In an enthralling discussion on the archetypes, myths, and symbols within the 12-step recovery program, Kikan Massara joins Chris Grosso.

This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/beherenow and get on your way to being your best self.

This time on The Indie Spiritualist, Chris and Kikan dive into: 

• A.A. and Chris’s journey with recovery
• The ways that everyone can benefit from the 12-steps of recovery
• Living an accountable life filled with integrity
• Kikan’s work making recovery more accessible for all
• Seeing universal principles within the steps
• Admitting powerlessness and recognizing this as a human experience
• Reading through Kikan’s interpretation of all of the 12 steps
• The beauty of having a community on a recovery journey
• Turning our will over to God and learning to ask for help
• How the ego can get in the way
• Making emotional decisions and why people end up in addictive processes
• Getting well for ourselves so we can help others

Get your copy of Kikan’s book, The 12 Steps — Symbols, Myths, and Archetypes of Recovery, HERE

About Kikan Massara:

Kikan is a psychotherapist, author, and creative. A passionate researcher of consciousness studies, meditation, and emotional health, she has long used visual arts, symbols, and myths in her practice to facilitate access to the empowering resources of the inner world. Her new book, The 12 Steps — Symbols, Myths and Archetypes of Recovery was published by TASCHEN in November 2023. Learn more about Kikan on her website.

“Admit powerlessness. Who hasn’t felt powerless over something in their lives? Who hasn’t been in despair over something they couldn’t change? Who hasn’t felt like an utter failure when they couldn’t change something by willpower alone? We’re not talking about helplessness here, which is so often learned in childhood, we’re talking about just the limits of being human.” – Kikan Massara

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In a politically charged return to the Indie Spiritualist Podcast, Chris Grosso sits down with John Fugelsang to talk about finding humor as a weapon against the world's chaos.

In this episode, Chris Grosso and John Fugelsang converse about:

- Politics, the state of the world, and Joe Biden’s accomplishments

Spiritual and emotional burnout preventing us from looking at global suffering

- The frightening accuracy of post-apocalyptic movie Leave the World Behind

- Atrocities vs. benevolence committed by Christian people

- The criminalization of abortion compared to what the bible says

- Melding religions and the book The Sermon on the Mount According to Vedanta

- Similarities between Christ consciousness and the Buddha mind

- The upcoming election and America’s rejection of Donald Trump

- Finding joy in difficult times and how humor can be an act of resistance

- Loving our enemies and knowing we are not better than anyone else

- John’s in-progress book called Separation of Church and Hate

About John Fugelsang:

John Fugelsang is a New York-based political commentator, comedian, TV and radio personality, performer, and writer. He was the host of America’s Funniest Home Videos and has appeared frequently on news commentary shows on CNN, CNBC, MSNBC, Fox News, and NPR. Recently, Fugelsang was the host of Current TV’s daily show, Viewpoint, where he analyzed the news and facilitated conversations about current affairs. Currently, he hosts a daily program called “Tell Me Everything” on the new SiriusXM Insight Channel. Keep up with John on Instagram or his website.

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Legendary artists, Allyson and Alex Grey join Chris in conversation around Ram Dass, psychedelics, spirituality, and Entheon—their new visionary art sanctuary & interfaith temple.

Visionary artists, wise psychonauts, and podcasters, Allyson and Alex Grey are co-founders & Ministers of CoSM, the Chapel of Sacred Mirrors, a transformational art based non-profit which grew into an interfaith church and thriving artist community. Allyson and Alex are currently in the process of constructing Entheon, a sanctuary for visionary art, and sacred, nondenominational temple and hub for visionary artists and inner-seekers. Allyson and Alex host Sunday Art Church events, fusing creativity and dharma; as well as Full Moon Gatherings, which bring together artists, musicians, wisdom teachers, and free-thinkers to honor our cosmic alignment with nature and the creative forces. For a deep dive into their minds, check out their new podcast, The CoSM Podcast, and for updates on Entheon, CoSM, their art and events, visit their website CoSM.org

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Chris Grosso welcomes director Sebastian Siegel for a conversation about his new movie, Grace and Grit, which is based on the book by philosopher Ken Wilber. 

Sebastian Siegel is a British-American director, producer, screenwriter and author. His modes of storytelling range from filmmaking to contemporary art and psychology. His latest movie, Grace and Grit, is now available to stream on Amazon, Apple TV, YouTube, Google Play, and more. Learn more about Sebastian and his work at sebastiansiegel.com, and be sure to follow him on Instagram. 

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Hardcore Zen master, Brad Warner, rejoins Chris for a talk on death, discernment, cosmic meaning, Zen Buddhism, and making sure your crazy wisdom isn't too crazy.

Brad Warner is the author of Letters to a Dead Friend About Zen and numerous other titles including Don't Be a Jerk, Hardcore Zen, and Sit Down and Shut Up: Punk Rock Commentaries on Buddha, God, Truth, Sex, Death, and Dogen's Treasury of the Right Dharma Eye. A Soto Zen teacher, he is a punk bassist, filmmaker, and popular blogger who leads workshops and retreats around the world. In addition to his books, his writing appears in Lion's Roar, Tricycle, Buddhadharma, and Alternative Press. He lives in Los Angeles where he's the founder and lead teacher of the Angel City Zen Center. You can learn more about Brad at HardcoreZen.info

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Dr. Christian Conte joins Chris to share life lessons on knowing yourself, stepping towards conflict, facing wounds, emptying your cup, understanding, and walking through anger with non-attachment.

Dr. Christian Conte is one of the country’s most accomplished mental health specialists in the field of anger and emotional management. A familiar figure on TV and radio, he is also a prolific writer, powerful communicator, and sought-after media expert. He was co-host of Coaching Bad and The Secret Life of Kids, and was the resident therapist for Family Therapy. Dr. Conte produces daily Emotional Management Minutes for over 300 radio stations, as well as hosting his own weekly show in Pittsburgh. He discussed his prison outreach in the TEDx talk, “Why I Chose to Go to Prison.' His latest book, "Walking Through Anger" is out now. For more info, please visit, Dr.ChristianConte.com

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Author Laura McKowen talks with Chris Grosso about the process of addiction and recovery, her resistance to defining herself as an alcoholic, and working with guilt and shame.

Laura McKowen is the author of We Are The Luckiest: The Surprising Magic of a Sober Life. She had a successful career in public relations and the Mad Men–esque drinking culture of advertising. After getting sober, Laura became recognized as a fresh voice in recovery, beloved for her soulful and irreverent writing online and in print. She now leads sold-out retreats and courses, teaching people how to say yes to a bigger life. Learn more about her at lauramckowen.com.

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Bestselling author, Gary Renard, joins Chris to discuss training the mind, Jesus’ and Buddha’s lifetimes together, and how to communicate with the Holy Spirit.

Gary R. Renard is the best-selling author of The Disappearance of the Universe, Your Immortal Reality, Love Has Forgotten No One, and the newly released The Lifetimes When Jesus and Buddha Knew Each Other. Gary is a winner of the Infinity Foundation Spirit Award, among the likes of Ram Dass, Byron Katie, and Neale Donald Walsch; and has been featured on Gaia TV‘s, “Open Minds.” Combining a disarming sense of humor with radical, cutting-edge metaphysical information and experiential exercises, Gary is well versed and well traveled in the spiritual community. For more info visit www.GaryRenard.com

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Legendary hip-hop artist, R.A. The Rugged Man joins Chris to talk about writing albums, emotions and mental health, how storytelling can heal traumas, and how to stay true to yourself.

R.A. The Rugged Man is one of the most fascinating figures in hip-hop history. His career spans decades, and defies simple narratives. The Rugged Man has been an up-and-coming star, an industry outcast banished and forgotten, an underground cult hero, an independent success story, and an influential master of the art form. Check out his newest album All My Heroes Are Dead, and for more music, blogs, and offerings, visit his website RAtheRuggedMan.net

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Musician and writer, Norman Brannon joins Chris to discuss his Hare Krishna punk music past, & share how we can find skeptical euphoria by moving beyond our stories.

Over the last 25 years, Norman Brannon has worked as a musician, critic, author, DJ, university lecturer, television host, documentary filmmaker, marketing creative, and record label manager. Although best known for cofounding Texas is The Reason, he first made his mark in hardcore punk bands like Shelter and 108, and capped his performance career with New End Original and Gratitude. He is also the author of the Anti-Matter Anthology, a 1990s post-punk and hardcore reader featuring work that originally ran in Alternative Press, Vibe, and Anti-Matter, his very own seminal fan-zine. Norman is currently working on an expanded second edition of the Anti-Matter Anthology, in addition to a second book that examines the relationship between queer language, ethnicity, and his own personal story. Norman lives in Brooklyn with his partner John and their Dotson.

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Inspirational underground hip-hop artist, Sage Francis, joins Chris to discuss music as a teacher, the resonance of truth, cultural shifts, and the magic of writing.

Sage Francis is CEO of Strange Famous Records, and half of the Epic Beard Men. He is widely considered one of our generation's greatest lyricists. His gifted wordplay creates vivid narratives to instigate as well as inspire, often deriving from an accumulation of public disdain and personal turmoil. Dubbed the forefather of Indie Hop, Francis originally earned worldwide acclaim in the 2000s by winning highly coveted titles in the MC battle circuit. At the advent of file-sharing, Francis' unique brand of music spread like wildfire and he gained a cult following. In 2005 Sage Francis was the first hip-hop artist signed to Epitaph Records and soon became one of the highest selling independent artists of his genre. Sage Francis has returned to releasing music independently and has a podcast in the works. For more info check out StrangeFamousRecords.com

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