Decoder with Nilay Patel

The Verge

A business show about big ideas — and other problems.

  • 1 hour 9 minutes
    Why CEO Matt Garman is willing to bet AWS on AI

    Today, I’m talking with Matt Garman, the CEO of Amazon Web Services. Matt took over as CEO last June — you might recall that we had his predecessor Adam Selipsky on the show just over a year ago. That makes this episode terrific Decoder bait, since I love hearing how new CEOs will decide what to change and what to keep going after they’ve settled into their role.


    Links: 

    • There’s no AI without the cloud, says AWS CEO Adam Selipsky | Decoder
    • Amazon's AWS to invest $11 bln in Georgia to boost AI infrastructure | Reuters
    • Netflix’s Ted Sarandos responds to Jake Paul-Mike Tyson glitches | THR
    • The furious contest to unseat Nvidia as king of AI chips | NYT
    • Amazon’s moonshot plan to rival Nvidia in AI chips | Bloomberg
    • Amazon invests another $4 billion in Anthropic | The Verge
    • Why Netflix never goes down | The Verge
    • Sam Altman lowers the bar for AGI | The Verge


    Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/24102212


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    13 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 1 hour 1 minute
    Studying online bad behavior was hard. It's going to get harder in Trump 2.0

    Hello, Nilay here. We’re still on winter break; we’ll be back with brand-new Decoder interviews next week, and with our Thursday shows later this month. I’m excited for what we’ve got in the pipeline. I think you’re going to love it.


    For today, though, we’re sharing an episode of Peter Kafka’s new show Channels – he’s talking to disinformation researcher Renee DiResta about what’s going on with speech online in an era where platforms seem less inclined to moderate than ever. Peter’s an old friend and Renee is an expert on all this — there’s a lot of core Decoder themes in this one. Enjoy, and we’ll be back in a bit.


    Links: 

    • Channels with Peter Kafka | Apple Podcasts
    • The Stanford Internet Observatory is being dismantled | Platformer
    • A major disinformation research center’s future looks uncertain | The Verge
    • Supreme Court to hear case on how government talks to social platforms | The Verge
    • GOP targets researchers who study disinformation ahead of 2024 Election | NYT
    • She warned of ‘peer-to-peer misinformation.’ Congress listened | NYT
    • Disinformation watchdogs are under pressure. This group refuses to stop | NYT


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.


    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    6 January 2025, 10:00 am
  • 53 minutes 17 seconds
    Answering your biggest Decoder questions

    The Decoder team turns the tables on Nilay and makes him answer your burning listener questions in our end-of-year wrap up special. We also reflect on the year’s biggest Decoder themes, discuss some of the most popular feedback we’ve received, and tease what we have planned for next year. 


    Links: 

    • Here we go: The Verge now has a subscription | The Verge
    • How The Verge Works | The Vergecast
    • Intuit asked us to delete part of this Decoder episode | Decoder
    • What’s really behind Big Tech’s return-to-office mandates? | Decoder
    • Rabbit CEO Jesse Lyu isn’t thinking too far ahead | Decoder
    • Transparent Vice | The Verge
    • UiPath CEO Daniel Dines thinks automation can fight the great resignation | Decoder
    • Palmer Luckey, American Vulcan | Tablet 
    • A revolution in how robots learn | The New Yorker


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    20 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 36 minutes 28 seconds
    Tech antitrust is about to get really weird

    Today we’re talking about antitrust policy and tech, which is at a particularly weird moment as we enter the second Trump administration. A lot of tech policy is at a weird moment, actually, but antitrust might be the weirdest of them all — the pendulum has swung back and forth on antitrust policy pretty wildly over the past few years, and it’s about to swing again under Trump. So I asked Leah Nylen, an antitrust reporter for Bloomberg News and a leading expert on this subject, to come on the show and help break it all down. 


    Links: 

    • Trump’s antitrust trio heralds Big Tech crackdown to continue | Bloomberg
    • Trump picks FTC Commissioner Andrew Ferguson to lead the agency | Politico
    • Trump picks Gail Slater to head Justice Department's antitrust division | Reuters
    • Trump names Brendan Carr as his FCC leader | The Verge
    • Trump’s FTC pick promises to go after ‘censorship’ from tech companies | The Verge
    • Breaking down the DOJ’s plan to end Google’s search monopoly | The Verge
    • US v. Google redux: all the news from the ad tech trial | The Verge
    • Tech leaders kiss the ring | The Verge
    • DOJ antitrust chief is ‘overjoyed’ after Google monopoly verdict | Decoder
    • This is Big Tech’s playbook for swallowing the AI industry | Command Line


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    18 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 41 minutes 37 seconds
    Arm CEO Rene Haas on the AI chip race, Intel, and what Trump means for tech

    Alex Heath, Deputy Editor at The Verge, guest hosts this episode of Decoder featuring a live interview with Arm CEO Rene Haas about the future of AI and the semiconductor industry. The two discuss his thoughts on the struggles of Intel, the rumors Arm is developing its own AI chips to rival Nvidia’s, and his thoughts on the incoming Trump administration. 


    Links: 

    • What Arm’s CEO makes of the Intel debacle | Command Line
    • How Arm conquered the chip market without making a single chip | Decoder
    • Arm could be the unexpected winner of the AI investment boom | FT
    • Arm to reportedly launch AI chips by 2025 to capture explosive demand | CNBC
    • Intel’s CEO is out after only three years | The Verge
    • What happened to Intel? | The Verge
    • Nvidia plans ARM-based PC platform to rival Intel, AMD | DigiTimes
    • Qualcomm x Arm beef escalates | The Verge


    Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/24084728


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    16 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 53 minutes 47 seconds
    Platforms need the news, but they're killing it

    We’ve been talking a lot this year about the changing internet, and what it’s doing to the media ecosystem — particularly journalism, which has taken a backseat to creators and influencers. But the tech platforms themselves have a lot of influence over what those creators and influencers make, too. If you’re a Decoder listener, you’ll recognize this as one of my common themes — the idea that the way we distribute media directly influences the media we make. 


    To break this all down, I invited media critic and labor union president Matt Pearce on the show to discuss a great blog he wrote titled “Lessons on media policy at the slaughter-bench of history.” We get into what mechanisms can be used to fund journalism, and how building a direct audience and exercising control over distribution is more pivotal than ever. 


    Links: 


    • Lessons on media policy at the slaughter-bench of history | Matt Pearce
    • Journalism's fight for survival in a postliterate democracy | Matt Pearce
    • A deep dive into Google's shady (and shoddy) California journalism deal | Matt Pearce
    • Google Zero is here — now what? | Decoder
    • Casey Newton on surviving the great media collapse and what comes next | Decoder
    • Illusory Truth Effect | The Decision Lab
    • The people who ruined the internet | The Verge
    • Another independent site says Google killed its business | The Verge
    • Google ‘can’t guarantee’ that independent sites will recover | The Verge
    • Owner of Los Angeles Times Plans ‘Bias Meter’ Next to Coverage | NYT


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    13 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 38 minutes 1 second
    Why every company wants a podcast now

    There’s something strange happening these days in the podcast world — in particular, the way companies that deal in money have been using podcasting as not just an entertainment medium, but a unique kind of hybrid of marketing, thought leadership, and networking. Guest host David Pierce and Vulture podcast critic Nick Quah break it all down. 


    Links: 

    • How Venture Capitalists Use Podcasts to Lure in Founders | Vanity Fair
    • Your Next Podcast Interview Might Be a Meeting In Disguise | Bloomberg
    • Elliott launches podcast in attack ploy aimed at Southwest | Axios
    • How podcasts became the new battleground state | Vulture
    • In the “Podcast Election,” Trump talked to vastly more people | Edison Research
    • Podcasts become politician magnets | Axios
    • Founders of podcast ‘Acquired’ are raising an investment fund | GeekWire
    • Podcaster-turned-VC Harry Stebbings raises $400m for third fund | Sifted


    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.


    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    11 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 1 hour 17 minutes
    Microsoft AI CEO Mustafa Suleyman says conversational AI is the next web browser

    Today, I’m talking with Mustafa Suleyman, the CEO of Microsoft AI. Mustafa is a fascinating character in the world of AI — he’s been in and out of some pivotal companies like DeepMind, which he cofounded, and Google. He landed at Microsoft through a unique not-quite-acquisition deal of his latest startup, Inflection AI. 

    As CEO of Microsoft AI, Mustafa now oversees all of its consumer AI products, including the Copilot app, Bing, and even the Edge browser and MSN — two core components of the web experience that feel like they’re radically changing in a world of AI. The company has also a unique relationship with OpenAI, one that’s grown more complicated of late. That’s a lot of Decoder bait, and we really get into it. 



    Links: 

    • Google DeepMind co-founder joins Microsoft as CEO of its new AI division | The Verge
    • This is Big Tech’s playbook for swallowing the AI industry | Command Line
    • The new AI deal: buy everything but the company | NYT
    • Sam Altman lowers the bar for AGI | The Verge
    • OpenAI seeks to unlock investment by ditching ‘AGI’ clause with Microsoft | FT
    • ​​Microsoft needs to win back trust | The Verge
    • Microsoft’s AI boss thinks it’s okay to steal content if it’s on the open web | The Verge
    • Read Microsoft’s optimistic memo about the future of AI companions | The Verge
    • ​​Microsoft gives Copilot a voice and vision in its biggest redesign yet | The Verge
    • How Microsoft is thinking about the future of Copilot and AI hardware | The Verge



    Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/24078862



    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    9 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 33 minutes 59 seconds
    AI is a money pit — here’s why investors don’t mind

    AI investment is massive, but AI profits are not — and yet investors seem confident massive AI fundraising will one day translate into sizable AI profits. To break it down, Verge Deputy Editor Alex Heath guest hosts this episode of Decoder featuring Menlo Ventures partner Tim Tully and AirStreet Capital founder Nathan Benaich. 


    Links: 

    • 2024: The State of Generative AI in the Enterprise | Menlo Ventures
    • State of AI Report | Nathan Benaich
    • AI Index Report 2024 | Stanford HAL
    • How companies are spending on AI right now | Tech Brew
    • OpenAI Is growing fast and burning through piles of money | NYT
    • Amazon to invest another $4 billion in OpenAI rival Anthropic | The Verge
    • Agents are the future AI companies promise — and desperately need | The Verge
    • Anthropic’s latest AI update can use a computer on its own | The Verge
    • OpenAI reportedly plans to launch an AI agent early next year | The Verge
    • Is AI hitting a wall? | Command Line



    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    5 December 2024, 2:41 pm
  • 1 hour 10 minutes
    Rewind: Bluesky CEO Jay Graber on the future of federated social media

    Bluesky has really taken off since the election, and since the Decoder team took some time off for Thanksgiving break, we felt it was a great time to bring back the interview we did earlier this year with Jay Graber, the CEO of Bluesky, the upstart competitor to Meta’s Threads and the platform formerly known as Twitter. 


    At the time, Bluesky was a pretty small platform. It had just reached 5 million users when Jay and I spoke. But since the election, Bluesky’s growth has absolutely skyrocketed to more than 20 million users, and it's starting to put real competitive pressure on Threads at the feature level. As Bluesky really ramps up, it seemed like a great time to engage with some of the core questions behind its design and see if Jay and her team can keep it up.


    Links: 

    • Twitter’s heir apparent isn’t X or Threads — it’s Bluesky | The Verge
    • Bluesky now has more than 20 million users | The Verge
    • Bluesky moves deeper into moderation hell | The Verge
    • Twitter is funding research into a decentralized version of its platform | The Verge
    • Bluesky built a decentralized protocol for Twitter | The Verge
    • The fediverse, explained | The Verge
    • Bluesky showed everyone’s ass | The Verge
    • Can ActivityPub save the internet? | The Verge
    • Bluesky snags former Twitter/X Trust & Safety exec cut by Musk | TechCrunch
    • Protocols, Not Platforms: A Technological Approach to Free Speech — Mike Masnick


    Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/23872913


    Credits: 

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    2 December 2024, 10:00 am
  • 57 minutes 16 seconds
    GoDaddy CEO Aman Bhutani on the enduring power of the website

    I spoke with GoDaddy CEO Aman Bhutani live on stage last week at an event hosted by Alix Partners in Palo Alto. GoDaddy is one of those companies that feels tied to an earlier era, but Aman’s been CEO since 2019, and he’s been building out what he calls adjacencies.


    The business of the web has really changed in the past few years: the walled-garden, social network era really took over in the past decade, and now huge changes to Google Search and the addition of generative AI have really put a massive strain on the very foundations of the open web. So I started out by asking Aman the question I’ve asked so many other guests on Decoder in the past year: What is the point of a website in 2024?



    Links: 

    • If GoDaddy can turn the corner on sexism, who can’t? | New York Times (2017)
    • Google Zero is here – now what? | Decoder
    • Five for the Future – GoDaddy | WordPress.org
    • 2024 is shaping up to be the smallest Black Friday ever | GoDaddy
    • GoDaddy’s mission to get entrepreneurs up and running fast | Forbes
    • GoDaddy launches a suite of AI tools for small businesses | Fast Company
    • Why make a website? Squarespace CEO Anthony Casalena has ideas | Decoder
    • Wix CEO Avishai Abrahami on why the web isn’t dying after all | Decoder
    • How WordPress and Tumblr are keeping the internet weird | Decoder
    • Intuit CEO Sasan Goodarzi | Decoder



    Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/24069405



    Credits:

    Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

    Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Travis Larchuck and Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.

    The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

    25 November 2024, 12:04 pm
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