• 54 minutes 18 seconds
    The New Type II Fun: Public Land Advocacy (Live at The Rut!)

    Live in Big Sky! This episode is a live panel I moderated this past September at The Rut Mountain Runs in Big Sky, Montana, presented by Trust for Public Land and The North Face.

    If you're not familiar with The Rut, it's one of the premier trail running festivals in the country. It's three full days of racing, from an 11K all the way up to a super-challenging 50K with about 10,500 feet of climbing and descending. There's even a 1K "Runt Run" for the kiddos. But what makes it all so special is the people. Pros, weekend warriors and families are all out there together, and the vibe is fun, welcoming and humble. I've been to a lot of trail races over the years, and I can honestly say this was the most welcoming one I've experienced anywhere.

    That's no surprise, because The Rut was co-founded and is directed by Mike Foote. Mike was a guest on the show years ago and has since become a good friend. He's one of the most thoughtful, kind and inclusive people I know, and he brings a conservation ethic to everything he does. This year he and his team even launched The Rut Grants, a program that funds the people and places that give life to the sport of trail running.

    That made The Rut the perfect setting for a conversation with some of the West's most effective conservation practitioners and thinkers about the threats our public lands are facing and what we can do about them. It was an all-star panel: Olivia Amber, ultrarunner for The North Face; Dillon Osleger, author of the excellent book Trail Work,; Hilary Eisen, Federal Policy Director at Wild Montana; and David Weinstein, Northern Rockies Director at Trust for Public Land. We dug into everything from the Roadless Rule rollback to Forest Service staffing cuts to last year's attempt to sell off public lands, and what actually moves the needle with elected officials.

    I'm releasing this one around the 2026 midterms, and hopefully this election cycle will be a positive one for public lands. The threats to public lands rise and fall with different administrations, but they never fully stop. f you've listened to my conversations with historians of the West, you know these fights go back to the days of Theodore Roosevelt, and they've continued right up to today. They take different forms from decade to decade, but the threats are always looming. So as people who love these places, we need to stay vigilant, stay engaged and be willing to speak up. That can mean submitting public comments, calling your elected officials, donating to nonprofits doing the work or volunteering your time. But the harsh reality is that whatever you do, you need be prepared to do it for the rest of your life, because these threats are not going to stop.

    On a lighter note, I'd really encourage you to pick a race at The Rut and go. It's a great celebration of the mountains, endurance sports and good people. Registration for 2027 opens on January 12th, 2027, at 8 a.m. Mountain Time, and it sells out fast, so mark your calendar. You can find everything at runtherut.com.

    A big thanks to Mike and the whole Rut team for inviting me up to moderate. And thanks to our panelists for sharing their wisdom and for the work they do every day to protect the West's wide-open spaces.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, Patagonia Books, the Mighty Arrow Family Foundation for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing The Rut Mountain Runs
    • 4:27 - Mike Foote introducing Ed and the panel
    • 6:18 - Ed on M&P's mission and panelist introductions
    • 9:39 - The threats
    • 16:52 - What's keeping David up at night
    • 21:01 - Things the outdoor industry could do better
    • 24:39 - What a trail means for a community
    • 29:04 - If everyone agrees, why do we keep talking about this?
    • 33:35 - Moving the needle
    • 37:27 - Audience question, how do we use our money?
    • 42:23 - Audience question, how do we be proactive?
    • 49:20 - Audience question, hope out of the restructuring chaos?

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    3 November 2026, 11:25 pm
  • 1 hour 20 minutes
    Carrie Besnette Hauser – Lessons from a Life Serving People and Places

    Dr. Carrie Besnette Hauser is President and CEO of the Trust for Public Land, a national nonprofit that does everything from massive landscape protection projects to pocket parks in big cities, all built around a simple idea: land for people. I've wanted to have Carrie on the podcast for a long time, and we finally made it happen in person at El Pomar's Penrose House here in Colorado Springs. She's one of the most accomplished, grounded, and genuinely fun people I've talked to in a while, and her résumé is so packed I honestly don't know how she's fit it all into one career.

    Carrie grew up in Flagstaff, Arizona, hiking into the Grand Canyon with her dad, which eventually led to summers working for one of the canyon's most storied river companies. She planned on law school but instead earned a PhD in higher education public policy at UCLA. From there, she was one of the first employees to help build the Daniels Fund from scratch, served in leadership at Metropolitan State University of Denver, and spent nearly 11 years as President and CEO of Colorado Mountain College. Along the way, she chaired the Colorado Parks and Wildlife Commission during wolf reintroduction planning and somehow found time to climb all of Colorado's 14ers.

    Carrie and I talked about growing up in Flagstaff, the lessons she learned helping build one of the largest foundations in the Rockies, and how she stays grounded in roles that come with real influence. We dug into what makes Colorado Mountain College so unique, what she learned about the urban/rural divide while chairing CPW, TPL's goal of putting every American within a 10-minute walk of a park, its incredible schoolyard transformation work, and Colorado's Proposition 137, which voters will decide on in just a few days. We wrapped up with some great book recommendations, including a couple from Ken Salazar and Kevin Fedarko. I really enjoyed this one, and I think you will too. Enjoy!

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, Patagonia Books, the Mighty Arrow Family Foundation for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Dr. Carrie Besnette Hauser
    • 3:27 - Growing up in Flagstaff
    • 9:33 - College plan
    • 18:53 - What Carrie learned
    • 25:57 - Staying grounded
    • 30:21 - Colorado Mountain College
    • 36:01 - Making mountain communities run
    • 42:49 - Being there for the community
    • 46:15 - Leaving the college
    • 51:11 - The value of a park
    • 59:01 - The benefits of a schoolyard
    • 1:02:37 - Prop 137
    • 1:08:05 - It just makes sense
    • 1:10:06 - Book recs
    • 1:17:03 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    28 October 2026, 10:41 pm
  • 1 hour 20 minutes
    Riverhorse Nakadate: Love Is All That Matters (M&P READS episode!)

    Riverhorse Nakadate is a writer, Patagonia ambassador, conservationist, and canoe-paddling, fly-fishing, bird-loving, self-described tree hugger. He's also the author of the book "Water Lines: A Life on Marshes, Rivers, Seas and in the Rain." Riverhorse and I have been trading emails for years, so it was a real treat to finally meet in person when he came through Boulder on his book tour. He's one of the warmest people I've met in a long time; and I felt like I was chatting with an old friend. This conversation also marks the launch of something new: M&P Reads, the Mountain & Prairie book club. The idea is simple: I sit down with the author of a book I love, we have our normal podcast conversation, and then I ask them a few questions sent in by readers like you. I couldn't think of a better guest to kick things off.

    Riverhorse was born in Texas to a teenage mom who went on to practice medicine, become a mountain climber, and live as an off-the-grid wild woman. At age five he was adopted by his father, a Stanford literature PhD who took classes from Wallace Stegner. Summers at the family's fishing cabin on the Oregon coast turned him into a surfer, and his writing eventually took him to the University of Iowa, then to a decade as a staff writer for Surfing magazine, and later to the pages of The Flyfish Journal. His films Love and Water and Northern Light, which documents his 200-mile paddle to fight a proposed copper mine in Minnesota's Boundary Waters and later aired on PBS, brought his voice to a much wider audience. Water Lines gathers stories from a lifetime spent on Texas salt marshes, rivers, oceans, and wilderness lakes, illustrated with 24 beautiful paintings based on Riverhorse's own photos. Fly fishing runs through the book, but as Riverhorse says, it's just the vehicle. "Water Lines" is really about love, community, family, and standing up for the wild places and people you care about.

    Riverhorse and I talked about how the book came together, from his stacks of journals to the art to the long and winding editing process with Patagonia. We talked about his time at the University of Iowa playing water polo, how he stays calm when a flood is barreling down the Black Canyon of the Gunnison, and how being a lifelong pacifist fits together with being willing to fight for what you love. We discussed his mom, his take on news and social media, his work to protect the Boundary Waters, the dangerous shark-finning story he reported along the Rio Grande, and his friendships with Andrew Luck, JT Van Zandt, and Alvin Dedeaux. We also talked a lot about books, including John Muir's lesser-known "A Thousand-Mile Walk to the Gulf." Then we turned to your questions, covering which river Riverhorse would paddle to recreate Goodbye to a River, whether he wrote the book with the fly fishing crowd in mind, and how everyday people can treat wilderness as a necessity rather than a luxury.

    This was such a fun one, and be sure to click through to the episode notes to grab a copy of "Water Lines." Enjoy!

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, Patagonia Books, the Mighty Arrow Family Foundation for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Riverhorse Nakadate and highlighting M&P's new book club
    • 7:07 - A deep love for books (and for Ed!)
    • 9:02 - The book's artwork
    • 10:59 - Journaling and Iowa
    • 12:51 - Surfing phase
    • 16:07 - Chill in the flood
    • 18:01 - A wild woman
    • 20:31 - Pranks
    • 22:29 - Mindfulness
    • 26:53 - Locals only
    • 28:45 - Holding your ground
    • 29:53 - News sources
    • 32:26 - Yvon admiration
    • 35:40 - Boundary Waters
    • 37:11 - Tony
    • 40:56 - Not a fly fishing book
    • 44:43 - No fear (or maybe a little)
    • 48:10 - Andrew Locke
    • 50:41 - Kind humans
    • 55:56 - Book club questions
    • 1:02:37 - Book talk
    • 1:04:52 - Opening a gift on-air
    • 1:09:14 - The (long) path to the book
    • 1:14:57 - Book club Q's (from Italy!)
    • 1:18:12 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    20 October 2026, 5:14 pm
  • 1 hour 8 minutes
    Olivia Amber – On Chosen and Unchosen Suffering

    Olivia Amber is a professional ultrarunner, climber, and adventurer, and a North Face sponsored athlete based in Bishop, California. I met Olivia at The Rut Mountain Runs in Big Sky, where she was on a public lands panel I moderated. She was also there to talk about her biggest project to date: Norman's 13. Norman's 13 is a route, a link-up of all thirteen of the Sierra's 14,000-foot peaks. It's more than 100 miles with over 40,000 feet of climbing, much of it exposed, off-trail, fifth-class scrambling. Last September, Olivia did the whole thing in one non-stop push, finishing in about 89 hours and becoming the first woman to complete it. The North Face made a short film about that effort, also called "Norman's 13," and I'll link to it in the show notes. And earlier this summer, Olivia and her friend and fellow North Face athlete Erika Flowers set the fastest known time on Granite Peak, the highest point in Montana.

    Olivia grew up in a tiny village in the woods of northern Wisconsin, the daughter of two schoolteachers who spent their summers road-tripping around the country with Olivia and her older sister. She went on to become an All-American Nordic skier at Colby College, and after graduation she made the hard decision to not pursue pro skiing. Instead, she began working in the corporate world in San Francisco, where the Bay Area trail running community pulled her in and she began to make a name for herself in the world of ultrarunning. Along the way she has dealt with serious health challenges, including a diagnosis of stage four endometriosis, which she speaks about openly and honestly.

    In this conversation, we talk about her upbringing and her college years, and about her idea that choosing to suffer is a privilege, because she has become acquainted with the kind of suffering you don't choose. We get into how she thinks about risk and ego on technical terrain, what she looks for in a mountain adventure partner, her upcoming trip to Bhutan for the Snowman Race, and the Wallace Stegner book she has reread more than any other. As you can probably tell by now Olivia is a hardcore athlete, but she's also incredibly humble, down-to-earth and funny– the exact kind of person I love talking to on the podcast. There's a link to "Norman's 13" in the show notes, and you should absolutely watch it.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Olivia Amber and highlighting MIRASOL
    • 6:42 - Growing up in Wisconsin
    • 8:40 - Congregating at the local school
    • 11:20 - Endurance sports activated
    • 13:39 - Finding passion in difficulty
    • 15:30 - Olivia in high school and college
    • 20:21 - D1
    • 22:13 - All-American designation
    • 25:13 - Moving away from professional skiing
    • 27:34 - Athletics + corporate world
    • 29:48 - San Francisco running community
    • 32:58 - Going hard core
    • 35:06 - Health scares
    • 39:39 - The privilege of elective suffering
    • 45:07 - The North Face and Norman's 13
    • 51:26 - Not afraid
    • 57:24 - Credit roll
    • 59:50 - What to look for in an adventure partner
    • 1:02:47 - Upcoming projects
    • 1:03:56 - Book recs
    • 1:05:37 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    29 September 2026, 9:52 pm
  • 1 hour 31 minutes
    Dan Flores – A Deep Dive into the History of the Natural West

    Dan Flores is back for another visit on the podcast. If you're a fan of the history of the American West, then Dan is no stranger—he's the author of many of my favorite books, including American Serengeti, Coyote America, and Wild New World. Most recently, he wrapped up a 42-episode series with the MeatEater network called The American West with Dan Flores, covering everything from bison and wolves to the origins of our public lands and what it means to belong to a place. It's the closest most of us will get to sitting in one of Dan's university classes, and I can't recommend it highly enough.

    Dan is Professor spent much of his academic career at the University of Montana, but he's always been less interested in the Old West of cattle drives and gunfights than in what he calls the natural West—the landscapes, animals, Native people, and ideas that make this region unlike anywhere else. He grew up in Louisiana, a place with almost no public land, and spent the 1970s looking for a foothold in the real West. He found three: the canyon country outside Lubbock, Montana's Bitterroot Valley, and the Galisteo Valley south of Santa Fe, where he and his wife, Dr. Sara Dant, live today. In each place, he dug in, learned the country, and went to work restoring it.

    As expected, we covered a ton in this episode: We started with the story behind The American West series and how a decades-long friendship with Steven Rinella finally turned into 42 episodes. We discussed the biggest epiphany Dan had while making it—that for those of us living here now, the public lands matter far more than the frontier ever did. Dan traces the origins of public lands back to George Perkins Marsh, a wildly influential public intellectual most of us have never heard of, and forward through John Wesley Powell, the first forest reserves, and the end of homesteading in the 1930s. We dug into Theodore Roosevelt's transformation from a young man who rushed to Dakota Territory to kill a buffalo before they were all gone into a president willing to break with his own Gilded Age class to protect the landscapes and wildlife he loved. We also talked about repeat photography and the staggering disappearance of the glaciers in Glacier National Park, the willful destruction of Western wildlife, bioregionalism and rewilding on a scale that any of us can manage, and a few book recommendations to round it out.

    Be sure to check the episode notes for links to everything we discussed, including the full American West series and the new 2026 edition of Coyote America. Dan is as generous with his time and wisdom as anyone I know, and I always come away from these conversations with a longer reading list and a better understanding of this place.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Dan Flores and highlighting the Rye Resurgence Project
    • 7:24 - From writing to audio
    • 13:10 - The natural West
    • 20:01 - Aha! moments
    • 28:41 - George Perkins Marsh
    • 44:43 - Animal eradication
    • 52:31 - Teddy Roosevelt deep-dive
    • 1:05:18 - Place
    • 1:13:56 - Rewilding the Bitterroot
    • 1:20:12 - Rewilding on your own scale
    • 1:23:06 - Book recs and wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    22 September 2026, 10:05 pm
  • 1 hour 3 minutes
    Fitz Cahall - Going on the Offense for Public Lands

    Fitz Cahall is the creator of the legendary outdoor podcast The Dirtbag Diaries, co-founder of the creative agency Duct Tape Then Beer, and author of the excellent book States of Adventure. But most recently, he's gone from prolific creative mind to public lands advocate with the launch of Save Public Lands, a campaign that gives public land lovers of all stripes, from climbers to hunters, a way to go on the offense against the ongoing attacks on our public lands. The goal is a million signatures on a short letter with three clear demands: no more sell-offs, no more giveaways to foreign companies and billionaires, and no more backroom deals. Those signatures get delivered to DC and statehouses around Public Lands Day on September 26th. Partners include Outdoor Alliance, Backcountry Hunters & Anglers, MeatEater, The Conservation Alliance, and The Wilderness Society.

    Fitz got his start in the mid-2000s scraping by as a freelance journalist, a job he refers to as "naked subsistence hunting." In 2007, he took a few stories that hadn't sold and turned them into a podcast. He emailed it to 30 friends. The next day 30 people had listened, then 300, then 3,000. Nearly 20 years later, he and his wife and creative partner Becca have built Duct Tape Then Beer into a story studio behind award-winning films and podcasts, all guided by one rule: the work has to strengthen people's connections to the natural world and to each other.

    We talked about how Save Public Lands came together, why Fitz chose offense over defense, and how a coalition this politically diverse—hunters, climbers, skiers, veterans, and legacy conservation groups—managed to find common ground and rally around a shared goal. Then we lightened it up and got into his creative life, including why he treats creative work like a band rather than a solo act, how he and Becca avoided chasing money for its own sake, what he does when his enthusiasm dips, and why he believes doubt and optimism are far more powerful together than either one alone.

    It's worth noting I consider Fitz a role model in a lot of ways, and I don't think Mountain & Prairie would exist without his example. I've been listening to The Dirtbag Diaries since the days when you had to download podcasts onto your computer, load them onto your iPod, then plug the iPod into the tape deck in your truck to listen. That's exactly what I was doing back then, driving around trying to sell real estate, and those stories cracked open a whole way of living and working that I didn't know was available to me. So thank you, Fitz, for all of it.

    There's a link below to sign the letter. It takes about 20 seconds, so there's no excuse not to do it. I loved this conversation, and I hope you enjoy.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Fitz Cahall and highlighting Patagonia books
    • 7:45 - Jumping right into Save Public Lands
    • 13:22 - Going on the offense
    • 18:05 - Partnerships for public lands
    • 22:30 - The money
    • 29:32 - How people can help
    • 32:40 - And how orgs can help
    • 33:56 - Fitz's creative life
    • 39:42 - Evolving as a collaborator
    • 43:12 - States of Adventure
    • 46:26 - Keeping values intact
    • 50:22 - Dealing with the dips
    • 54:32 - Book recs
    • 59:48 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    14 September 2026, 11:45 pm
  • 1 hour 21 minutes
    T.A. Barron - Naming Nature, Choosing Optimism, and Using Our Time Well

    T.A. Barron—known as Tom to his friends—is a renowned author, a lifelong conservationist, and someone whose work sits at the intersection of two subjects that are near and dear to my heart: books and the natural world. Tom has written more than 30 books, including the internationally bestselling Merlin Saga, and his newest book, "Naming Nature: A Cabinet of Natural Curiosities for Word Lovers," gave us the perfect excuse to finally sit down together. It's a beautiful, fascinating exploration of the stories behind the names we give to plants, animals, and other parts of the natural world, and I think it's a must-read for anyone who loves nature and loves words—which probably describes most people listening to this podcast. Tom is also a deeply committed conservationist who has spent decades supporting and leading conservation efforts, so as you can imagine, we had plenty to talk about.

    Tom grew up first in New England and then on a ranch north of Colorado Springs, where watching the surrounding landscape disappear to development helped shape his conservation ethic at an early age. After Princeton and a Rhodes Scholarship at Oxford, he initially pursued a career in business in New York City, while waking up at four or four-thirty every morning to write before work. Eventually he realized that those early-morning hours were the happiest part of his day, so despite having already endured plenty of rejection as a young writer, he left a successful business career, moved back to Colorado, and gave writing another shot. More than 30 books later, I think it's safe to say that gamble worked out. Along the way, conservation has remained a central part of his life, including his longtime involvement with The Wilderness Society and many other conservation organizations and initiatives.

    Tom and I talked about his adventurous parents, his childhood in Colorado, his spectacular early failures as a writer, and the decision to walk away from a successful career to pursue the work that made him feel most alive. We talked about mortality and the importance of using our limited time well; managing the constant barrage of news and social media; optimism, wonder, and our shared love of the natural world; and how Tom became so deeply involved in conservation. And, of course, we dug into "Naming Nature" and some of the wonderfully strange stories behind names like hellbender, sarcastic fringehead, narwhal, praying mantis, elephant, and even the Yeti. We also talked about why names matter, how paying closer attention can lead to caring, and how caring can ultimately lead to conservation. This was a fun, wide-ranging conversation with a thoughtful and endlessly curious guy, and I think you'll really enjoy it.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing T.A. Barron and highlighting the Rye Resurgence Project
    • 6:49 - Growing up
    • 12:47 - Tom's early writing career
    • 16:46 - Oxford days to first novel
    • 21:53 - The work that goes into rejection
    • 24:56 - Plan B, 10 years later
    • 29:18 - Keeping mortality in mind
    • 35:10 - Good and bad tools
    • 37:51 - His first book on the shelf
    • 41:21 - Getting into conservation
    • 48:02 - The new book
    • 53:52 - Where the word "sarcastic" came from
    • 56:31 - And a few more fun word examples
    • 1:02:52 - The capacity to name
    • 1:04:19 - The Yeti
    • 1:07:38 - Cultivating stewardship
    • 1:11:11 - Book recs
    • 1:15:33 - Wrapping up (and a reading of Elephant)

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    3 September 2026, 11:10 pm
  • 1 hour 20 minutes
    Kim Wiggins – The Courage to Be Original

    Kim Wiggins is a world-renowned painter from New Mexico, and one of the most recognizable artists working in the American West today. His bold, swirling canvases have made him one of the leading artistic voices of what's come to be called the New West. His work hangs in the Autry, the Booth, and the American Museum of Western Art in Denver, and this past year he won Best in Show at the Prix de West, the most prestigious award in Western art, becoming the first modernist ever to take it home.

    Kim comes by all of this honestly. Both sides of his family came west in covered wagons in the late 1800s and settled into ranching along the Pecos River. His mother was running two ranches and a nightclub in Arizona by her mid-twenties; his father was a photojournalist for Life and Sports Illustrated, and a bush pilot who once had to sprint back to his plane in the Amazon and count the arrows in the side of the fuselage. Kim grew up surrounded by creativity– Thomas Hart Benton paged through his sketchbook and he ate lunch with Georgia O'Keeffe at Ghost Ranch. He began focusing seriously on painting while stationed in Europe with the military and soon became the youngest member of the Society of American Impressionists — a career most artists would give an arm for, and one he walked away from completely.

    We talk about why he walked away, which starts with a moment at a show in St. Louis when he spotted one of his paintings across the room, hurried over, and discovered it wasn't his. We cover the lean years that followed, including knocking on doors in Lubbock in the summer heat with a car full of paintings. And we get into the ideas behind the work: why a loss of innovation is the death knell of a civilization, why he watches children in galleries instead of collectors, the paintings he made for the NAACP after his son asked him a question he couldn't answer, and his conviction that a gift, by definition, belongs to someone else. I first met Kim back in 2022 at Maxwell Alexander Gallery's ten-year show, where he was on a panel I moderated, and I've wanted a longer conversation ever since. Hope you enjoy.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Kim Wiggins
    • 3:44 - Wiggins' family history
    • 9:49 - Kim's dad's photojournalism travels
    • 12:44 - Parental pressure?
    • 17:07 - Military education
    • 20:36 - Money v. creativity
    • 28:36 - Making the decision to change course
    • 34:52 - When things started to work
    • 38:42 - It's never about Kim
    • 43:47 - Continuous evolution
    • 49:44 - How Kim's paintings come together
    • 53:10 - Inspiration from his son
    • 58:45 - Collaborative projects
    • 1:04:26 - Blood and Thunder
    • 1:06:21 - All the circles aligning
    • 1:11:03 - How art has changed in the West
    • 1:14:00 - Book recs
    • 1:17:47 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    28 August 2026, 6:14 pm
  • 12 minutes 43 seconds
    Announcing MOUNTAIN & PRAIRE READS! Featuring "Water Lines" by Riverhorse Nakadate

    Introducing Mountain & Prairie Reads—a book club for people who don't want to sit through another Zoom call.

    Every other month or so, I'll recommend a book I think is worth your time. Read it, send me your questions, and then I'll sit down with the author and ask as many of your best questions as I can.

    Our first selection is Water Lines: A Life on Marshes, Rivers, Seas and in the Rain by Riverhorse Nakadate. I'll be interviewing Riverhorse on September 30, so grab a copy, start reading, and submit your questions by September 29.

    Read a great book. Ask the author a question. Listen to the answer.

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

    21 August 2026, 8:40 pm
  • 1 hour 21 minutes
    Romey Swanson — The Work of Finding Common Ground

    Romey Swanson is the Executive Director of the Devils River Conservancy, and he wears a lot of other hats too—wildlife biologist, naturalist, writer, photographer, and a leader in just about every corner of the Texas conservation world. The Devils River is generally considered the most pristine stream in Texas, and maybe in the entire Southwest—remote, spring-fed, and held together entirely by private landowners. The county it runs through leads all 254 counties in Texas in privately conserved acres, and none of it was required by regulation. If you've ever wondered how conservation gets done in a place with almost no public land, Romey and his community have built a model worth paying attention to.

    Romey grew up in rural West Virginia as part of what he calls the last generation of feral children—turned loose outside with instructions to be home before dark, with the creek behind the house as his best friend. His family moved to Texas when he was in junior high, and like most teenagers, he traded all of that for sports and a social life. He was a first-generation college student headed toward sports medicine when he walked past a flyer at Texas State advertising a Wildlife Society meeting—free pizza and live animals. He went for the pizza, met a faculty advisor, and changed his major that week.

    I've known Romey for six or seven years, and we cover a lot of ground here—his early days filling deer feeders and checking bird nest boxes, why he says waiting tables taught him as much about this work as his degrees, and whether leadership can actually be taught. We get into the threats facing the Devils River—data centers, transmission lines, and energy projects that can undo decades of voluntary conservation—and his work with the mountain lion stakeholder group in Texas, which has some obvious parallels to the wolf situation here in Colorado. There's also a good stretch on his passion projects, including his owl research in the mountains of far West Texas, and why he decided to use social media to push out something positive instead of more conflict. We wrap up with a few book recommendations and his encouragement to all of us to just pay attention. I loved this conversation... Enjoy!

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Romey Swanson and highlighting Cattlemen's
    • 6:30 - Romey describes his work
    • 10:16 - How he got into his work
    • 14:42 - Texas pride
    • 17:37 - Early Romey
    • 21:30 - First leadership opportunity
    • 29:34 - Devils River Conservancy
    • 35:07 - Keeping the land magical
    • 39:14 - Devils River moving forward
    • 42:25 - Mountain lions in Texas and wolves in CO
    • 56:26 - Ways to keep track
    • 1:01:15 - Sending folks to Romey's podcast
    • 1:08:40 - Romey's Instagram
    • 1:12:27 - Book recs
    • 1:17:23 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    7 August 2026, 9:08 pm
  • 1 hour 8 minutes
    Mike Bartolo — Soil, Science, and Selflessness

    Dr. Mike Bartolo is a third-generation farmer from Pueblo County, Colorado, and a retired research scientist and vegetable crops specialist at Colorado State University. Mike's grandparents immigrated from Italy in the early 1900s to work in the mines around Pueblo, and after years of backbreaking labor, they saved enough to buy a small farm on the St. Charles Mesa—the beginning of a family legacy on the land that continues to this day. Mike went on to spend more than three decades at CSU serving the farmers of the Arkansas Valley, and while he'd never claim the title himself, many consider him the developer of the legendary Pueblo Chile.

    I first met Mike back in 2018 through our mutual work with Palmer Land Conservancy, and ever since, I've seen him as a mentor when it comes to matters of water, farmland conservation, long-term thinking, and kindness. His combination of scientific expertise, tireless work ethic, deep humility, and fierce devotion to his family and community is something I've rarely encountered. Mike is also one of the main characters profiled in the poignant and powerful Ben Knight documentary MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, which chronicles Pueblo County's farming community and its fight to protect its land and water—so it was an honor to finally sit down with him for this long-overdue conversation.

    We started with the remarkable story of his grandparents—including his grandfather Rocco, who survived being a prisoner of war in World War I before returning to Colorado to break rocks for the steel industry—and how that generation's sacrifice continues to guide Mike today. We talked about his childhood on the family farm, where he and his five siblings turned every chore into an Olympic competition, and his path to becoming a plant scientist at CSU. We discussed what makes Pueblo County's farmland world-class, the cautionary tale of Crowley County's devastating water sales, and why Mike believes educating and mobilizing the public is the key to protecting the Arkansas Valley's water. We also dug into the history of the Pueblo Chile, as well as the making of "MIRASOL," his approach to passionate-but-respectful advocacy, the spiritual connection he feels to the soil, his advice for the next generation of farmers, and much more.

    This was such a meaningful conversation for me, and I know you'll enjoy getting to know Mike as much as I have. Enjoy!

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    THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:

    Mountain & Prairie is listener supported via Patreon, and brought to you with support from the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust, MIRASOL: Looking at the Sun, Patagonia Books, the Rye Resurgence Project for their generous sponsorship.

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    TOPICS DISCUSSED:

    • 0:00 - Introducing Mike Bartolo and highlighting MIRASOL
    • 7:03 - Reconnecting with Mike
    • 8:16 - Mike's grandparents
    • 12:14 - A particular kind of work ethic
    • 17:28 - Growing up competitive
    • 20:01 - Developing expertise
    • 23:30 - Farmland development
    • 28:33 - Pueblo County
    • 30:56 - Colorado water
    • 36:27 - Solutions?
    • 40:57 - MIRASOL
    • 45:20 - The Pueblo Chile
    • 51:06 - Being an advocate
    • 55:58 - Mike's advice to younger folks
    • 59:03 - Time spent now
    • 1:00:51 - Book (or video) recs and anthropology inspo
    • 1:06:07 - Wrapping up

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    ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

    23 July 2026, 5:59 pm
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