Book: The 3d Gospel
• Bramlea Baptist Church
• Give to The Pastorate’s Year End Campaign
• Lead Pastor Fellowship Application
• Emerging Leaders Lab Application

Partners

Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church.

In today’s episode, Derrick Miller invites us into the story of Makers Church in San Diego and the co-vocational calling that’s shaped his life as both pastor and firefighter. Derrick shares how a surprising “church marriage” with a 100-year-old congregation, neighborhood change, and a multi-million-dollar building renovation have forced him and his team to slow down, listen carefully to the Spirit, and rethink what sustainable leadership actually looks like. Along the way, he offers a lived picture of priesthood-of-all-believers, where every follower of Jesus is sent into their workplace, street, and city as a full participant in God’s mission.

In this conversation Jason and Derrick talk about:

• The origin story of Makers Church and how Derrick’s firefighter calling shaped their co-vocational model,
• How a young church plant “married” a 100-year-old congregation, and inherited a spiritual legacy, not just a building,
• How neighbourhood change and selling church-owned homes opened the door for new mission and a major renovation,
• The shift from pastor-led decisions to communal discernment, elder leadership, and governance that reflects real church life,
• Why co-vocational ministry is about more than budgets and how it reframes staffing, power, and how we view congregants as sent ones,
• Practical ways pastors can affirm everyday work as mission and equip people to live as the church where they live, work, and play.

Derrick offers a hopeful and grounded vision for pastors wrestling with limited resources, changing neighbourhoods, and questions about what’s next for their church. Whether you’re leading in a rented gym, renovating a century-old sanctuary, or simply tired of feeling like everything depends on you, may this conversation expand your imagination, ease some pressure, and help you see your people, and their everyday work, as central to the kingdom story God is writing in your city.

Show Notes

• ⁠Makers Church – San Diego, CA⁠ 
• ⁠Lead Pastor Fellowship Application⁠
• ⁠Emerging Leaders Lab Application⁠

Partners

We couldn’t do the work we do at The Pastorate without your generous support. We invite you to pray, share, and ⁠⁠give⁠⁠ towards seeding a hope-filled future for the Canadian church.

Contact ⁠John Wright at Generis⁠ for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church.

In today’s episode, Darrell Johnson opens his journal and his toolkit, sharing how a hard year has softened his pastoral heart and how a simple morning liturgy that includes journaling, reading Scripture, and listing notes of gratitude have helped refresh his soul. Darrell invites us into his new book, an Advent reader titled Awaken Wonder, and shares six practical frameworks for preaching through Advent that he invites pastors to glean from and borrow. Darrell helps us imagine Advent preaching that’s both bold and deeply formative.

In this conversation Jason and Darrell talk about:

• Darrell’s morning rhythm that sustains tender heartedness,
• Why Christmas is history, not myth, along with a helpful guide to chronological reading of the Christmas story,
• Darrell’s new book Awaken Wonder, and the four-week outline it provides for preaching Advent,
• Practical help for solo pastors through six ready-to-preach Advent frameworks,
• How to give ethical and freeing attribution when we use sources to inform our preaching.

Darrell offers us a timely invitation to preach Advent with clarity and courage, and a helpful roadmap that will help those who are still figuring out what they will preach this Advent. Whether you’re mapping a four-week series or just searching for Sunday’s next faithful step, may this conversation steady your heart, spark courage, and help you lead your people to wonder at Jesus’ coming.

Show Notes

Darrell Johnson’s Website - https://www.darrelljohnson.ca

Order Awaken Wonder - https://a.co/d/fbKOL1u

Lead Pastor Fellowship Application - https://www.thepastorate.ca/lpf

Emerging Leaders Lab Application - https://www.thepastorate.ca/lab

Guest Biography

Darrell W. Johnson has been preaching Jesus Christ and His Gospel for over 50 years. He has served a number of Presbyterian congregations in California, Union Church of Manila in the Philippines, and the historic First Baptist Church in the heart of Vancouver, Canada. He has taught preaching for Fuller Theological Seminary, Carey Theological College in Vancouver, and Regent College in Vancouver. He has authored eight books, including The Glory of Preaching and Discipleship on the Edge: An Expository Journey Through Revelation. ‍He is currently serving as a pastor at The Way Church and The Pastorate Ministries Canada. ‍He and his wife Sharon have been married over 50 years. Together they have raised four children adopted from four different countries of the world, and now enjoy loving 11 active grandchildren.

Partners

Special thanks to Generis for helping us make this episode happen. Contact John Wright at Generis for help cultivating a culture of generosity in your church. - https://generis.com/team/jon-wright

The work of strengthening pastors across Canada is only possible because of generous partners like you. As we look to the future, would you consider joining us in prayer, sharing this episode, or ⁠making a gift to invest in a vibrant, Jesus-centered church in every community⁠? - https://thepastorate.ca/give.